New Feedback 'Score' Idea

[iposters]

Buyers and Sellers

What would your thoughts be if we pushed eBay for a Feedback Policy like this?

The current Feedback format and Policies is not working, its not fair and Sellers will alwyas be held to randsome due to negative feedback threats. 

SO New Idea! 

A Credit Score type Feedback  (Your Score out of 999) 

Feedback is based on 7 Factors. 

The Below is AUTO-GENERATED, so a Computer System (eBay) will decide the correct score

• Dispatch Time (System Picks up how quickly item was dispatched) 
• Delivery Time (If Tracking is added, system picks up how quickly item is delivered)
• Communication (System Picks up how fast you replied to the buyer) 
• Postage Costs (System Picks up item weight / size and decides if Postage Cost is fair) 

The Buyer can then leave their feedback for following

• Quality Of Product
• Level Of Service
• Would they buy from this Seller Again

So even if the buyer leaves 1/999 for both Quality of Product / Level of Service, as long as you have sent the item on time, replied in good time, you still can get a good score for being a 'Good Account' 

Computer will then work out a score based on the 7 Factors and you get an average score based on that. 

Sellers can then leave their feedback and it wouldnt be Negative or Positive. 

• How Quickly did the Buyer Pay? (System Auto Generated)
• Did you enjoy this experiance with the Buyer?  
• Did you have any issues to report with the buyer. (You can then report any issues which eBay will review, and if they see contonious patterns of suspicious behavior this will affect their Account Score) 

This way would be so much more fair, and better for everyone. You can also get impartial Feedback so if you have responded fast, dispatched on time, the buyer can't score you down for that as eBay will score you on it.

[plpmr]

I just comment only on this -

"So even if the buyer leaves 1/999 for both Quality of Product / Level of Service, as long as you have sent the item on time, replied in good time, you still can get a good score for being a 'Good Account' "

So, even if the seller attempts to scam the buyer with rubbish and forces them to go through the hoops, they get off scot free as long as they have posted on time, answered messages badly but quickly, because that makes them a "good account".

really?

[iposters]

Sellers would need to upload Valid Tracking to qualify for this score, or at this point its back in the Buyers hands, and again, Buyers can report sellers for this which will impact their score. 

What about Buyers who currently lie then? Buyers who say 'Slow Delivery' (Despite items arriving on time) and Poor Communication? Even when the buyer has responded? 

No matter the circles we go in there will always be disputes and arguments that will arise from feedback formats, however, we can all agree, giving the buyer 100% of the feedback power isnt fair! 

Last year (Dropped off now) I had an Item 

Bought on 21st December (Dispatch by 23rd) Expected Delivery Date 28-29th Dec 

Buyer Messaged me 11:21pm on Xmas Eve, WHERE IS MY ITEM?

We responded at 00:03am 25th December. 'Hello, item will be with you 27th December, (1-2 Days Before expected date) 
Buyer responded on the 26th Dec 'NOT GOOD ENOUGH XMAS GONE' 

We got Negative Feeback, "Slow Dispatch, Didnt arrive for Xmas, Poor Communication' Also marked us as 1 for everything. - How is this fair? We dispatched on time, buyer got the item on time, and we responded on Xmas day! (Within the hour) 

With the new 'Idea Policy' the system would have picked up item arrived quick and early, dispatched on time, and that we responded fast. 

[vinylscot]

I can see so many potential problems with this, based on my experience with eBay/couriers/buyers/sellers, etc.

The last thing we should be doing is making feedback more complicated than it already is. You have obviously given the matter some thought, but I don't think you've really considered the real world in that thinking. Maintaining the integrated systems required for this would be a major undertaking, and is pretty much a non-starter because a) it would be very costly, and b) eBay is not very good at maintianing its current systems, so would you trust them to do more?

There is actually more of a case for completely scrapping publicly viewable feedback, leaving eBay to act on problem sellers behind the scenes. I'm not really in favour of that either. Despite its faults, eBay's current system is probably as good as it will get.

[theelench]

I really think Feedback works best when it's at its simplest.  Most people left FB when they could just say what they thought of the transaction and the seller's reaction to any problems.

These days I leave FB for buyers if I notice they've left FB for me, sometimes I probably miss one as the 'FB left' icon drifts off the edge of my seller hub screen or it's left weeks after the transaction.

FB left by sellers can only be Positive so I don't bother reading it, even if the seller bothers to leave any.

Kudos to you for trying to make it better, but when ebay has taken it far beyond what it was first intended to do, improvements will, I think, just make it more time consuming and result in even fewer buyers/ sellers bothering with it.

IMO probably the best thing that could happen to it would be if ebay stopped using it to gain ammunition to hit sellers with (DSRs "Did your purchase arrive on time") and reverted it back to what it started out as  --  a comment on how the transaction went.

[*vyolla*]

Everybody wants everything one click away, that makes it a whole lot more complicated.

I don't know about you, but when I receive a "How did our courier do" survey I always click on the amount of stars out of 5 I wish to leave and then it wants a whole load of info completed. If I've clicked on 5 stars then I'm obviously happy with the service, I do not wish to explain why I'm happy under 5 different headings thereafter.

If I'd left 1 star then I get it, I should explain why.

So, I don't often bother with the surveys.

[iposters]

The Problem you have with Scores out of 5 is (And I had this when I was General Manager of a Nissan Dealership) A lot of people say 'Amazing, the best EVER. 4/5. When you say why don't you leave 5/5? They say, I never leave 5/5

The issue with a Negative though, the BIG RED and how it affects your 100% can be mislead. I had a Negative many years ago, 'The Product wasnt good, the Item wasn't what I expected, the delivery was ok, good communication' 

I still think a Rating would be easier as above, or a Account Type where buyer see you 'Account Level' 'Below Standard Account' 'Above Average Account 'Top-Rated Seller' and feedback goes towards this!

I still think though, Sellers should have the right to Accept or Deny A Buyer 'Buying' and without the fear of Negative Feedback

and if an item is refunded No Feedback should be able to be left. 

[vinylscot]

@iposters you're obviously a very experienced eBay member, but I really think you're on a loser here.

Few buyers leave feedback, even now, because it's too much of a faff; introducing more steps, or greater granularity, would only further discourage buyers from leaving any.

You mention the effect an unjustified negative has on your account. While you may not be happy to receive one. when it boils down to it, VERY few negatives are totally unjustified. Just add your own comments, if you like, and move on.

...and as for "and if an item is refunded No Feedback should be able to be left". This is a crazy idea, I suspect born out of frustration with your own experiences, as you have received 8 non-positive feedbacks in the past month (from only 93 feedback comments). I can understand why someone may not want to buy from you, but, under your proposal, assuming you refunded those unhappy customers, nobody would know you had a problem.

[iposters]

The Issue is, we sold 447 Items between 19th December & 19th Jan. 413 of them was Delivered within 3 Days. 

Neutral isnt a Negative and you can clearly see by the comments they was related to 'Delivery Issues' Not us. So effectivly my point has been proven, a buyer has based their WHOLE experiance on an issue that was out of our control. On my idea, agree, Delivery Time would have been marked down, however, Commication was quick and we made every effort with all buyers to sort there issue.

With your comments on teh Negative Refund. With the buyer in my Neg Comment. She asked for a refund before the expected Delivery Date, as she was moaning quite a lot, and I could tell this would be an issue, I just said, yeah of course, and the item should arrive in the next 1-2 days and just for added confidecne i'll send a replacement, how is it fair the buyer got her item before the Exp Delivery date, asked to cancel, and also got a replacement sent and she can leave a Neg Feedback? Im effectivly now out of 2 Posters, £11.99 for the item, 2 shipment fees down and a Negarive Feedback, when all I did was help the buyer and do as she asked.

With respect to your comments our account is very healthy, 22 Years Selling Experiance, 110,000+ Feedbacks, Top-Rated Seller, and we all know how buyers get at Christmas with ridiculous feedback comments 

eBay already have systems in place for Late Dispatch / Late Delivery so it would be easy to contribute that to feedback along with Message Response time, and with the fees we pay now they should be investing in ehancing the Selling Experiance we well as buyer.

Most buyers are fantastic, however there is unfortuantly a small minority that are just angry, abusive and talk to you like rubbish, even if 1/10 are difficult, thats too high to allow them to have all the control

[thesmokingrunner]

"Computer will then work out a score based on the 7 Factors and you get an average score based on that."

eBay's programmers can't even work out an Estimated Delivery Date correctly - what on earth makes you think they could calculate a feedback score on 7 factors all ranging from 1 to 999?

[vintage-emporium-jedburgh]

we dont give 2 hoots about what feedback we can leave, leaving poor  feedback gains us nothing,

  bad feedback upsets buyers ,who then dont spend money or go elsewhere,

 ebay should restrict serial non payers and  dishonest   ,,by actually using  the report buyer data 

[iposters]

eBay dont do anything with reporting Non-Paying Buyers. I had one buyer last year who when I read his feedback other Sellers left comments DOES NOT PAY. Anyway, I reported him, (as did other buyers looking at the feedback they left) and fast forward 6 months the buyer still doing the same and no action. eBay will never take action against Buyers Not Paying. 

Again, Sellers should have the option to either ACCEPT the SALE or not, without fear of Negative Feedback Punishment

[4_bathrooms]

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@iposters wrote:

With the buyer in my Neg Comment. She asked for a refund before the expected Delivery Date, as she was moaning quite a lot, and I could tell this would be an issue, I just said, yeah of course, and the item should arrive in the next 1-2 days and just for added confidecne i'll send a replacement, how is it fair the buyer got her item before the Exp Delivery date, asked to cancel, and also got a replacement sent and she can leave a Neg Feedback? Im effectivly now out of 2 Posters, £11.99 for the item, 2 shipment fees down and a Negarive Feedback, when all I did was help the buyer and do as she asked.

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I don't understand this. If the buyer asked to cancel their order before the latest EDD and before they had received the item the correct thing to do would have been to direct them to open a return request because they had changed their mind; once the buyer received the item they would then have been required to send it back in order to receive their refund. I really don't understand why you agreed to send a replacement item free of charge when the buyer clearly didn't want the item you had sent in the first place?

Anyway, complicating the feedback process for buyers will likely have the opposite effect to what you want. Many people have now become conditioned into ignoring the constant requests they receive to leave reviews as pretty much every online retailer, marketplace, delivery service, mobile app etc. asks for one. Making the process even more complicated than it already is will only cause more people who would otherwise have left a positive review not to bother as they'll take one look at the feedback form and decide they can't be bothered with it. However, a buyer who is dissatisfied with their purchase will always be willing to fill out the form and ensure their voice is heard. As it is most sellers receive feedback from about 50% of happy buyers and 100% of unhappy buyers; I don't see any need to reduce that 50% further.

[plpmr]

" I read his feedback other Sellers left comments DOES NOT PAY"

Blame those sellers for the fact that this buyer is still active.

[*vyolla*]

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@iposters wrote:

. I had one buyer last year who when I read his feedback other Sellers left comments DOES NOT PAY. Anyway, I reported him, (as did other buyers looking at the feedback they left) and fast forward 6 months the buyer still doing the same and no action. eBay will never take action against Buyers Not Paying. 

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No, they didn't, else they wouldn't have been leaving feedback.

If you report a buyer for non-payment they receive a strike against their account which sticks to it for a year and sellers can block buyers with more than 2 unpaid item strikes. 

If sellers don't report as unpaid and leave a positive rating (which is all they can leave) then the system reads that the seller has been happy with how the transaction went.

[magpiecorner1]

I very rarely pay quickly.  Often don't even check straight away if I have won, generally wait until I have a few minutes so that I can check sellers others items, if I haven't already done this, then I might message asking if they combine postage.  If already stated and they have interesting auctions ending within three days, I might message but people I buy from regularly don't even get a message.

I frequently have buyers holding off payments so that I can list things for them, therefore save them money by combining postage, once paid for it's difficult to hold items.

All if which makes me a pretty *bleep*py buyer, and my buyers pretty *bleep*py buyers too under your feedback scheme, dispite me spending thousands of pounds a month and never not paying.

Personally all I would change in feedback would be to allow sellers to be remove feedback.  Say, one neg  removal allowed per 500 sales and one neutral per 250 sales.  And only one neg per seller allowed for buyers, and a limit on the number of negs and neutrals that a buyer can leave, again linked to the number of purchases. 

This would make everyone think twice about leaving feedback.

And, my pet peeve, defects for late despatch should not suddenly become for late delivery, and it should be a percentage of sales, not feedback.  

Actually, I'd get rid of defects altogether, they play no part in decision making by buyers, just a scare tactic and money maker.

[indigo-island]

When eBay started buying online wasn't as typical as now.  Feedback was a big deal.

Today - I'm just as likely (probably more so) to buy something online as I am to pop to a shop.  I don't think to leave feedback every time I go to Asda or M&S and I don't particularly think to leave feedback when I buy online.

If something is great, or terrible - yes, but the rest of the time it's just not particularly important to be as a buyer.  So to encourage anyone to leave it, the system needs to be simple.  Or the only people who will bother to leave any are those who are dissatisfied.

As sellers- yes we can all get hung up on it.  You can change anything to solve one issue, but then you create others along the way.  

[555njp]

I think feedback is still a big deal, especially for new businesses trying to start up. 18 years ago when we started you had to have 10 positives before you could sell. Back then virtually everyone left feedback, but now we see only 5-10% if we're lucky.

Without the positives, if you do pic up a Neg (can't please everyone!) it can kill your account.

Also, bad buyers absolutely should get a Neg, but to stop sellers using it as a threat it should and could be fully automated.

My simple idea: If no feedback left, no dispute raised (basically transaction went ok) within say 40 days, eBay should automatically award a green dot to both buyer and seller with a standard comment of "successful transaction" or similar. Makes it easy for those that can't be bothered to leave feedback and sellers can build a score to gain trust.

Regarding non-paying bidders: if a case is opened and they still don't pay, eBay could award a Neg with a standard comment of "transaction not completed" on closure of a case?

Equally any unresolved case where eBay step in should result in a Neg too.

This would give a better idea of the account holders true behaviour.

And sorry, but whilst you should 100% report non-payers, block and give them a strike it doesn't stop them as they just open multiple accounts to get around it.

eBay could stop that too by restricting the number of accounts held by an individual.

I think Vinted have the right approach - No feedback equals automatic 5 stars.
They understand that some people are too busy to comment but still reward the seller.

[plpmr]

"My simple idea: If no feedback left, no dispute raised (basically transaction went ok) within say 40 days, eBay should automatically award a green dot to both buyer and seller with a standard comment of "successful transaction" or similar."

So you wish to stop feedback being voluntary - if you don't leave feedback, eBay will.

also your idea would mean more bad feedback for sellers.

[triple512]

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@plpmr wrote:

"My simple idea: If no feedback left, no dispute raised (basically transaction went ok) within say 40 days, eBay should automatically award a green dot to both buyer and seller with a standard comment of "successful transaction" or similar."

So you wish to stop feedback being voluntary - if you don't leave feedback, eBay will.

also your idea would mean more bad feedback for sellers.

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May not be such a bad idea?