EBay plan to add fees for buyers - hurts businesses even further

[vintagefunk01]

From the sky news article here which is obviously a press release https://news.sky.com/story/ebay-selling-fees-are-scrapped-to-boost-to-reselling-13225638

It seems clear ebay is following in the footsteps of other selling marketplaces by adding fees for buyers in the early new year,  but since fees remain in place for business sellers adding another fee on top of this is another hit to our bottom line.

We will now be expected to absorb the buyers fee and our own business selling fee (and shop fees etc).

This seems crazy to me - although eBay say it'll be 'small' , if it's 8% like elsewhere that's a massive hit for us to take.  Yes it's for the buyers but we all know prices will drop because of it - for example a 350 item will now cost 379 to the buyer with an 8% fee that is currently used by another platform, so ofc sellers will drop the initial price so that the item actually sells and to offset this.

Fine for private sellers who have no fees to compensate, but insane for business sellers with hefty fvf and shop fees already 

[vintique*violet]

I feel the same - and have never had a parcel go missing with RM and use their service for a multiple of reasons and will never use a different one...although I was not happy about the delivery of a Tracked 48 with signature being left on an open road doorstep the other day of which  many of you  kind offered  advice. 

(Incidentally the buyer still has not acknowledged the screenshots and info/messages sent to them to show them it was delivered on their doorstep.?) 

[dch2112011]

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@vintique*violet wrote:

Days gone by eBay warned every seller not to post until cleared funds received. How is it unfair to buyers for a seller to ensure payment is cleared before posting?  I certainly do not post until funds are cleared, which is usually within 1 - 3 days . 

How does it cause a problem to drive buyers away? 

Put yourself in a  buyers shoes - You pay for goods in good faith - only to have to wait until the funds you have paid  for a third party seller to decide that they do not trust you or your bank or ebay as the processor  and selfishly withhold your goods until the internal transfer process from ebay to the third party  seller has been completed which has absolutely nothing to do with the buyer.

Buyers experiancing this type of selling behaviour are less likely to buy from sellers on ebay because of this tactic by sellers who put them at the bottom of the sellers priorities, it destroys trust and buyer expectation. 

Would you really go into a shop and pay for your groceries with a card only to be told you cannot have them for a few days until the money had reached the shop's bank account ?

How would you react if paying for an item on a Saturday to be told to come back next Thursday to collect the item because the seller did not trust you, your bank or your payment method 

I think you would react entirely different to the way you treat your customers.

Handling time is determined by the seller for what suits them. 

My handling time is 5 days, but usually post within 1 to 3 days  and state this on my listings - this suits me, firstly to cover any unforeseen issues ( health, weather etc)  and being as eBay E.D.D. are often  incorrect aids in not receiving a late delivery strike. Once it has left my hands, any days by the postal services are not in my control and it is unfair for anyone to be penalised by this. In no way is this manipulating the EDD nor can every seller offer same day or next day postage. I am confused as to how " increased handling time" deters buyers? Personally if there was an item I wanted and the seller was on holiday or handling was a week I would be happy to wait. 

Handling time is indeed a sellers choice  but if the seller was not going to get paid until the sale was delivered it would obviously encourage sellers to dispatch same day purely to receive their funds quicker .

If you dispatch in 1 to 3 days why set your handling time to 5 days ?   Is this not a deception or manipulation ?

Most buyers  want a quick delivery which means speed is of the essence when handling orders - if you buy in a shop delivery is instant.

Why do you think when buying online a customer is willing to pay, wait until you have the money transferred to you bank from ebay even though the funds cleared almost instantly  and then have a seller dispatching days later ?

Buyers  online expect quick delivery -  a seller is not doing a buyer any favours by selling their product to them - the buyer is doing the seller a favour by buying their item - they deserve to be served.

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[vintique*violet]

@vintique*violet wrote:

Days gone by eBay warned every seller not to post until cleared funds received. How is it unfair to buyers for a seller to ensure payment is cleared before posting?  I certainly do not post until funds are cleared, which is usually within 1 - 3 days . 

How does it cause a problem to drive buyers away? 

Put yourself in a  buyers shoes - You pay for goods in good faith - only to have to wait until the funds you have paid  for a third party seller to decide that they do not trust you or your bank or ebay as the processor  and selfishly withhold your goods until the internal transfer process from ebay to the third party  seller has been completed which has absolutely nothing to do with the buyer.

Why would a seller decide they do not trust a buyer when they have paid? Where would they get their banking details from - I have never seen a sellers bank details nor a buyers for that matter. 

I have never had a seller selfishly withheld goods either. If I choose to purchase something then I wait for the seller to notify me of dispatch... whether that be 1 or 5 days.  The internal transfer process? Ebay have moved this goalpost with managed payments - Usually the funds are in the next day, posting on cleared funds. No one in their right mind would post out an item without payment - which incidentally is why I am against what eBay are now going to do to private sellers to " withhold funds" until AFTER delivery confirmation.  I have said from day one , this platform and platforms like these are based on trust. 

Buyers experiancing this type of selling behaviour are less likely to buy from sellers on ebay because of this tactic by sellers who put them at the bottom of the sellers priorities, it destroys trust and buyer expectation. 

What  evidence do you have that sellers are doing what you opine? 

Would you really go into a shop and pay for your groceries with a card only to be told you cannot have them for a few days until the money had reached the shop's bank account ?

I have made this point in another post - This is exactly what eBay are now proposing... private sellers not only have to upfront postage fees, they are required to wait for their funds after delivery confirmation ( which incidentally is in the  hands of the postal service AND frustratingly the use of automated A.I. System which is unreliable)  At present funds are in my account the next day. 

How would you react if paying for an item on a Saturday to be told to come back next Thursday to collect the item because the seller did not trust you, your bank or your payment method 

Has this happened to you ? Has a seller told you they don't trust you? I find this a little bizarre and am confused by what you are trying to convey.  If an item is collection only, a convenient  and mutual collection date is determined and agreed by the seller and buyer  - that completes the sale. I have never known a seller to inform me that I could not collect because they did not trust me, my bank or my payment method? In fact if they did, I certainly would contact Customer service to discuss. 

I think you would react entirely different to the way you treat your customers.

I treat and appreciate any and all customers who chose to purchase from me with respect and with a good service, and this is reflected in my feedback and above standard account of nearly 17 yrs.  I am unsure what you are getting at here? 

Handling time is determined by the seller for what suits them. 

My handling time is 5 days, but usually post within 1 to 3 days  and state this on my listings - this suits me, firstly to cover any unforeseen issues ( health, weather etc)  and being as eBay E.D.D. are often  incorrect aids in not receiving a late delivery strike. Once it has left my hands, any days by the postal services are not in my control and it is unfair for anyone to be penalised by this. In no way is this manipulating the EDD nor can every seller offer same day or next day postage. I am confused as to how " increased handling time" deters buyers? Personally if there was an item I wanted and the seller was on holiday or handling was a week I would be happy to wait. 

Handling time is indeed a sellers choice  but if the seller was not going to get paid until the sale was delivered it would obviously encourage sellers to dispatch same day purely to receive their funds quicker .

I do not see any positive encouragement by withholding funds from sellers until delivery confirmation  for me to post the same day... It is not a service I can provide.  Plus it is not guaranteed that the seller would receive their funds quicker.  As previously stated, it is reliant on the postage service and the automated system. I have items sold , delivered and feedback  which shows the transaction is now completed , order fulfilled etc,  and yet the system still shows dispatched/delayed 3 weeks down the road - so in the new system I would be having to " fight" to receive funds which are rightfully mine and eBay garner daily interest...I do not believe mine is the only account that this is happening to. 

If you dispatch in 1 to 3 days why set your handling time to 5 days ?   Is this not a deception or manipulation ?

You do realise that people have a life outside of eBay,  that things can happen  which could delay, that way I am covering myself. The buyer knows my handling time so there is absolutely no deception or manipulation. I run my account how I see fit and what suits me, and a potential buyer has the choice to purchase from me or someone else. If they require an item to be posted quicker, they can ask, and if it is possible I will accommodate, but I would never offer any service with which I could not deliver on. 

Most buyers  want a quick delivery which means speed is of the essence when handling orders - if you buy in a shop delivery is instant.

As a  seller and buyer  and old enough to know that instant gratification is not always a good trait and patience is a virtue;   I do find  that most people usually  know when purchasing online their buying experience is not "instant" as in store, unless  that item is out of stock and an order needs to be placed. 

Why do you think when buying online a customer is willing to pay, wait until you have the money transferred to you bank from ebay even though the funds cleared almost instantly  and then have a seller dispatching days later ?

The buyer is not waiting for anything other than the notification of dispatch and estimated delivery date and then of course the item delivered. They are not waiting for any transfer of funds... it is the seller who is waiting and will be waiting longer once funds hold until after delivery.  I am unsure what point you are trying to make here?  At present the system works by geared funds in my account the next day... I then post within 1 to 3  - when the managed payment system comes into play I will be out of pocket until eBay determine that the transaction is competed which is 48 hrs AFTER delivery confirmation. 

Buyers  online expect quick delivery -  a seller is not doing a buyer any favours by selling their product to them - the buyer is doing the seller a favour by buying their item - they deserve to be served.

Do they? I expect my  item purchased to arrive once the seller has packaged it carefully for transit and posted it, then wait for delivery.... it is not a " fast food" order. 

I do not know what to say  - it is a two way transaction and speaking for myself give those that chose to purchase an item from me,  a carefully executed customer experience. 

If  "favours" were the order of the day - I am all out. 

Any spelling mistakes ignore I don't have time to re-read and check - thanks.  

[dch2112011]

Your responses sum up why unfortunately ebay feel compelled to make decisions for private  sellers.

This is one of the reasons why Amazon sell so much they can deliver 7 days a week - often next day into the evenings  to enhance buyer experiance.

Some sellers on ebay ignore the fact that the funds are paid and cleared almost instantly and delay by manipulating 'handling times' not sending the goods to the buyer until the internal process between ebay and seller has completed.

This is nothing to do with the buyer but the buyer is unwittingly dragged into this deception.

Buyers may accept 5 day handling based on good thought but when they twig the reason is that the seller is playing with their goodwill,  and figure out the manipulation it becomes a poor buying experiance and this makes them wary of buying via ebay. 

[vintique*violet]

Your responses sum up why unfortunately ebay feel compelled to make decisions for private  sellers.

Why would my responses  make eBay feel  " compelled?"  I am in no way responsible for eBays business decisions. I am a private seller! 

This is one of the reasons why Amazon sell so much they can deliver 7 days a week - often next day into the evenings  to enhance buyer experiance.

What /why does Amazon have anything to do with anything here- they are a totally different selling / buying platform/ experience.  I am not a business seller , and cannot compete with businesses who have staff to work around the clock!  Further I am not compelled to use or execute a service I cannot provide for a multitude of reasons of which I am not divulging here.

Some sellers on ebay ignore the fact that the funds are paid and cleared almost instantly and delay by manipulating 'handling times' not sending the goods to the buyer until the internal process between ebay and seller has completed.

 Funds are not instant - they are received within 2 days in my account , usually the next day depending on the time of sale.  There is absolutely no compulsion to post the same day whether funds are cleared or not. Understanding your "logic"  is baffling...I am not manipulating any handling times nor the process.   There are thousands of sellers, business and private who  cannot offer a same day posting service or next day - rural areas, disabled and more. Have you no understanding of how this platform works? I am confused as to why you feel it necessary to try and make an example of how I handle my account?

This is nothing to do with the buyer but the buyer is unwittingly dragged into this deception.

What deception? There is zero deception, what basis are you accusing me of deception? 

Buyers may accept 5 day handling based on good thought but when they twig the reason is that the seller is playing with their goodwill,  and figure out the manipulation it becomes a poor buying experiance and this makes them wary of buying via ebay. 

In no way I am " playing on any buyers goodwill" and neither are any sellers whose handling/posting  times are set by them so that they can manage their account in such a way to best serve their customers.  What has " goodwill" to do with it, for that matter where are you determining that it is manipulation or a poor buying experience?  Do you have any data to show that? 

Wary of buying via eBay ? - If eBay have lost customers, I think eBay have done that to themselves. 

Have you not understood that no-one has to post ( at the moment ) any item until they have  received cleared funds... I choose to usually post between 1 - 3 days after the buyer has paid, informing them of such in my descriptive listings. The 5 day handling is to cover myself  should anything untoward happen which could delay my usual posting of between 1 - 3 days , that way the buyers expectations are not thwarted.  I message every buyer after purchase to thank them and inform  them when I will be posting and update the system with the tracking reference number ON the day it is posted... not mark the order as dispatched  and then post up to 5 days later!!!!  The day(s) in between are used to package the item and make arrangements to post.

 I do not have to offer any of this information to explain anything on the way I handle my account, which has worked perfectly for the past 17 yrs...however you have been accusatory without cause so please now refrain from continuing this " conversation" as it is obvious that you do not understand or are trying to push a different agenda. 

You look after you and your account/ buyers ,  and I will me and mine - Thank you. 

[dch2112011]

A buyer having paid expects goods to be shipped in a timely manner - it is that simple 

You misunderstand that when a buyer enters their payment details and the payment is accepted - they have paid and expect their purchase to be shipped.  

They are not expecting any seller to delay processing their order because a seller wants to  because the seller does not accept they have paid when informed that the payment is received and the seller should ship by ebay.

A seller who distrusts the information given to them by ebay is withholding the buyers goods without fair reason because the internal action of transferring funds from ebay to the seller is an agreement between ebay and the seller and the buyer is not party to this agreement.

I am surprised that any seller at any level  would think this is ok or acceptable and yes those sellers who employ this practice will give buyers a bad experiance which would make them think twice before buying on ebay again.

If you choose a handling time because you have logistical or ability problems then a buyer who will not be aware of the reasons will be able to assume understanding and may choose to accept because they want the item.

However if the buyer deduces the reason is that the seller is using the handling time simply to delay dispatch because the seller is not convinced the buyer has paid or ebay will not honour the transfer of funds the buyer will not be so happy and will feel trapped in the situation.

This may have an effect on other sellers and if enough sellers continue to give buyers a perceived poor experiance and it becomes problematic it encourages ebay to take action to eradicate the behaviour - of course it adds fuel to ebay's fire, helping to substantiate decisions being taken out of sellers hands which I believe no seller at any level wants.

Any way what works for you works for you  it was not a personal attack it was simply picking up on one of your reasons for delaying dispatch which can infuriate buyers even though this was not your intention 

[vintique*violet]

A buyer having paid expects goods to be shipped in a timely manner - it is that simple 

You misunderstand that when a buyer enters their payment details and the payment is accepted - they have paid and expect their purchase to be shipped.  

They are not expecting any seller to delay processing their order because a seller wants to  because the seller does not accept they have paid when informed that the payment is received and the seller should ship by ebay.

A seller who distrusts the information given to them by ebay is withholding the buyers goods without fair reason because the internal action of transferring funds from ebay to the seller is an agreement between ebay and the seller and the buyer is not party to this agreement.

I am surprised that any seller at any level  would think this is ok or acceptable and yes those sellers who employ this practice will give buyers a bad experiance which would make them think twice before buying on ebay again.

If you choose a handling time because you have logistical or ability problems then a buyer who will not be aware of the reasons will be able to assume understanding and may choose to accept because they want the item.

However if the buyer deduces the reason is that the seller is using the handling time simply to delay dispatch because the seller is not convinced the buyer has paid or ebay will not honour the transfer of funds the buyer will not be so happy and will feel trapped in the situation.

This may have an effect on other sellers and if enough sellers continue to give buyers a perceived poor experiance and it becomes problematic it encourages ebay to take action to eradicate the behaviour - of course it adds fuel to ebay's fire, helping to substantiate decisions being taken out of sellers hands which I believe no seller at any level wants.

Any way what works for you works for you  it was not a personal attack it was simply picking up on one of your reasons for delaying dispatch which can infuriate buyers even though this was not your intention 

Please stop - I am in no way delaying posting of any items sold. 

Orders are posted within 1 to 3 days.

My handling shows 5 days that is all,  and it is explained in the listing for the buyers to read!  

That is timely.  I am not a Robot! 

I am not withholding anything - In fact it will be eBay who will be withholding my funds once they implement the " funds held" until 48 hours AFTER delivery.   This will make every private seller have to post without any payment in their account - that is IF they choose to continue to stay on this platform,... Do you think that is fair reason ? It isn't, it is exploitation and dictatorial. And the only ones feeing " trapped in the situation" will be those sellers who have to sell to make ends meet due to the economy... not a buyer who receives their item when they expect it! Have you bothered to look at my feedback? 

I have not misunderstood anything , when have I ever said about distrusting that the buyer has not paid? You are putting words where I have not said them - you have!  It shows on the system. Please stop in confusing matters.

I am not the downfall of any other sellers performance or  the eBay platform 

Did you read my responses ?  Did you actually understand because you have continued on the " attack" and yes, it does feel like an attack! 

I have never delayed processing an order my handling and posting times are clearly shown. I have never said that I do not accept that a payment has not been received, why do you keep saying this? BUT I do not have to " ship by eBay" I can choose my own ( for now) way of posting which is direct with Royal Mail at the Post Office to support them, and once this changes in anyway that I cannot due to " simply shipping" or whatever other reason eBay want to give and garner funds for their shareholders/profits.   I will no longer be on this platform. 

Your replies to me have only served that you have a different agenda to what you are portraying here,  and you have made it personal. 

I asked for you not to continue this conversation as it appears to go around in circles in you not understanding or having any empathy towards another private seller. You have been accusatory, pointedly regarding my account. 

Please stop - eBay has become far more stressful than necessary without you creating more. 

Thank you. 

[dch2112011]

It is not personal but it was a response to a series of questions you asked - I have no doubt  you are not only genuine but a good seller .

The points were in the most part general and yes I read your responses.  I have no hidden agenda I totally understand why sellers hold back dispatch until the funds are actually showing on their account but I also understand why buyers feel that their purchase should be dispatched as soon as is reasonably possible having paid irrespective of the seller status.

A seller chooses to sell on ebay, because in reality it is reasonably easy to do so from the comfort of your own home unfortunately this comes with ebay's rules - Do I agree with them all - by no means ! Do I feel that customers should be inconvenienced by sellers disagreeing with the rules - No simply because the rules and promises made by ebay on behalf of the sellers is conveyed to the buyer and this is what they expect and what draws them to ebay in the first place.

Of course I would prefer that funds were released to a seller immediately on payment and I would prefer that all sellers acted in the interests of the buyers - unfortunately there are a lot of disgenuine sellers who cannot be trusted - failing to honour auctions, selling counterfeit items, using false tracking numbers , delaying shipments, dishonouring claimed warranties, shipping  damaged or broken goods, selling ghost items to use the funds as free payday loans -  the list goes on.

The same could be said about some buyers - false claims, failure to pay etc 

But each disgenuine act from buyers or sellers adds substantiation to ebay taking more and more control  even if the control would be taken anyway. 

It is sad that ebay have not been more robust in the past with disgenuine members that the platform is full of counterfeit goods and dishonest sellers and buyers that they now are taking drastic actions to increase lost revenue and clean up the mess they have allowed to prosper.

It is at the expense of genuine private sellers like yourself who in my opinion should be encouraged and assisted to sell and buy on ebay not tarred with the same brush as the chancers, traders and dishonest who hide among the private seller backbone of the ebay community.

[theelench]

I think that the position many private sellers find themselves in ATM doesn't have anything to do with trying to deceive buyers or delay sending goods that have been bought and paid for.  We have arrived here because of incremental changes made by ebay that private sellers have incrementally re-acted to.

As private sellers we are not employed by ebay to work 24/7 to achieve ebay's targets.  We set our target Dispatch Window within what we know we can achieve according to our lives outside ebay.  At one time ebay encouraged sellers to be honest and realistic with their buyers when setting a Dispatch Window, but not any more. 

Ebay now wants a 24/7 service provided by, what is at best, a part-time work force, fitting in with family, work, medical or other constraints.  Amazon isn't achieving it's same/ next day deliveries this way, it has invested in warehouses, fleets of trucks and pays workers to man them 24/7.  None of which ebay has done.

Instead ebay is trying to get the same results by beating private part time sellers with Delivery Defects 'calculated' with something that is blatantly biased and inaccurate.  Most private sellers lengthened their dispatch time, not to deceive buyers but in an attempt to deceive ebay into giving them an extra day or two's grace before being hit with a Late Delivery Defect. 

So who is deceiving the buyer?  The seller who tells the buyer they have a 5 day dispatch window, but posts in 2/3 days by the service they show on their ad..   Or ebay who tells the buyer that RM 2nd Class will arrive the day after purchase or the next day, totally ignoring both what the seller puts in their ad. and RMs own delivery estimate?

The seller is under promising and (if RM does its job) over achieving.  Ebay is over promising and setting itself up to fail and ruin its own and the seller's reputation.

Comparing part-time private sellers to either amazon or high street stores is disingenuous IMO.  Buyers from Amazon pay for "Prime" to get guaranteed delivery (or so I believe, never having bought from them) and if buyers want 'instant' delivery from a B&M store, that's where they have to go.   

If they buy from a part-time seller, on-line, who then has to trust a delivery company to get the item to them, possibly on the other side of the country, they should only ever expect to get a delivery estimate that is imprecise and not a guarantee of anything except that the seller and the delivery company will do their best to deliver ASAP.

[myriad*seller]

It looks like all sellers will be expected to post "same day" if required by the buyer

Sellers won't be setting their own dispatch times, eBay will 

Buyers will choose express delivery, and won't be prepared to wait for the seller to post in a few days.

Sellers will be expected to go to the post office at least once a day now to comply with this simple delivery system

[abrahamtoast]

The recent argument/discussion over the last ten posts or so on this thread, contains valid points on both sides.

I think there is a presumption on here that most private sellers are really business sellers masquerading as such, and running at least semi-professional services.

These undoubtedly do account for far too large a proportion, but this is not the time to discuss that - eBay knows how we feel.

Many genuine small private sellers only list items infrequently, and so won't be up to speed with all these changes. Many of them also only list when they need cash pretty quickly, so this hold could really affect them.

As it pans out, I think a lot of the anticipated problems will depend heavily on how eBay enforces its rules around "Holds". If eBay is seen to be too keen to extend hold times, that would show their true intention, AND make it less likely for private sellers to sell here.

There needs to be a clearer explanation on what "deems" delivery. We've all seen threads where eBay's tracking system is not synchronised with Royal Mail's for example, and an item delivered, with photographic proof of delivery, is not "deemed" to be delivered by eBay, until their own systems say so. These occurrences must stop. (a cynic may argue that eBay has no interest in improving its own tracking, as, in its current state, it can justify longer holds, albeit totally unjustified)

There must be consistency, and there can not be errors. I'm sure eBay is introducing these measures to make up for the lost revenue from "free" selling, but they risk making things too complicated in their attempts to do so.

[signs_and_vintage]

From both sides of the fence here...

I prepack all my items (esp. the DVDs) and have sheets of 4xA4 stickers for my business (I currently work 50% for myself and 50% for a shady government organisation usually known only by its 3 initials...). I can often grab a few minutes to do a label sometimes as soon as it comes in and I have everything collected from the door by RM (my own business mostly Parcelforce, again collected). Sometimes, the post van is already coming for a collection, and the buyer effectively benefits from same-day-collection straight into the RM system that should have been for the following day, though some still manage to have a moan if they can! I was sat there the other day and did a label to be collected 30 seconds later as I was putting the item in the porch with the rest!

Point 1 - I do appreciate that some private sellers aren't into IT and don't have access to labels, have a porch for collection, 'don't like RM' (madness) etc... etc... forcing same day dispatch, if true - can't believe it is - isn't fair.

Point 2 - It also annoys me greatly when you buy something and a week later you are politely chasing it. 'Oh, I forgot to send it, sorry, thought the wife had. Silly me. Will get to it this weekend.' From anyone. And it happens. A fair bit.

[valueaddedresource]

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@abrahamtoast wrote:

There needs to be a clearer explanation on what "deems" delivery. We've all seen threads where eBay's tracking system is not synchronised with Royal Mail's for example, and an item delivered, with photographic proof of delivery, is not "deemed" to be delivered by eBay, until their own systems say so. These occurrences must stop. (a cynic may argue that eBay has no interest in improving its own tracking, as, in its current state, it can justify longer holds, albeit totally unjustified)

There must be consistency, and there can not be errors. I'm sure eBay is introducing these measures to make up for the lost revenue from "free" selling, but they risk making things too complicated in their attempts to do so.

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@abrahamtoast - for what it's worth, I think the explanation for what "deems" delivery on this announcement page was pretty clear.

https://pages.ebay.co.uk/paptouuksw/

• For tracked deliveries, funds will be available 2 calendar days after we receive confirmation from the tracked service that the delivery was successful
• For untracked deliveries, or tracked deliveries when there is no delivery confirmation, funds will become available 14 calendar days from the order date

That's pretty clear to me that in order to be deemed "delivered", eBay will need to see a delivery confirmation in their tracking system for tracked deliveries and untracked deliveries or tracked deliveries that don't show that confirmation will be automatically assumed to be "delivered" (for the sake of releasing funds only) 14 calendar days from the order date - of course as long as there has not been a claim filed for non-delivery in that time.

That page also goes on to define when "delivery" for the sake of funds being released is deemed to have occurred for local collection, items sent to an eBay authenticator, and items sent via Global Shipping Programme.

That being said, just because the explanation is clear about what they are looking for, doesn't mean there may not be other issues with eBay's system not always recognizing carrier updates showing a package has been delivered - and if there are those issues, then yes absolutely eBay needs to fix that.

[leon9503]

"There needs to be a clearer explanation on what "deems" delivery."

There already is and it's ignored by delivery services and eBay....Legally to be delivered it has to be 'In the hand' not left on the doorstep or in the Blue Bin!

[dch2112011]

What you say is true unless an agreement is made to leave in a safeplace such as in the ebay user agreement or RM's terms and conditions - these agreements are contractual and  the ' it must be delivered to hand law no longer applies ' such is the way contract law works when an agreement to do something different is made legally.

The only quirk would be that a contractual agreement has to be fair in law but that is another subject 

[vintique*violet]

The " system" does not work neither does eBay polices. 

I have items that have been delivered and feedback left from over 3 weeks ago and they still show - as dispatched or delivery delayed. 

I also have received items whereby similar appears - I always leave feedback to let the seller know I have my order. 

When this comes into play how much " funds" do you think eBay will be holding/ gathering? 

Then we have a recent post about an item being delivered by Evri " on the doorstep"... a buyer claimed INR .. the buyer initially won the case - Buyer appealed as his parcel not in his hand... Seller now has had his monies taken away as eBay refunded the buyer ( who may have the parcel or not, who knows?) 

 How is this a fair process?

Are we now more at the mercy of  postal services actually doing their job?

An  underhanded approach  and a misrepresentation judging by eBays policies. 

[leon9503]

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@valueaddedresource wrote:

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• For tracked deliveries, funds will be available 2 calendar days after we receive confirmation from the tracked service that the delivery was successful
• For untracked deliveries, or tracked deliveries when there is no delivery confirmation, funds will become available 14 calendar days from the order date

....of course as long as there has not been a claim filed for non-delivery in that time.

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Can see lots of unscrupulous buyers ending up with free stuff, personally at the moment I have 4 items still showing as not delivered that have been, tracked and untracked, so the system already doesn't work, going as far back as October [Only checked that far back].

[leon9503]

Very true and was going to add that to my reply but you did it for me, so thanks.

[valueaddedresource]

@vintique*violet  @leon9503  totally get where you are coming from about eBay's tracking systems having problems and how that impacts sellers - but the examples you gave seem to me to be problems that already exist and have existed for some time even before the fee-free private selling update, not something specific to that update or the changes that are coming next year either to payment processing or mandated use of Simple Delivery.

All I was saying is that the explanation eBay gave for how they will determine whether or not something has been delivered for the purpose of the new payment process was fairly clear to me - as in the way they describe it is understandable and there wasn't a question in my mind about what they are looking for in terms of delivery confirmation or what the timeframes will be for untracked packages or tracked package that do not have that confirmation.

That doesn't mean there aren't longstanding problems that eBay needs to address. For example, unscrupulous buyers have been able to get free stuff by falsely claiming non-delivery when there is no delivery scan for quite sometime under existing INR policies - that's definitely a problem, but not limited to or caused by the payout policy changes we are discussing, if that makes sense.

If eBay's systems regularly don't pick up delivery scans from RM when looking up the tracking directly with RM does show a delivery, that is also a serious problem that eBay needs to fix - but it doesn't mean the explanation of the new policy is ambiguous or needs to be made clearer, it means eBay needs to fix whatever that technical issue is that it sounds like has been a problem for a while, again not limited to or caused by the new policy.

My post was just saying that personally, I find the explanation of the new policy to be quite clear, but due to these and other issues that have been brought up, the actual execution of the new policy will be difficult and may even exacerbate other long standing issues, if not addressed by eBay before the policy is implemented next year.

[vintique*violet]

Thank for taking the time to expand on your explanation. 

I actually am aware of eBays long standing issues, however in all my 17yrs here ( granted I'm not a high quantity seller) I have never had an issue , every single item ( RM) has been delivered safely  and on time - it is not until this year that there has been issues, delays, system not working correctly etc - and this does need to be addressed by eBay I agree, before new " ideas" are put into place. All the changes implemented and those soon to be has compounded my thoughts of how these will affect everyone particularly as it is not working correctly, therefore it will just be exacerbated in my opinion. Plus reading on business " private" sellers and unscrupulous buyers ( I was naive to think they were few, it seems not)  , the search feed,  our data,  A.I.  etc... oh so many things,  I do feel that the platform has lost its way and the joy gone - eBay has lost its sparkle through greed leaving those who do take responsibility to " handle their account" with integrity, a battlefield to trudge through. The ticking of boxes has never been my strong point,  and now moreso having to " jump through hoops"  and receipt  of my funds are left in the hands of a  " Computer says..yes  No?"  😉   it has become unworkable and I have lost trust in the platform.