Changes to Feedback in the Selling Experience

[uk-news@ebay]

Introducing two new changes to feedback 

Over the past few months, we’ve been working to improve the feedback experience. We are making these changes in order to give potential buyers better insight into your products. 

We’ve started to introduce images on feedback for listings with more than one unit

Starting this month, some sellers will be able to preview feedback images on their own sold items for listings with multiple quantities. At this time, other eBay buyers and sellers will not be able to view images in your feedback. Once this rollout is complete, we will update you as we expand image feedback visibility to other eBay members.

To date, we’ve received just shy of a million feedback images from buyers on multi-quantity listings - and the vast majority showcase the great products and positive experiences buyers have had with sellers.

We appreciate that there may be some concerns that not all of the images posted will be positive. But rest assured, we take the protection of your reputation very seriously and have built moderation systems that review photos for inappropriate material. 

You’ll be able to report any inappropriate feedback images in the same way that you’d typically report inappropriate text feedback. We’ll review the reported feedback and take action to remove it if it violates policy.

For more information, visit our images, video and text policy.

We’ve updated the default sort to highlight the most relevant feedback

A large share of feedback is made up of generic feedback like “A+++ eBayer” or one word answers like “good”. However, in an age where buyers are increasingly looking at reviews before making a purchase, this isn’t always helpful. 

By updating the default sort on listings to highlight the most relevant feedback and deprioritise more generic feedback, this will enable buyers to receive a better understanding of what’s great about your products.

Please note that this is simply the default sort. Buyers will still be able to see feedback for all previous transactions, and on your feedback profile page, buyers can easily sort feedback by timeframe should they want to.

[tidyingupanddownsizing]

Anita

Your comment -  'To change the default sort order, you'll need to go to Feedback profile > See All feedback > Filter > Sort by Most relevant/Most recent.'  is accurate BUT it completely misses the problem/point here:

The problem is that most potential buyers will just look at the default feedback served up by ebay and make judgements based on that ie they won't change anything. Because ebay have set the default at 'most relevant' my potential buyers currenlty see the following feedback first:

"Brilliant product top quality and matched the part number and the picture perfectly Seller gave me some great care and attention. The item was sent out fast and in a good quality box So many thanks for a great experience I would highly recommend this seller and I would definitely buy again from him." [ nb that was for a £6.75 item with free post]

My belief is that this feedback sounds made up and i'd rather it was never seen again

IF the default was 'most recent'  it would gradually dissapear into the past

SO : A direct question: can I set the default on my own feedback to most recent? Do i have control of my own default?  If yes, tell me how. If no, please take this example and use it as necessary to communicate seller dis-satisfaction / annoyance at this feedback 'most relevant' system.

ALSO : can we PLEASE change negative and neutral visibility back to 'last 12 months' only?

[amphibolous]

eBay simply need to read this thread, or the equivalent one on eBay.com to see that almost nobody can see the logic or positivity in these changes. The only sensical approach is chronological order by default, and 12 month rolling feedback, just as before.

[moldosgifts]

I thought feedback was on the seller not their products. A product review us for the product not the seller.

All this photo thing use useless to me , how i handle any problems is far more relevent and how another seller the same.

[unclestein]

They need to read the Truspilot reviews!

[rainbowtrax]

Thanks anita@ebay, I now have it on the app. It wasn't available when I posted. I take it this is going to be inflicted on the desktop version soon as well. 🙄

It seems that ebay's systems haven't yet grasped what is relevant for future buyers to see to gain an idea on how good a seller is. Over 19,000 feedback comments that the system could choose from so it's not exactly short on options but ebay's system has this at position 6:

So thanks for this latest feedback "improvement" ebay. Way to go!

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[tidyingupanddownsizing]

Anita

I've had a brilliant idea [ well i think so]  which - i think - may solve this issue with feedback to the satisfaction of both ebay AND sellers

ebay say the problem that they are trying to sort with feedback is 'one word' and 'generic' feedback in the belief that they clog up the feedback system and mean buyers don't see more relevant comments

so  SUGGESTION :  keep system as it was previously [ ie default: most recent first]

and simply don't display:

any feedback of less than eg 5 words

words / phrases   on a 'generic' list [ that ebay can define]

And thats the only change needed - the more informative comments will then be displayed 

nb don't insist on longer feedback being left [ we don't need compulsion]  just leave rules as they currently are 

This also requires very little programming so could be implemented very quickly

Other ebayers - do you agree or disagree? Please leave a brief message of 'agree' or 'disagree' then anita will have a good indication on what we - collectively - want from feedback

[insidethe93]

Years ago Amazon used to require a minimum of 20 words in a review. But reviewers would say, for instance: "Great. The rest are words merely so as to reach the minimum number of words required to post a review."  Amazon soon stopped imposing a minimum.

[tidyingupanddownsizing]

Which is why i am insistant there should be no compulsion on feedback length. Just let buyers continue as they currently do BUT let  ebay filter out the very short ones [ nb continue to use all feedback to calculate feedback numbers but simply filter what is displayed ]

[wellingnorth]

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@rainbowtrax wrote:

It seems that ebay's systems haven't yet grasped what is relevant for future buyers to see to gain an idea on how good a seller is. Over 19,000 feedback comments that the system could choose from so it's not exactly short on options but ebay's system has this at position 6:

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This seems like a really good example of what is wrong with this. On balance my own feedback probably looks better

with this new view, with the buyers who thank you for careful packaging, etc pushed to the top, but if it can also give results like the above it seems like the algorithm must not really be ready yet and can't really understand what is most relevant? Could there be a mechanism to challenge the promotion of particular feedback entries? For example the entry above you could challenge on the basis of irrelevance (as an aside, if you ask ChatGPT about the feedback above it can tell you that it is not relevant to the seller's performance)

But conceptually maybe this is wrong also as perhaps the most effusive feedback is not most relevant anyway, if a seller has 100 feedbacks that say 'okay, thanks' and then one that says 'amazing' and goes into great detail, is that most relevant or would that be better seen in date order in the middle of all the shorter comments, would that be a more complete picture of the seller's overall performance? Perhaps displaying the number of transactions and the number of feedbacks left might be a good idea?

People above have mentioned older negative feedbacks having more visibility now and I also found one vexatious / verbose false positive feedback was pushed up my list. At the time I didn't reply to the feedback because I was aware it would drop off the first page of feedback soon enough so it does seem slightly unfair that this could be dredged back up again. Again maybe sellers should be able to challenge this and ask for de-promotion of a feedback as a 'false positive'.

[wellingnorth]

I meant to add that one of the annoying things with this for sellers is that because we can't see inside the algorithm, if it throws up odd results it can be very frustrating. With the old system comments are in date order, everyone can understand how it works and it's predictable, but now we will never really know for sure why some comments may be ranked more highly.

It seems similar to the issue with estimated delivery dates which has the same kind of black box decision making. The intention with the algorithm may be good, but it means that sellers can't predict what will be displayed to buyers and often can't begin to understand how dates have been arrived at which leads to a lot of frustration. In both cases maybe the simpler approach is better.

[rainbowtrax]

Unfortunately, as we see numerous examples of on ebay every day, anything that employs an algorithm instead of a human to perform a task is only as good as the programming that tells it what to do - which is very often not very good at all. Algorithms and AI can only ever be artificial replacements for the task performed by a human, programmed for speed but never as good. They don't have a human brain to think with and use human thought processes along with "logic" to decide what to spew out. It's all just auto generated according to what's been programmed. If the programming behind the "logic" isn't actually logical then it won't work adequately. Done properly it can be ok and even pretty good although it'll never be perfect.

In the main, we can see that a lot of these bad algorithms on ebay are just being programmed to search and pull out random words without being honed to use any context at all. It's the same problem across many aspects of the site:

this feedback algorithm;

the search algorithm returning poor results because it's programmed to latch onto one word somewhere in the item specifics or even the description instead of just searching the title to match what's been entered as a search;

the fantasy estimated delivery dates because the algorithm is programmed to use a "complex mathematical formula" which is invented and mathematically unsound instead of the irrefutably correct simple mathematical formula of seller's stated despatch time + courier's stated delivery estimate (that is the only correct formula for an EDD and that is basic arithmetic. There isn't an alternative formula and no one can choose to just invent one out of thin air, mathematically it isn't possible so what on earth are ebay using?);

the so-called AI generated descriptions which are just another algorithm that pulls words at random from the title and item specifics then mixes them up with a load of waffle to create a couple of nonsensical paragraphs (we're now getting posts about SNAD returns because the seller didn't read their own description);

the listing form that tries to pre-populate item specifics by using a similar algorithm to pull odd unrelated words from the title, mixing them together and shoehorning them into whichever item specific takes its fancy (the reason why every music item with "sealed" in the title automatically gets the artist assigned as Seal and why every blues record gets assigned blue as the colour of the vinyl...and similar results in all other categories);

the left filters that are supposed to link with what's been entered for each item specific independently but instead have a wrongly programmed algorithm that populates the left filter options with words from elsewhere in the title or even description instead of populating each left filter from what its matching item specific contains (the reason why the left filters currently show that I have 16 records by The Band when you filter using the Artist item specific - not one of them is by The Band nor do I claim them to be by The Band. Obviously it also thinks I have 5 by Seal - I don't). 

The concept of ebay is great and the site could be great again. I still buy and sell on ebay but I used to love it more than I do now. At the moment it's being dragged down by bad algorithms that don't work for users, either buyers or sellers, due to poor programming and, in some areas like this feedback one, needless implementation. Sometimes simple and straightforward is best. Continually rolling out pointless algorithms for this and that is not needed and certainly not wanted by those who use ebay, especially when there is so much already malfunctioning. We just want a site that functions as it should, where 1 + 1 = 2. At the moment we could be told that 1 + 1 = the square root of a pink elephant and be expected to just accept it.

[tommystrezures]

If I could give you a double thumbs up for that post I would! Excellent @rainbowtrax  - Ebay I hope you are reading and taking notes...... "To pass back to the relevant team so you can inform us when you have an update"

[theelench]

Totally agree.  Particularly about the the FDDs and the Listing Form.

Trying to list a "Ring Holder / Tree" results in a fight with AI which insists it belongs in Decorative Tableware > Bowls  (where some selllers are listing them).  I've, after a struggle, tried listing them in "Trays and Sets" which is more appropriate but, it seems that listed there they are not picked up by the search and get few views.

Definitely NOT a "magical listing experience".

[goingfishinguk]

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@rainbowtrax wrote:

Obviously it also thinks I have 5 by Seal - I don't). 

...and we are never going to survive unless we get a little crazy.  Great post btw, thanks.

[louisianna]

Im just asking 'Please don't'
Only people leaving negative reviews will bother to upload photos.

[knit-in-styles]

I too think that would be a good idea like Vinted for automatic feedback to be left however that would decrease revenue for eBay because our defect percentage for late delivery would be much lower. We are currently penalised just now because it is calculated on total feedback received in a 12 month period and we all know probably only around 30% of buyers (if that) actually leave feedback.

Strangely enough, my defaulted feedback seems to highlight problems with Royal Mail delivery along with showing  a negative (if you actually click on the negative feedback) from years ago which is all rather concerning. 

[plpmr]

As i said in a previous post here -

Feedback is voluntary and to make it otherwise could mean more bad feedback for sellers.

[moldosgifts]

The fedback system was devalued years ago when sellers could not leave negative for buyers.

Any changes will not redress that.

[padanpcparts]

Thing is, who doesn't use generic feedback? If your a busy E-bay seller and to a degree busy buyer, do you really have time to write half a dozen specific feedbacks a day? I copy paste 'Good thanks', to literally all my feedback. How is that less valuable than an essay? Am I right? 

[bennotbill]

I think anyone who has been on eBay for more than five minutes has a few short feedbacks that they copy and paste for buying or selling. Anything else is a waste of time.

As far as feedback goes eBay set a good example here as where's the feedback to customers replies from uk-news@ebay