HMRC data sharing

[charliestell]

Can someone confirm when they have stated "starting January 1st 2024" they will being to share all data with HMRC does that mean that all sales starting from Jan 1st 2024 will be shared in the new format? I know historically that they have shared data but is this new rule in relation to all sales from 1st Jan 24 or everything historically?

I'm not a master criminal or a huge fraudster I literally sell £200 - £300 a month on here so think I may be over this limit and fear a taxman letter. 

[papso22]

That sounds likely.  It's a slightly weird thing to ask and sounds like you are trying to avoid tax!

[jaws30342015]

Just let them know about your selling .but if you opened up your business
say in may this year you won't fill.in a tax return until the following
year. But you need to let hmrc know about what you are doing still

[greasy_9]

My sales are not taxable as they are my personal possessions and will be under £1000 anyway.

Nonetheless not being reported is preferable to being reported and not having to tell ebay my NI number is preferable to telling them.

I will have 29 sales in 2024 so might as well delay relisting my unsold items by a week.

[lucy_farmer]

'......and not having to tell ebay my NI number is preferable to telling them.'

I rather thought that ebay will be asking for *every* sellers NINO regardless of whether or not they go over the £1700/30 items limit?  .... at least that's the impression I got.

[theelench]

That's the impression I got as well and it's ebay's preferred MO to jump at any opportunity to suck up more personal data from as many sellers as possible.

I distinctly remember one thread where I asked if I could give them my UTR (from my SE days) instead and if not, why not.

The consensus was definitely that all private sellers would have to hand it over or stop selling before the end of this year.

Ebay certainly didn't say anything to contradict that take on the subject, but then ebay rarely tells the whole story about anything.

So, as 1/1/25 got nearer and foreseeing ebay launching into another round of "We're holding your funds until you do as you're told and hand it over",  I stopped listing to prevent any possibility of having any funds being held.

I've seen one or two comments by sellers who have been asked for their NINO because they've gone over one of the thresholds and one seller who opened a new private account said they were asked for it.  Other than that, not a peep.

I never bother with all the hassle of trying to sell around Christmas while ebay keeps giving buyers its FDDs and causing sellers so much grief, but I'll play the New Year by ear.  I might list an item or two, but the first time I see a comment about "Funds on Hold until I give ebay my NINO", that will be it for me.

On the other hand if ebay is only going to ask sellers when they go over a threshold, I might still be here this time next year, as I haven't managed to sell 30 items in a year for at least 5 years.  Or at least until ebay makes the details of its latest bout of insanity clearer and how Compulsory Simple Delivery will work.

That's what I love about ebay, the uncertainty, the impossibility of planning anything, the feeling that at any moment the ground can disappear from under my feet and I'll be plunged into an abyss.  It makes my selling experience such a pleasure.

[lucy_farmer]

'.....That's what I love about ebay, the uncertainty, the impossibility of planning anything, the feeling that at any moment the ground can disappear from under my feet and I'll be plunged into an abyss.  It makes my selling experience such a pleasure'

😂😂

I'm so glad I don't have to rely on any money coming in from ebay.  But I have started to ask myself why I have a *hobby* that produces so much stress!  

I think I'll take up Base Jumping or absailing instead, ; much less stressfull..

[meleksale]

Government Tax Greed.

[synthesiser666]

I'm confused having just had an official letter from HMRC asking for my details and selling figures -I am  a private ebayer who only buys things to try and usually end up selling them ( for a loss LOL ) or a minor profit -HMRC are asking for proof of funds over the one thousand threshold -is that profit or item value during the tax year? They have also said I could need to provide sales details going back 20 years !  Of course I cant even remember sales a year ago let alone 20 years ago -it does seem that BIG BROTHER is now scrutinizing every normal average person living in the UK --maybe they should start taxing some of the giant businesses that manage to avoid paying any tax.  I'm definitely thinking of closing my personal ebay account as I really dislike this sort of intrusion into my life 

[sml192]

The £1,000 threshold relates to turnover not profit, so the total value of the sales.  It is a trading allowance for small businesses and doesn't apply to the sale of personal possessions.

If you are only selling unwanted personal possessions then there would be no tax to pay.   I obviously don't know why HMRC are asking questions about your sales but I suspect the fact that you have sold several phones may have something to do with it. 

[the_book_seekers]

It'll be the phones and cameras that will have attracted HMRC's attention. It sounds like they think you are a business. That £1000 figure is turnover and before deductions such as postage and ebay fees. It racks up quickly. I'd be concerned about the mention of 20 years as HMRC can go back through a persons finances over this length of time if tax evasion is suspected. I'd also be checking that this is a genuine letter as there are so many scams around HMRC. 

[ett1954]

@synthesiser666   As has been stated by others, it is almost certainly the sustained selling of the phones, cameras, watches, etc which has brought you to the attention of HMRC and resulted in the letter you have received. 

Have you had an email from eBay since the beginning of this year detailing a report of your sales income for 2024 which they have provided to HMRC?  All digital platforms now have to report annual sales income once they reach a certain criteria but they are required to send you a copy of the report passed to HMRC.  I am not aware that eBay have yet submitted reports - if they had I am sure these boards would have been very active on the matter; however I am sure that is to come shortly once these reports have been submitted.

It could be that you have been reported to HMRC's hotline by a competitor, someone you have fallen out with, or even an envious 'friend'. 

No one on these boards can advise you what to do with any certainty .  I would suggest however that you don't ignore the letter and once you have verified it is genuine (this can be done by cross checking any phone numbers and email addresses against those on HMRC's website) that you seek advice from a qualified accountant.  Can you can prove that all these items were for personnel use?  Selling boxed new items might be difficult but again an accountant may be able to give you an honest professional appraisal here.

As HMRC will probably know what your income is (they may have already requested that information from eBay even if eBay hasn't already submitted it), be truthful on any information you declare to an accountant or HMRC themselves.  Finally if you have any information regarding the purchase of your items, receipts, credit card and bank statements etc - hang on to them they could be useful, especially if they show items were purchased more than six months before the item was offered for sale.

[gladrn2005]

That's my query what you've said about the 30 limit or do you then have to register as a business seller , no one has covered that issue as yet - so not quite clear here is it. Does anyone know? 

[jaws30342015]

Register for self assessment

[wintersdawn1]

• If you are selling unwanted personal possessions such as old toys or clothes, this would not be classed as trading or miscellaneous income, and there is usually no tax to pay. In some circumstances there may be capital gains tax when selling valuable items such as jewellery, this is covered in our flowchart.

https://www.litrg.org.uk/news/selling-online-make-sure-you-keep-clear-records

Do I have to share information with HMRC?

From January 2024, new UK digital sales reporting rules require digital platforms like eBay to share information with them. However, this reporting doesn’t change your tax obligations.

On eBay, this should only affect newly registered accounts in 2024, which will extend to all accounts in 2025.

eBay will only report if you pass certain yearly sales thresholds:

• If your total sales on eBay exceed €2000, or roughly £1740, after fees.

• If you complete 30 or more sales transactions on eBay.

In general, selling personal items is not taxed if they’re below £6,000 and you’re not selling as part of a business.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sellercentre/selling/selling-online-and-hmrc

[vintique*violet]

Thank you again @wintersdawn1 

 I love that flowchart 😉 

[vintique*violet]

You do not have to register as a business if you are not trading.

If you are selling your personal possessions, you are not classed as a trader and do not require an eBay business account.

Trading means, buying or making things to sell with the intention to make a "profit" 

Those figures are the reporting rules for eBay to adhere to and pass on your details to HMRC... Your tax responsibilities have not changed. 

winterdawn1 has just posted an informative post you may wish to take a look at... this information was sourced from eBay and Litrg...If you click on the flowchart link it gives further info. Also you can check HMRC under online selling goods and services or search for that post on this forum. 

[adtan-23]

Yeah & if they suspect someone of tax avoidance, fraud or money laundering hmrc can go back 10 years or more

[wattiesdad]

I've had the HMRC letter, so I decided to trawl through my previous sales, and WOW!, I had no idea it was that much. I started collecting coins years ago, and when I had bought some, any I didn't need I would sell. This escalated during covid . My issue is that it is nigh on impossible to get the historic data from ebay, I asked over w week ago and still nothing, I tried asking again (request your eBay data page) but it says pending so I can't submit another request. My queries are- if I have made so many sales, why didn't eBay make me a business seller (I'm private) ? How long does it take for eBay to send the data after a request? Are HMRC able to see what I can't see?

[papso22]

Had ebay already asked for your national insurance number?  If so, then they might have sent the data already and HMRC will have contacted you based on that information.

Ebay are notoriously bad at selecting who to 'invite' to upgrade, the question you need to ask yourself is whether you are a business seller or not.  HMRC don't really care what sort of account you have, although business accounts not declaring tax might be treated as having knowledge that they are a business and more questions might be asked.

There should be a report available in your account that shows what has been sent to HMRC, if anything, but they will have access to other, non ebay, data.  

I don't know if they would have access to historic ebay data that you don't have access to, I should  think not because the data probably no longer exists.

[adtan-23]

Hmrc can request data going back as far as they wish if they have
suspicion you have tried to evade tax & you are legally bound to have kept
records for it was 7 years now it's 10 years otherwise you are liable to an
estimate of tax liability & potentially a huge fine