This unfolding tragedy around Europe

We pay politicians to act on our behalf, throughout Europe and the rest of the developed world the plight of those fleeing war, famine, religious persecution etc is being ignored. Surely it is not beyond the realms of sensibility for us to expect, even demand a collective humane response by the international community to agree action in those countries where terrorists reign. Allowing and encouraging the victims to flee is wrong, they deserve and should be given the right to live peacefully where they were born and like the rest of us have the freedom to travel abroad and see other cultures. The Russians and Chinese stand by and watch while quietly selling weapons to these terrorists. The west interfered yet never considered the impact they would have. It is time the UN grew up and did what it was formed to do.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@bookhunter2007 wrote:

@tommy.irene wrote:

@tommy.irene wrote:
On the BBC News we saw them throw the water back at the Police when they tried to feed them on the train..
http://shoebat.com/2015/09/04/muslim-invaders-posing-as-refugees-are-throwing-away-food-and-water-gi...

Thanks for the link. It's refreshing to see the same videos with different titles of varying hyperbole. Did Shoebat's link persuade you to embrace Jesus btw?

 

This is like "Guns 'n' God"  Bingo.  Anyone got a link from Terry Jones and a quote from the Phelps family for a full-house? Or maybe even President Trump?

 

#StopTheWorldIWantToGetOff


.. Its the same video the BBC used on the news. looks like they copied it..
......................................................................................................................................................................................................... .................Im a 76 year old Nutcase.. TOMMY LOVES YOU ALL. .. I'm a committed atheist.
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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

I think that should read' anyone who lives outside it would be ANY the wiser'....😊

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@bookhunter2007 wrote:
but if I'd been kettled and manhandled by the pigs for hours in the pouring rain, getting a swig of water wouldn't exactly be a priority for me either.

 They wouldn't have been a need for any kettling or manhandling if they weren't forcibly and illegally in a foreign country, would there.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@astrologica wrote:

I think that should read' anyone who lives outside it would be ANY the wiser'....😊


I really don't care. The fact we're all snuggled up in our safe homes, discussing such trivialities kind puts into perspective how lucky we are.

 


@mikes*corvettes wrote:

 They wouldn't have been a need for any kettling or manhandling if they weren't forcibly and illegally in a foreign country, would there.



I don't know. I've never fled a warzone or cramped, disease-ridden refugee camp carrying my children, whilst being chased by baton-wielding police, and being kicked by employees from Jobbik's TV outlet. You?
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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@bookhunter2007 wrote:

@astrologica wrote:

I think that should read' anyone who lives outside it would be ANY the wiser'....😊


I really don't care. The fact we're all snuggled up in our safe homes, discussing such trivialities kind puts into perspective how lucky we are.

 


@mikes*corvettes wrote:

 They wouldn't have been a need for any kettling or manhandling if they weren't forcibly and illegally in a foreign country, would there.



I don't know. I've never fled a warzone or cramped, disease-ridden refugee camp carrying my children, whilst being chased by baton-wielding police, and being kicked by employees from Jobbik's TV outlet. You?

Nice attempt at defletion, but it won't wash.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

Anonymous
Not applicable

And that's the best reason you can come up with?

 

 

 

 

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@mikes*corvettes wrote:

 


Nice attempt at defletion, but it won't wash.


Deflection from what? BUF-type rhetoric based on Chinese Whispers and narrowcasting.


@Anonymous wrote:

And that's the best reason you can come up with?


No. As i've pointed out,  I've never fled a warzone or cramped, disease-ridden refugee camp carrying my children, whilst being chased by baton-wielding police, and being kicked by employees from Jobbik's TV outlet.

 

Besides, if I was in your shoes, i'd be more concerned my daughter was sharing Britain First type posts on social media, rather than what a group of desperate people may or may not be doing with a bottle of water 2000 miles away. To put that into context, 6.5 million people have been displaced from Syria - 2.2 million spilling over into Turkey alone. I think this issue extends a bit further than some random altercation involving a couple of dozen people.

 

Scary thing is, if we were discussing a boat load of puppies from China, folks here would be climbing over themselves to help.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@bookhunter2007 wrote:

@mikes*corvettes wrote:

 


Nice attempt at defletion, but it won't wash.


Deflection from what? BUF-type rhetoric based on Chinese Whispers and narrowcasting.


@Anonymous wrote:

And that's the best reason you can come up with?


No. As i've pointed out,  I've never fled a warzone or cramped, disease-ridden refugee camp carrying my children, whilst being chased by baton-wielding police, and being kicked by employees from Jobbik's TV outlet.

 

Besides, if I was in your shoes, i'd be more concerned my daughter was sharing Britain First type posts on social media, rather than what a group of desperate people may or may not be doing with a bottle of water 2000 miles away. To put that into context, 6.5 million people have been displaced from Syria - 2.2 million spilling over into Turkey alone. I think this issue extends a bit further than some random altercation involving a couple of dozen people.

 

Scary thing is, if we were discussing a boat load of puppies from China, folks here would be climbing over themselves to help.


That was what came to mind when I read the following comment earlier in the thread - "Every day in the press there are photos of cute wide eyed refugee children to tug at our heartstrings, it's almost a charm offensive to soften us up, Well I for one am not buying into it"

 

Change "refugee children" to "abandoned puppies" in that sentence and you can imagine the indignant response that would bring forth!

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

Indeed. And anyone who suggested that Afghan Hounds and German Shepherds should all be removed from kennels and pushed in boats back out to sea would be crucified. After all, our bulldogs should come first, shouldn't they?

 

This is what happens when our gutter press anthropomorphises, whilst simultaneously dehumanising refugees as "cockroaches".

 

http://i100.independent.co.uk/article/maybe-the-daily-express-should-treat-human-beings-the-same-way...

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

Oh Dear, we now reduce this to a choice between a litter of puppies or a swarm of refugees. 

In Germany thousands of refugees have arrived, crammed into sports halls and other public buildings awaiting permanent accommodation and a new life. They have a substantially larger land mass in which to house the refugees than we do and a better infrastructure. Our hospitals, schools and surgeries are under huge pressure and whilst it would be possible to have an open door policy I wonder what the final impact on this small Island would be. Britain has taken in newcomers for centuries it hasn't always been easy, some have integrated well while others hang on to old identities. What I am clear on in my own mind is that senseless personal comment to those you disagree with and attempts to shame animal lovers is simply crass and inflamatory.

This challenge will only be addressed by a coming together of nations prepared to assist the root cause  and offer a real future for them in their own lands. 

And finally let us also try and share this planet with the other species who we are currently pushing toward extinction. There is no shortage of human beings we are growing at an unsustainable rate but hey who cares?

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@bookhunter2007 wrote:

@mikes*corvettes wrote:

 


Nice attempt at defletion, but it won't wash.


Deflection from what? BUF-type rhetoric based on Chinese Whispers and narrowcasting.


@Anonymous wrote:

And that's the best reason you can come up with?


No. As i've pointed out,  I've never fled a warzone or cramped, disease-ridden refugee camp carrying my children, whilst being chased by baton-wielding police, and being kicked by employees from Jobbik's TV outlet.

 

Besides, if I was in your shoes, i'd be more concerned my daughter was sharing Britain First type posts on social media, rather than what a group of desperate people may or may not be doing with a bottle of water 2000 miles away. To put that into context, 6.5 million people have been displaced from Syria - 2.2 million spilling over into Turkey alone. I think this issue extends a bit further than some random altercation involving a couple of dozen people.

 

Scary thing is, if we were discussing a boat load of puppies from China, folks here would be climbing over themselves to help.


 


@upthecreekyetagain wrote:

@bookhunter2007 wrote:

@mikes*corvettes wrote:

 


Nice attempt at defletion, but it won't wash.


Deflection from what? BUF-type rhetoric based on Chinese Whispers and narrowcasting.


@Anonymous wrote:

And that's the best reason you can come up with?


No. As i've pointed out,  I've never fled a warzone or cramped, disease-ridden refugee camp carrying my children, whilst being chased by baton-wielding police, and being kicked by employees from Jobbik's TV outlet.

 

Besides, if I was in your shoes, i'd be more concerned my daughter was sharing Britain First type posts on social media, rather than what a group of desperate people may or may not be doing with a bottle of water 2000 miles away. To put that into context, 6.5 million people have been displaced from Syria - 2.2 million spilling over into Turkey alone. I think this issue extends a bit further than some random altercation involving a couple of dozen people.

 

Scary thing is, if we were discussing a boat load of puppies from China, folks here would be climbing over themselves to help.


That was what came to mind when I read the following comment earlier in the thread - "Every day in the press there are photos of cute wide eyed refugee children to tug at our heartstrings, it's almost a charm offensive to soften us up, Well I for one am not buying into it"

 

Change "refugee children" to "abandoned puppies" in that sentence and you can imagine the indignant response that would bring forth!


Here we go again, the standard retort by bleeding heart liberals about anyone who has an opposing view, they must be anti-islamic extremists or animal loving nuts.

After all I'm the one who's made a big song and dance about a horse.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

and being kicked by employees from jobbiks outlet-  and the odds of that are ?

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@start-the-fire wrote:

and being kicked by employees from jobbiks outlet-  and the odds of that are ?


I'd say quite high if you happen to be a Jew, Muslim, Gypsy, or refugee.

 

http://www.channel4.com/news/hungary-jobbik-far-right-militias-jewish-congress

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@bookhunter2007 wrote:

@start-the-fire wrote:

and being kicked by employees from jobbiks outlet-  and the odds of that are ?


I'd say quite high if you happen to be a Jew, Muslim, Gypsy, or refugee.

 

http://www.channel4.com/news/hungary-jobbik-far-right-militias-jewish-congress


One journalist from a far right group, and you say its quite high, at the moment i would say that is extremely unlikely, unless you can produce more proof that these refugees are being systematically kicked by members of jobbiks.

 

Its not that i disagreed with your post, just as with most journal sensitisation things do tend to get blown out of proportion, in the tabloids and to a lesser extent on these forums.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

Actually the human race isn't growing at an unsustainable rate....

 

if its vs economy you might be right ,so the economy is set up wrong ...the problem of feeding and housing the worlds people is supposed to be the problem leaders of the world deal with (why are they leaders of the world one might ask if they cannot see this )...its big enough planet ,its food resource is by far large enough too ..so what is the problem.

 

Oh yes boarders and nations and human billionaires that need somewhere to call their home of course ...Ask for volunteer's from round the world to help build /set up places that can house and feed and keep warm people (think giant housing estates) and it would happen,ask the resources to be manufactured and given (many would the decent non greedy ones)  

 

Now ask for energy companies to be run free ,wont happen because that's where your economy is tied up in knots ,that's who politicians and leaders work for that's who pay for everyone on the planet in pretty little notes and that's how the economy works.

 

 The planet can house about 35 billion people easily with co operation of the species...the oil spots however (big big important bits of earth) is struggling to cope with 6 billion...

why the earth creates enough food and water and shelter to sustain life of a zillion creatures but only creates enough oil, diamonds and gold  for  100 greedy monkey controlling freaks  is unbelievable and downright disrespectful of it..does it not know who 'WE' are and how important 'WE' are .....lol  If the 'WE blow us all up to stay in the economy ,then please be assured the race is not growing at an unsustainable rate...the spenders are 🙂

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I'm sure you are right!

Well I think I am 🙂
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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@fallen-archie wrote:

Oh Dear, we now reduce this to a choice between a litter of puppies or a swarm of refugees. 

In Germany thousands of refugees have arrived, crammed into sports halls and other public buildings awaiting permanent accommodation and a new life. They have a substantially larger land mass in which to house the refugees than we do and a better infrastructure. Our hospitals, schools and surgeries are under huge pressure and whilst it would be possible to have an open door policy I wonder what the final impact on this small Island would be. Britain has taken in newcomers for centuries it hasn't always been easy, some have integrated well while others hang on to old identities. What I am clear on in my own mind is that senseless personal comment to those you disagree with and attempts to shame animal lovers is simply crass and inflamatory.

This challenge will only be addressed by a coming together of nations prepared to assist the root cause  and offer a real future for them in their own lands. 

And finally let us also try and share this planet with the other species who we are currently pushing toward extinction. There is no shortage of human beings we are growing at an unsustainable rate but hey who cares?


I agree wholeheartedly with everything Archie has said,  particularly the comment about establishing a future for these people in their own countries. On the whole the people fleeing the war in Syria are not poor in an economic sense, they have had the wherewithal to to handover five grand apiece to people smugglers to get them out of the country. I don't regard myself as poor but I'd struggle to lay my hands on that much cash in an emergency, if I had a young family I'd be completely up the creek.

 

All the so called refugees that I've seen interviewed keep reinforcing the view that they are not benefit scroungers but well educated and highly trained doctors, dentists, engineers, IT consultants etc. That may be just what we in the West want to hear but even if true, these are just the sort of people who will be needed to rebuild their countries in the future if and when things ever return to some level of normality. Instead, as usual, the poor and uneducated masses are the ones left behind to contend with the brain drain from their country, the same ones who will be more submisive to the likes of Assad, ISIS and the like. These are the people in most need of help, not the wealthy fleeing the sinking ships throughout the Middle East.

 

If a similar thing happened here in the UK and you had the means to escape wouldn't you try to flee to a country that had a similar culture and held similar views and beliefs to your own? This is what these thousands of refugees should be doing, moving half way around the world and trying to assimilate into several different countries each with their own unique cultural identity has no benefit for either side. 

 

As to whether we can handle a further increase in population, almost every country in the EU is in a better position to help than we are. Net migration to the UK was 330,000 in the last 12 months, we have a shortfall in housebuilding of around 250,000 a year, we already have 185,000 people who are officially classed as homeless and close to 3,000 of them will be spending this coming Christmas on the streets. Do the math as they say.

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

Anonymous
Not applicable

Having a dig at my daughter is a bit sad to be honest. Her reading something on FB and telling me about it is not any different than the discussion we're having on this thread, posting links to newspaper articles etc....

 

 

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe


@fallen-archie wrote:
I'm sure you are right!

Well I think I am 🙂


exactly 🙂

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Re: This unfolding tragedy around Europe

If a similar thing happened here, and I were a young person, I like to think I would fight for my country, and not run away. Where would this country be if my forbears, and probably yours, had run away during WW1 and WW2. 

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