Expanded Simple Delivery to be optional

[papso22]

Please read the updated User Agreement effective 17th March.

Also see that Packlink will still be involved in clothing categories and some others.

[jckl1957]

Indeed.

I provided the links as they were asked for.

It's definitely a case of 'watch this space'.

However, until it is not optional, it is optional!

[goodibags]

I agree. It's nonsense. The seller 'purchases the label from the delivery service provider'... and yet 'any costs you owe to the delivery service provider are paid by the buyer' ?

So who gets the refund if this label isn't used because the seller chose a different courier?

So much for 'Ebay Managed Postage' when they're the one party not getting involved.

More like Ebay Completely Side-stepped Postage.

[porte2425]

Yes, it definitely seems like eBay are putting themselves in a win-win situation with Simple Delivery.
Unless, of course, it drives buyers and sellers away, like it may well do.

[andha-21]

I haven't looked into it in detail but I glimpsed a thread earlier and it looked like someone had proof of an extra £2 charge on one of their sales.

From what I saw it was an unknown extra. Don't know if anyone worked it out yet.

[goodibags]

As long as SD remains optional it'll be used by those sellers who don't mind it and opted out of by those who do.

If it becomes mandatory and these issues around choosing and paying for an agreed level of service and preferred courier come to the fore many users will not be happy at how they're being treated. 

And if the process is perceived to be unfair by cheating either side out of monies paid up front in good faith with no possibility of a refund there's a risk it may be completely unworkable.

[porte2425]

Agreed. But my testing shows it's already unworkable in some areas. Combined postage seems to be a mess.

https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Buying/Simple-Delivery-and-letters-clarification-needed-please/m-p/7...

[goodibags]

I saw that one. The buyer fee was £2.40 in total but for some reason the invoice showed a £2 charge and then a separate 40p VAT under that. Not sure why VAT was shown separately but the total charge (on £42) looked correct.

[goodibags]

There has to be an 'opt-out' button when that happens.

Or some equivalent to 'Hyperspace' in the Asteroids arcade game.

[porte2425]

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@goodibags wrote:

I saw that one. The buyer fee was £2.40 in total but for some reason the invoice showed a £2 charge and then a separate 40p VAT under that. Not sure why VAT was shown separately but the total charge (on £42) looked correct.

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Because the buyer fee charge is from eBay (or possibly their payment provider) and they are liable to pay VAT – so it will show the VAT breakdown cost against the charge.

That reminds me, I saw the same thing recently when I bought an item - it threw me at first. Then I realised that the seller used Simple Delivery. Surely that is an indicator that eBay is buying the label from the courier, not the seller, if it includes VAT!

[valueaddedresource]

@papso22 I hate to rain on your parade but I wouldn't celebrate just yet.

Nothing in the UA section about Simple Delivery changed when comparing the February 4th version to the March 17th version - all of that text is exactly the same.

Side by side comparison using a difference checker (if anything had been deleted, it would be highlighted in red, anything added would be highlighted in green, nothing highlighted means nothing changed.)

As you point out, it then links to the existing Simple Delivery page which does still say you can opt out, but that could still potentially change as CEO Jamie Iannone has said it will become mandatory sometime in Q1 and there's still a bit of Q1 left.

And....one of the other changes they *did* make says they only have to give 15 day notice of changes to the UA instead of the previous 30 days so they could definitely still change any terms about SD before the end of the quarter within that timeframe.

I'll be going through to see what did actually change in more details in a bit but for now, I would say nothing has actually changed about SD at this point and it's still up in the air whether or not they will stick with what the CEO said or not.

[goodibags]

I guess if there is a VAT charge on SD it proves that Ebay MUST be 'managing' something.

Even if all it amounts to is applying some debits and credits to a pot of sale proceeds?

[andha-21]

To me it looks like they are trying to hide the business side of the BPF. It's such a strange system to implement if I understand it correctly.

If you can't buy from a private seller without paying BPF to eBay that makes the business side the main condition of sale.

So taking that further

If it is a business sale, then consumers gain rights, many of them purchase protection related.

At that point it's questionable as to whether eBay are defrauding the customer, making them pay for rights they already have.

& all because they implemented BPF. 

It's like a snake biting it's own tail.

All I can think is they didn't think anyone would spot it.

[andha-21]

& after that there's another area I started looking at earlier. If my logic above is correct, that makes every sale a business sale, so they are making all sellers businesses by default. & that's where I started getting tired earlier. 

It's such a strange system. I can't fathom how they thought this was a better/easier system to implement than just raising private seller fees.

[porte2425]

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@andha-21 wrote:

It's such a strange system. I can't fathom how ...

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That is the best answer you're going to arrive at. Save your self any further headache 🤣

[andha-21]

No, I'm fairly certain I'm bang on the money with the first part. 

The second part gets hazy because there are so many plausible ramifications.

[lillyputt6]

Hopefully it will remain optional.

I see that the CEO has said it will become mandatory at some point.

Apparently home pick ups will not be possible under Smple Delivery.

All of my parcels are collected from my home by Royal Mail and sent 48 hour tracked. The reason for this is that I have a condition that causes mobility issues (they will not get better) and  I do not drive. I cannot walk the one mile return trip to the village Post Office,and  I am certainly  not paying the £12  return taxi fare to post.

Again the Evri collection point is around a mile return trip,and quite frankly is useless, usually manned by temporary staff who do not know how to process a parcel.(that is if the scanner is working).

Then of course ther are those sellers who are quite fit and able but simply do not have the drop off points within a reasonable distance of their home, maybe because they live in remote areas.

Not particularly  well thought out !

[district-001]

Maybe missing something  but after March if SD becomes mandatory how can a buyer select a postage option if the item is listed as free postage, EG already included in the price ?.

[andha-21]

It doesn't look like they considered disabilities in Simple Delivery which is odd because I thought there were "discrimination" rules regarding that. Not sure if "discrimination" is the right word, but think it's similar.

[porte2425]

Someone on another topic a little while ago did say that apparently there are plans on adding home collection from Royal Mail to SD. I can't provide any evidence of this though.

[valueaddedresource]

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@porte2425 wrote:

Someone on another topic a little while ago did say that apparently there are plans on adding home collection from Royal Mail to SD. I can't provide any evidence of this though.

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@porte2425  - it's on this policy page:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/managing-returns-refunds/handle-return-request-seller?id=4115

Apparently collection is/will be available for Royal Mail, but you have to book it yourself.