Buyer says watch ‘does not fit’

[fredley1234]

I recently sold a watch for £275, buyer even haggled me down and got it for a very very good price.

The watch came with full box and papers, warranty card and 3 extra links for the bracelet.

He has now opened a refund case of ‘does not fit’, I have messaged him to try and resolve and he has basically said he doesn’t know how to add the links in himself so the watch is to small for him and he wants to return. He accepts ‘trying’ to add the links in, so he has clearly been messing about with the watch and potentially caused damage or scratches. It was virtually flawless when sold.

I don’t want to accept the return, I’m concerned he’s trying to pull a fast one and the value of the watch on resale will be lower as a result. I also have a policy of not accepting returns.

I also however don’t want to lose the watch and have to refund him if he does escalate.

any advise?

[**peaseblossom** · Accepted solution]

"Doesn't fit" is classed as a change of mind reason so you should be able to refuse it but if you do decide to agree buyer has to pay the postage.

[fredley1234]

Thanks, that’s my gut, but I’m worried eBay may side with buyer if he escalates. What’s your experience in that respect?

[4_bathrooms]

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@fredley1234 wrote:

He has now opened a refund case of ‘does not fit’, I have messaged him to try and resolve and he has basically said he doesn’t know how to add the links in himself so the watch is to small for him and he wants to return. He accepts ‘trying’ to add the links in, so he has clearly been messing about with the watch and potentially caused damage or scratches. It was virtually flawless when sold.

I don’t want to accept the return, I’m concerned he’s trying to pull a fast one and the value of the watch on resale will be lower as a result. I also have a policy of not accepting returns.

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"Doesn't fit" is a remorse return reason. The listing stated returns were not accepted so you should be able to close this return request.

However, my gut feeling is that if you do close the case the buyer will subsequently open an "item not as described" return case or file a dispute with their payment provider in order to try and force a refund.

[fredley1234]

Is he able to open a second refund request after one is closed?

[tressygirl]

Not personal experience,  but experience from reading the many posts here, that yes,  eBay do tend to side with the buyer.

If the case is escalated,  you can appeal the decision for the refund,  you can put forward  the message show the buyer tried to add links to the watch,  and  if damaged now,  you could provide photos.

It's never a 100% answer for the result of a case.

Difficult one.

@fredley1234 

[4_bathrooms]

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@fredley1234 wrote:

Is he able to open a second refund request after one is closed?

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I'm not entirely sure. I know a buyer can only open one "item not as described" return case and one "remorse" return case. However, as remorse returns do not fall under the remit of eBay's Money Back Guarantee I think a buyer can open a remorse return and if that return is closed by the seller the buyer can still open an INAD return under the MBG. 

Even if the buyer can't open another return "request" via eBay there is nothing stopping them filing a dispute with their payment provider - this is something they can do up to 120 days following the sale if they used a debit or credit card to fund their purchase. If the buyer filed such a dispute claiming the watch wasn't as described you would almost certainly lose the dispute, the watch and the money.

[**peaseblossom**]

I believe buyers can only open one return per transaction but they can open a "not received" case and then a return after that.

[tressygirl]

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@fredley1234 wrote:

Is he able to open a second refund request after one is closed?

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Not with eBay,  that is,  not 2 return cases.  If an item not received case is opened, then said item received and found to be not as described , then a case for this can be opened.  That's the only time with eBay,  two cases can be opened for the same item.

However,  as has been mentioned,  a chargeback with their payment provider can still be opened.

[fredley1234]

Would a payment provider really accept a chargeback reason of ‘watch does not fit’, it’s not as if they’re the saying the watch is damage, faulty or an entirely different item. 

This is a real though one, and makes you really nervous about selling with online platforms!

[tressygirl]

Now that is  a good point !  On paper I would say you're right they wouldn't  be able to,  but so many weird and odd outcomes we hear here,  that I'm loathe to say that would be a definite yes or no.

Such a hard one to call, but end of the day,  if the buyer has opened a case for ' item does not fit', you have a No Returns so you should be able to refuse.

@fredley1234 

[4_bathrooms]

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@fredley1234 wrote:

Would a payment provider really accept a chargeback reason of ‘watch does not fit’, it’s not as if they’re the saying the watch is damage, faulty or an entirely different item. 

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A chargeback would typically be filed for a "not as described" reason.

[fredley1234]

I actually rung eBay, who said they would not intervene in this case, and that I can feel to reject the refund request without any impact to my feedback etc. they said I was in my rights to do so and would not be getting involved if the buyer escalated. 

obviously there is the chargeback potential but that’s outside of eBay’s process and unknowable. 

[missdollydaydream]

Don't ever take what an eBay agent tells you as gospel. They are usually reading from a hymn sheet!

[jefftopman]

Why doesn't the buyer take it to a watch repairer. I know that adding or removing links is an easy thing to do and for a few £ his issue would be resolved without creating hassle for the seller. Probably it wouldn't cost much more than the price they would have to pay to return it. Especially if he had a good deal when buying it. I have had to add links in the past and I was charged very little and it only took a few minutes.

[department28]

Yes - you would think if the buyer really wanted the watch, they would be willing to pay a relatively small sum to get the links added. Sounds like when they realised they weren't able to easily do it themselves, they didn't want to be bothered with it. The OP is right to be concerned that if they accepted the return, the watch would have signs of being tinkered with.

I hope refusing the return will be the end of the matter. It's great to make a sale, but the dreaded 'buyer has requested a return' message always makes your heart sink... 😬

[fredley1234]

I am going to refuse it today, was letting it stew in my head for a little while first!

yes, it’s clear buyers remorse, and I’m grateful he didn’t abuse (or know to abuse) the not as described function. 

I’ve heard stories in the watch communities of people buying second hand, replacing the movements and then returning them. Also the warranty is virtually nulled now in my eyes - I have no idea if he’s tampered with the watch which would void the warranty. And then there is the fact that he’s potentially caused damage to the watch with his handling and attempt to replace the links.

like you say, why doesn’t he just take it to the jewellers! If he wants his money back he’ll have to try and sell it now himself.

[mawels_87]

I've sold watches and always have fitted any the spare links myself before selling.  I've then listed with very near approx wrist size of the watch and bracelet.  And then say links can be removed for a smaller wrist. I don't know if this is right or wrong but never had any comeback form buyers. Watches I've purchased myself though where sellers have listed as having spare links have turned out to be links from a completely different watch. That has happened a few times and I've had to return whole orders back to the seller.  

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[vinylscot]

Before you reject the return, please bear in mind the following, which does not seem to have been mentioned above.

If the buyer lodges a chargeback through his bank or credit card company, eBay will almost certainly accept it, and recoup the payment from you. There will be no request, from eBay or the bank, to return the item. So, you may well find yourself paying back the full amount you received, AND you may not receive the watch back at all (damaged or not).

It's your call. I'm glad it's not mine.

[fredley1234]

I imagine in that case though he will risk having his account banned on eBay.