Ebay's response to Post Offices who refuse Simple Delivery packages with the wrong label on them

[wintersdawn1]

This was Ebay's response in the chat today:

[andha-21]

@wintersdawn1 

Quite possible, even probable.

But I look at all this and everything else they're doing. Everything else they're doing looks deliberate, so I assume this is too.

That begs the question, to what end?

As I've already said elsewhere, the 3 day turnaround looks like a trap. Especially as they are quoting 2-3 day delivery times.

Is this just one more part of that trap?

If you can't send it first time, maybe you can't send it on time and then the parcel arrives late.

What have they allowed themselves, wriggle room wise, regarding late delivery?

Performance metrics/withheld funds is an obvious combination. They've been doing that for ages.

But is there something we are missing?

If it arrives late can they refuse to pay us?

All I know is that some incredibly sneaky people have been involved in the Simple Delivery stage of this rollout. It's hands down the smartest thing I've ever seen them do. I don't mean for us.

So what's next?

[wintersdawn1]

Agreed, I'm sure they've used all their (or some high priced financial advisor's) cunning and deviousness coming up with SD so that whatever scenarios play out, eBay will not be the party who suffers.

[cyclingjason090]

From what I understand it's no longer possible to view the buyers address until the simpleton delivery label is downloaded or printed,  why not get the address from it and then buy your chosen/correct label direct from the Royal mail website or post office counter as normal. After all we've been doing it this way for over 20 years. Message the buyer with an explanation that the ebay supplied label was wrong,  the post office wouldn't accept it and you have generously paid for the correct label out of your own pocket. Include any tracking information as required

[andha-21]

Going from other posts I've seen, your idea may result in eBay coming back to you and taking money from your account. Another poster referred to it as a fine. That's what eBay told them if the simpleton label was wrong.

I'm guessing your idea involves contacting the buyer so they request a refund of postage from eBay.

Cut them out of the loop?

If so, they definitely have that covered in terms and conditions.

[cyclingjason090]

Ebay would get their cost of the label back when it wasn't used,  they can't claim it back twice.

I wonder if the simpleton label shows in the ebay system if it's scanned and rejected at the post office counter

[jonat_broad]

This sounds very similar to amazons prepaid return label policy when a customer opens a return for an FBM order

the labels are billed to the seller by are on amazons Royal Mail or Evri account (even wilder the Evri labels are invoiced from Grattan PLC)

at the point the return is scanned at the post office the seller is charged for the label and the customer is refunded.

if a return gets lost in the post though, the seller is supposed to claim via the courier. It states this in amazons policy.

only you can’t because the label is amazons, not yours.

when Amazon were advised Royal Mail and Evri weren’t allowing claims, they said “they should because that’s what our policy says”

[akemp1]

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@andha-21 wrote:

All I know is that some incredibly sneaky people have been involved in the Simple Delivery stage of this rollout. It's hands down the smartest thing I've ever seen them do. I don't mean for us.

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If ebay were smart they would have launched SD and made it mandatory with lower charges than buying postage directly then we all would have happily jumped on the bus of being forced to buy ebay postage. Then once we had accepted mandatory SD they could have gradually hiked the prices with less resistance and repulsion.

Similarly with the buyer tax it was insane to allow a period of zero fees between abolishing the seller fee and starting the buyer tax because again it made everyone more upset - people may have accepted it more if they hadn't experienced zero fees for a while.

[andha-21]

A shame @valueaddedresource isn't around.

I wonder if they've seen any trap type shenanigans on eBay.com

They might know a pattern.

[lucy_farmer]

'when Amazon were advised Royal Mail and Evri weren’t allowing claims, they said “they should because that’s what our policy says”'

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😮😲😧... blimey these global tech types really think they can get away with anything and the rest of the world should do what they say......

Some aspects of the modern world are just too depressing.

[andha-21]

What's smart/sneaky about it isn't the price and other obvious slap round the face things.

It's the hidden trap within it.

They tell sellers we have a maximum of 3 days turnaround for the order.

But they are quoting 2-3 delivery days for the Standard Service. That includes Royal Mail 48 Tracked and equivalent Evri service. Tracked 48 isn't and never had been a guaranteed delivery time. It's an aim. Royal Mail have always advertised it that way. When it's running smoothly, depending on delivery distance, 3 days is normal but it can take longer.

So they tell the buyers 3 days, which means the seller has to dispatch next day to have a chance of it arriving on time, but if the label is wrong and the post office won't accept it, then we're supposed to tell eBay so they can report it. 

There's something in this part, something between the buyer and eBay that changes the nature of the transaction. 

eBay are deciding delivery times and making it a condition of sale.

So if we don't fulfill their timeframe what can they do?

They definitely have something waiting for us.

[wintersdawn1]

As the buyer purchases the postage from ebay and not the seller, surely that makes ebay responsible for any problems.  That said I think I read ebay terms somewhere that ebay will be responsible, unless the seller doesn't follow packaging terms i.e. doesn't use strong enough packaging and it gets damaged etc and then they are not responsible but seller is.

I guess the only way for ebay to be totally responsible as the buyer purchases the postage from them, is if ebay handles the packing and dispatch themselves.  As the private seller does that part, ebay could use their terms against the seller to abdicate their responsibility by saying it wasn't packaged well enough etc.

[theelench]

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@wintersdawn1 wrote:

A reply in the chat was posted asking how this will help the seller that has a package to send, but it was removed.

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And (if it's the same poster?) they are now enjoying a spell of gardening leave, as it gives them more time to work on their listings.

[wintersdawn1]

Just to put it briefly there was quite a cull of posted comments today, including one of mine, limiting posters ability to get answers or point out incorrect information given.  Probably best to leave it there.

[theelench]

I've been out most of the day so missed it !!!

Perhaps nerves are getting slightly frayed at ebay towers?

They certainly should be !!!

[sebastian4ever]

FeeBay will probably have a strategy meeting and rebrand it “complex delivery”.

[jma2815]

I’m sure they’ve thought of that. It will be against the rules to not use the provided SD label and they’ll enforce it using all the usual methods - Performance metrics, strikes, payment holds, fines, hiding listings and eventually, loss of your selling account. 

😞

[andha-21]

I think you've just hit the nail on the head there. I've been almost on it for around a day, circling it as it were.

Because eBay sell the buyer the label, it becomes a condition of sale. If we use a different label we're breaching that contract.

What remains to be seen is what eBay have allowed themselves to do regarding that.

We aren't party to the EDD's but can get sanctions for missing them, so what sanctions do we get for breach of contract?

In other areas it could be total financial loss. I wonder if they have the *bleep* to try that?

[vinylscot]

If you don't use the label eBay provide, eBay will have no way of knowing when the item was delivered. I don't believe there will be an option to input different tracking details.

This would hold up payments to sellers to the absolute maximum.

[wintersdawn1]

I think its a good sign that we are taking a while to unravel ebay's plan, it means we are not as devious as they are and its hard for us to get into their depraved mindset.

[theelench]

That's why some call it "obay"

At least I do!!