Should Faith/Religion Have Such a High Value In Our Society?

[lambsy_uk]

I'm not here to trample all over people's faith/beliefs but to ask if/why such beliefs should hold such high value in our society?

So where am I comming from? Well we can freely question almost anything in our society/lives; morals, political beliefs, actions and reactions, motivations, interactions, foreign policy, education, welfare, how we raise our children, law and order and so on..........

However we are positively discouraged from questioning people's faith/beliefs/religion! We are also actively encouraged to accommodate and allow for people's religious beliefs, and this is the bit that really irks me! Why is it that if something is done in the name of a religious belief/practice then we are expected to accept it with little fuss where if any other excuse were used we'd be up in arms?

We endure arguments of whether animal rights should take precedence over religion, whether saving the life of a child should take precedence over their parent's beliefs, should freedom of expression take precedence over religious sensitivities?

For me you may as well base stuff on the football team you support;

"I can't comply with the company dress code because I'm a United fan and therefore I must be allowed to wear a United shirt at work."

As far as I'm concerned this is no more ridiculous than anything done/not done in the name of religious beliefs!

So why do religious beliefs hold such high status and is it right that they do?

[rose2008-2008]

And yes before anyone kindly picks up on it i did say i believed Not in God as a single Entity,, but a God of some sort i know not what!!!!.

[kh-enas]

Hi everyone,

I'd like to kindly remind you to refrain from interpersonal disputes as they go against our Community Values & Board Usage Policy.

Thanks 🙂

Enas

Community Moderator

[rose2008-2008]

Thanks Moderator!!!!.

[bankhaunter]

The quote in your link was a little selective, it missed this bit

13  He will have pity on the lowly and the poor, And the lives of the poor he will save.

Is this a demonstration of that salvation?  http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MV6P19SuHN8

It is very clear that it is not God's fault at all. Satan is the instigator of all that is wrotten in this world, God is the one cleaning it up a putting things right.

So it was Satan that actually created the world then, the one that designed the weather systems that go to cause famines, tectonic plates that slowly move causing earthquakes and tsunamis and not God?

Was it Satan that split mankind into different tribes that then fought for territory? “If as one people speaking the same language they have begun to do this, then nothing they plan to do will be impossible for them. 7 Come, let us go down and confuse their language so they will not understand each other.”

And didn't God promote and order the slaughter of other tribes and those in certain cities out of little more than jealousy. Kill all the inhabitants of any city where you find people that worship differently than you.  Deuteronomy 13:12-16

Bank by your own way of reasoning, If God created all then he is behind the emergency service and medical science and teams that saved fredericks life.

So is God like the parent that knows there is broken glass where their children will be playing but instead of preventing them playing there or clearing in up first, they just make sure the first aid cabinet is stocked up?

how can we experience our true feelings, change our way of thinking and come to acknowledge truths,

Doesn't that rather depend on what you mean by 'true' and 'truths'?

Satan's accusation that mankind would never turn to God under hardships.

One hand helping does more than a thousand clasped in prayer but God is even less effective, he does nothing at all apart from apparently just watching.

It would seem that mankind is actually kinder than God, more just than God, more moral than God and can do things God cannot.

[astrologica]

Rose...I do have respect for your views and those of anyone who believes in a God, whatever form that God takes. I am sorry if it came across as disrespectful...it was not meant to be. The case of Alan Henning has touched my heart, before and after his murder. When I saw that he had been murdered my first reaction was sadness, and it moved me to tears, as I suspect it did to many others.
But then I began to feel intense anger because this whole situation is mostly because of religious differences. It came to me that neither a Christian God, nor a Muslim Allah is listening to any prayers offered up by anyone on either side of this terrible conflict. It just confirms even more to me that there is no God.
I do respect your views, and those of Busty, but this time my anger got the better of me and my post came across as disrespectful, and for that I am sorry.

[bankhaunter]

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@rose2008-2008 wrote:

You dont seem to have any respect at all!!. There is something at work and i believe it must be a God of some sort,,,whether Good or Bad things happen!. Something higher that has the power to do these things or decide peoples fate must be a GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

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There is no Supreme Being that decides your fate nor is it even possible there could be, if it were so your every action would have to be predetermined by that Being, for example WW2 would have been a deliberately caused by them, their decision that many millions were killed or injured.

Your fate is decided by the choices you make, the choices other people make and natural conditions/events, when you cross the road it is you that mostly affects whether or not you will be killed, you don't just rely on a god to decide your actions for you.

[suzieseaside]

So God is Great and God is Good?

In 300BC Epicures came up with the following logic about the idea that God is said to be Omnipotent and Good

Either God wants to abolish evil and cannot,

Or he can but does not want to;

Or he cannot and does not want to,

Or lastly, he can and wants to.

If he wants to remove evil, and cannot,

he is not omnipotent.

If he can but does not want to,

he is not benevolent.

If he neither can nor wants to,

he is neither omnipotent nor benevolent.

But if God can abolish evil and wants to,

how does evil exist?

(From Aphorisms of Epicures, 300 BC).

2,400 years later and there still are no convincing answers to this paradox, IMO.

[upthecreekyetagain]

If there is a God, greater being or whatever you want to call it there is no reason to believe that they are any more benevolent than anyone else who has unlimited power - in fact the reverse is more likely to be the case.

The Greeks had the best idea with their Gods - each having numerous personality traits, some spiteful, some loving, some vengeful etc. . . . and they fought amongst themselves!

[Anonymous]

Lets assume there is a God of some sort....a powerful energy that holds great knowledge...all the knowledge ever accumulated over billions of years. So, an ever growing energy, like the ever growing universe. A God which is for ever expanding and creating. According the Bible we are created in God's image. We are God's children. So, that would make us the physical extension of that God (this non-physical energy). Making us powerful beings in our own right. According to the Bible we were also given free will; freedom of choice to use that power as we see fit. As we live life with all its contrast we continually make new choices, we grow, we create, we change, we invent, we learn, etc... We can only do that because of that contrast. Only that contrast makes us grow, makes us able to create new ideas, find new solutions, invent new things to help our lives being more meaningful, easier, happier, healthier, etc... Some people would call that contrast the Devil or Satan. Without darkness there can't be any light....How would you know the difference.... Maybe it was never God's intention to give us a paradise on earth, maybe we're suppose to figure it out for ourselves, so we can be part of the expansion, of that creation, of that God, of that knowledge that is forever growing. As parents we give our children responsibility over their own lives....Why would God be any different? We want our children to grow and learn, to explore, to be inspired by life itself. To put all the responsibility at the feet of the parent seems pretty unfair. We are all responsible for our own actions, our own choices. If those backfire, it's not the Devil at work and it's not God's job to make it all better again....it's our job to make new choices. Assuming that there is a God, I feel we were given all the tools we need to create new solutions for any problems we have to face. We can make lists of all the terrible things that are happening on this planet, but, although seldom done, we can also make lists of the great things that are happening, because they do, day in day out.... So instead of focussing on the problems we should always focus on the solutions. Embrace that contrast instead of blaming a God and seek out the best thing you can to deal with whatever life throws at you. We do not need a God to solve it for us. All we have to do is reach for the best within ourselves. Maybe that was meant by Jesus when he said that the Kingdom of God is within us...... Disclaimer: I have never read the Bible, so for those who are religious, don't come back to me with hundreds of Bible quotes.

[ronnybabes]

It is a well-known secret among biblical scholars that there is a missing commandment. The Famous Eleventh. But biblical scholars don’t like to talk about this mistake because they don’t want people to get upset.

Luckily, though, the Eleventh has been preserved orally for thousands and thousands of years. You’ll recognise it immediately. “Wear a Hat!” God commanded Moses on that fateful night in the desert, and then He added, “It’s chilly up here on this mountain. Are you looking to get sick?”

The reason why this crucial commandment got left off was because Moses, like most people back then and continuing to the present, only had ten fingers. So as God rattled off His Laws, Moses jotted them down on his digits with a leaking desert berry. Taking notes this way was a common practice at the time and is the original source for the term “shorthand.”

Well, after all ten fingers were used up, he scribbled on his wrist, “Wear a Hat!” I should point out that most commandments originally had exclamatory remarks, but for some reason stiff-necked grammar teachers have had an unusual prejudice against

“!s” and they are practically extinct in literature, though they are trying to make a comeback in comic books. If you think about it, there probably would be a lot less breaking of commandments if “!s” were reinstated. There’s a big difference between, “Thou shall not commit adultery,” and “Thou shall not commit adultery!” Hear the emphasis? Much more intimidating.

Anyway, after getting everything down with his leaking berry, Moses figured that after God left, he would put the Laws on stone tablets for his presentation to the group. The problem is that Moses forgot about the Eleventh Commandment on his wrist because his baggy robe covered it up. The tablets were done by the time he remembered, and it was too arduous a task to start over. You’ll notice that there are a lot of misspellings on stone tablets, and in the Egyptian tombs for this very reason.

Well, Moses let the people know about the Eleventh, and so the Word spread, but it lacked official weight having been left off the tablets, and people didn’t refer to it as a Commandment. But it did become an underground hit, if you know what I mean. And it’s the reason to this day why the Pope, religious Jews, Country and Western singers, sea captains, and people in cold and warm climates—in essence, all people—wear headgear at some point in their lives.       

[Anonymous]

[saasher2012]

lol. Sits back & waits for the thunder bolt to strike. lol.

[bankhaunter]

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@upthecreekyetagain wrote:

If there is a God, greater being or whatever you want to call it there is no reason to believe that they are any more benevolent than anyone else who has unlimited power - in fact the reverse is more likely to be the case.

The Greeks had the best idea with their Gods - each having numerous personality traits, some spiteful, some loving, some vengeful etc. . . . and they fought amongst themselves!

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A read of the Bible would indicate the reverse was definitely the case, obey or be destroyed.

There is good reason to think the Hebrew god did start out to be one of a family, other members being discarded for various reasons.

[suzieseaside]

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@rose2008-2008 wrote:

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@astrologica wrote:
With the greatest respect Rose....'God. Bless'? Alan Henning and the other hostages were probably the most prayed-for people of recent years....I think even Atheists and Agnostics were praying for him(them). But where was God? Did he listen? Did he answer that multitude of prayers? Where was God when Muslims were praying for Christians out of love for their fellow man? Where was God when all that blood was brutally spilled in the desert? And if one religious person comes on here and says 'It's for a reason'....or 'God has his own plans'...or 'God loves every one of us'....I think I will have to go and throw up.

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You dont seem to have any respect at all!!. There is something at work and i believe it must be a God of some sort,,,whether Good or Bad things happen!. Something higher that has the power to do these things or decide peoples fate must be a GOD!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!.

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I don’t see that astro’s post is disrespectful. She is not rubbishing other peoples’ views, she is not being dogmatic about how things are or must be; IMO she is merely stating how she feels, just as many others have done on this thread. I think it is entirely understandable that many of us cannot believe that the killing and torture of innocent people, or children dying of starvation in the dirt in Somalia, too weak to move (as just 2 examples), can possibly be for a reason and part of ‘God’s Plan’.

There are parts of the Bible that make me sick, for example ‘God’s’ views on women and slavery.

God is apparently highly sexist and finds slavery completely acceptable including branding and mutilation, the separation of slaves from their families, and slavery of children. By making slavery illegal and striving for equality between sexes in the modern world we must be defying God’s Word.

If the Bible is supposed to be the Word of God I fail to see how some people who believe that it is can cherry pick the bits that suit and ignore the bits that seem unlikely to fit the God they worship. It either represents the Word of God in its entirety or it represents the thoughts of 30-40 primitive men, some of whom considered women to be inferior and probably owned slaves themselves. I know which sounds the most logical to me.

[bankhaunter]

There is nothing about the Bible that shows it is other than a collection of writings of the time they were written, it reflects the knowledge of the age, the morals of the age and the superstitions of the age.

[**forum-decorum**]

We had a good Watchtower study today.

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2014603

What Is the Role of Women in Jehovah’s Purpose?

[**bustysinclaire**]

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@**forum-decorum** wrote:

We had a good Watchtower study today.

http://wol.jw.org/en/wol/d/r1/lp-e/2014603

What Is the Role of Women in Jehovah’s Purpose?

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My apologies. I posted the above with the wrong ID:smileymad:

[upthecreekyetagain]

A great interview that is well worth listening to - even for an atheist like myself

[lambsy_uk]

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@5129frederick wrote:

Instead of blaming God for everything under the sun for what He hasn't done, for once, just once, let's thank Him for what He has given us.  He has given me, in the main, a healthy life, one in which I have all my faculties.  I've got diabetes through my own fault, eating all the wrong foods, the smallest of all crosses to bear.  He also saved my life when I had a serious car smash - fractured ribs and leg injuries are very painful, cuts all over my head but, what amounted to a miracle - my eyes remained in tact.  Yes, I've been through the wars, but He's seen me ok, so I thank Him for the life I have lead.

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Nothing wrong with being thankful; I'm thankful every day. Thankful for health, happiness, my family and all I have and hold dear, but I don't need a god to be thankful to, I'm just thankful and appreciative!!!

I spread the word too, but it's not the word of god I just tell people to stop moaning and stop worrying about what others have or what they are getting up to, just be thankful for what they have, god doesn't come into it though!

[lambsy_uk]

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@suzieseaside wrote:

There are parts of the Bible that make me sick, for example ‘God’s’ views on women and slavery.

God is apparently highly sexist and finds slavery completely acceptable including branding and mutilation, the separation of slaves from their families, and slavery of children. 

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Perhaps I've misjudged him, I may have to give this god bloke a go, he seems my kinda guy!