SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

The UKs Supreme Court have struck down the SNPs 'Named Person' scheme

 

 

 

Now according to Wee Nippy and Her acolytes - this is a simple scheme that gives every Kid, one person that can act for them - Maybe a Teacher, Health Visitor (for smaller kids) or some other Non related Adult - just to keep an eye on them

 

But as You strip away the soft sell , You find out, that the East German STASI could have designed it

 

The Named Person can see everyone of the Families Health Records - Everybody in the family, even Your Older kids who might be at UNI etc

 

The Named Person can see ALL the Families  Financial details

 

and thats just 2 examples, there are loads of frightening intrusive measures into ALL of the families life

 

Remember this is not only for Children on the radar of Social services - this is for EVERY Child in Scotland

 

A Named Person is to watch out for the Childs 'Wellbeing' - a word that could mean anything

 

-------------------

 

 

This website has loads of examples of how the scheme has went awry in nearly every area, it's been trialed

 

 

But You don't need to believe people like myself, who have been organising against this scheme for a few years

 

Just watch some OFFICIAL Council training videos - that No2NP has obtained, they show a lot more about How things will turn out in practice instead of what the Government say will happen

 

they are on this Page.

 

http://no2np.org/watch-new-training-for-named-persons/

 

Message 1 of 32
See Most Recent
31 REPLIES 31

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Anonymous
Not applicable

What a mess!

Message 2 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

That is absolutely appalling, who but an extreme left nutcase could have come up with such an idea in the first place?

 

Years ago we had a health visitor who was more concerned with finding fault than being at all useful.

 

Eventually she was told in no uncertain terms, to go forth and multiply.

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 3 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

The UK Supreme Court has ruled the Scottish Government's Named Person scheme is "incompatible" with the European Convention of Human Rights.

 

http://stv.tv/news/politics/1362033-supreme-court-rules-named-person-scheme-breaches-human-rights/

 

Just as well Theresa May hasn't scrappped it Yet





We are many,They are few
Message 4 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Few people realise the benefits they get from the Human Rights Commission and just concentrate on the handful of cases where it seems to go against the public interest.

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 5 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

bank, quite simply a dictator would want something like that and that is exactly what nasty nicola and her SNP buddies want to be ! the dictators of Scotland and they are leading the sheeples who believe every contorted word she says.

Democracy my arris ! she and her like will keep pushing and lying until they get what they want and when it goes t**s up they will then try and lay the blame at someone elses door.

Message 6 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

I'm just staggered it was ever suggested in the first place.

 

It's hard to imagine there wouldn't have been a huge upswell of resistance were they ever to have brought it in, how would they have been able to enforce it?

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 7 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Revealed -

 

What can happen when a Named person reports on Your child

 

 

The Named Person scheme is to be rolled out across Scotland in August but one father’s experience of the pilot rings alarm bells for its many opponents

The handwritten note on an official form read: “Mr Smith feels it is impossible to stop his youngest son from sucking his thumb as he needs it for comfort. Did not appear to take advice on board fully.

 

The words, written by the two-year-old thumbsucker’s Named Person, sent a shiver down the spine of Andrew Smith [not his real name], a father-of-two young boys and a respected academic at one of Scotland’s leading universities. (St Andrews)

Contained within a 60-page document that had been compiled about his family, the note referred to a blister which had appeared on the toddler’s thumb as a result of the childhood habit. It also suggested Smith contact his GP if the blister became “hot to touch or very red”.

Smith, whose name has been withheld to protect the identities of his children, grew more alarmed as he leafed through the document, the vast majority of which had been redacted.

The surviving extracts appeared to indicate that the minutiae of his family life had been recorded in painstaking detail for almost two years, under a Named Person scheme which has been introduced in his part of the country ahead of its final roll-out across all of Scotland in August. A separate note made by the Named Person charged with keeping an eye on the academic’s two little boys was concerned with nappy rash.

 

“Suggests infrequent changes of soiled nappy though difficult to assess this,” the Named Person – a health visitor – jotted down.

For Smith, the contentious scheme was redolent of a Big Brother-style snoopers’ charter. Also of concern was the tone of the notes.

“I felt shocked and vulnerable,” he told Scotland on Sunday. “Then I felt angry and powerless when I saw these notes made of very trivial things and constant surveillance of small things that are part of everyday parenting – a total lack of respect and confidence in the parents. You have no control over this. I maintain that the hearsay put in there is false.

“But they won’t let me correct it. I have provided them with independent accounts that show that some of those statements are false, but they refuse to enter them. So the impression is that they are trying to build a case against me.”

Another entry described the effects of a runny nose on his youngest as “crusts on his face from nasal discharge” and reported that someone, whose name had been redacted, was concerned that the child’s face “appeared to have been left for a long time without cleaning”.

Reference was made to the youngest child having a “depressed mood”, which was now “no longer a problem”.

Smith’s shock was compounded by the fact that work on this dossier, known as a Family Record, had started without his knowledge. He had only discovered its existence by accident long after the details of his home life had begun to be recorded. Furthermore, it was only after an eight-month battle with his local health board that he managed to obtain a redacted version of the document, which began to be compiled after an acrimonious break-up with his wife which led to a protracted legal row over access to their two children.

Eventually their dispute was settled out of court and his two sons stay with him most of the time while his estranged wife has access on certain days of the week. To his relief the Family Record has finally been closed.

Nevertheless, there was a bitter aftertaste as he talked about his Named Person experience at the end of a week that saw the hugely controversial scheme become one of the hot issues on the Scottish election campaign trail.

It would appear that voters are waking up to the fact that the Children and Young People (Scotland) Act 2014 comes into force in four months time. From 1 August all children in Scotland will be allocated a Named Person to look out for their welfare. The Named Person will act as a single point of contact with the ability to share information with social and other services if there is cause for concern about the way a child is behaving or being brought up.

In preparation for the law’s introduction, many parts of the country, including Smith’s area, have already established a Named Person scheme under the Scottish Government’s Getting it right for every child (GIRFEC) guidelines. Under GIRFEC, a Named Person is told to think about a child’s needs using a “well-being wheel” comprising seven “well-being” indicators known as SHANARRI, standing for safe, healthy, achieving, nurtured, active, respected and responsible. Smith’s experience has prompted him to speak against it at meetings organised by those campaigning against the legislation.

“I find it sinister. I find it very creepy. I find it chilling,” he said. “They just hoover up all of this hearsay and then collate it into huge documents and on to databases. Under the new legislation all sorts of people have access to these databases. All they need is four or five reasons for intervention and they can hoover up information from any database and there is no control over whether this is true or not.”

The Named Person scheme has been denounced as a State Guardian system by its detractors, who claim those who act as Named Persons, including health visitors and headteachers, undermine the role of parents.

But many support it. The question is whether it is, as Smith contends, a gross intrusion into family life or a necessary and welcome initiative that will do what it was designed to do – protect children from harm.

Is having a Named Person making notes about thumb-sucking, nappy rash and emotional wellbeing a sensible precaution when families face difficult circumstances – or is it an insidious invasion of privacy?

Message 8 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Anonymous
Not applicable

I find it very worrying. Especially as the shared information will be open to abuse.

It also will create more red tape than there already is and it will take training of many people, which will cost a lot of money. We all know that is not going to happen. Social services are always understaffed and most organisations connected with it. So, many mistakes will be made as most people will be out of their depth dealing with these kind of things. You can just wait for it to happen.

Anyone with a grudge can report you and there will be no end to the stress parents will be put under.

 

 

 

Message 9 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

I don't like the idea of the 'Big Brother' aspect of the scheme but there is patently a problem regarding the safety of children.  

 

One life is too many but thankfully the headline cases such as we have seen recently are relatively speaking extremely rare - far more common and just as worrying are the very large number of children being 'groomed' by strangers and those abused by family members and family 'friends'.

 

In the last few days in Scotland seventy seven suspected paedophiles have been arrested, thirty million images seized and more than five hundred victims identified.

 

Children at risk need to be identified earlier but I don't know how this can be achieved without invading the privacy of those not at risk, a form of 'abuse' itself, (albeit benign).

Message 10 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

As they say,there's always two sides:

 

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-29076446

 

Sheriff Anderson found: “Having determined that on the balance of probabilities neglect was a contributory factor, the following defects in the system contributed to Declan’s death.

“There was no system in place whereby one of the agencies responsible for Declan’s well-being was in overall charge and there was no system whereby one named individual was responsible for coordinating all available information.





We are many,They are few
Message 11 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

To bring in even more intrusive systems which carry an large invasion of privacy risk, is of little use if the present systems are not being properly utilised and thus are inefficient.

 

Being unable to knock a nail in with a hammer because you can't use a hammer properly, will not be cured by using a bigger hammer..

 

 

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 12 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

The problem is though that there isn't any hammer - in so many of the child abuse cases that get reported lack of communication between those who have contact with the child seems to be a common denominator.

Message 13 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

The hammer exists, it's more that those heading the various agencies just don't use it properly.

 

The danger of the proposal judging by the pilot scheme, is that dossiers will be compiled largely based on personal opinions and hearsay with no means for them to be checked for accuracy or corrected where they carry falsehoods and such dossiers will go on a data base accessible by who knows?

 

Having experienced the prejudice of a health visitor, the idea that that her opinions could go towards such a dossier and carry weight, fills me with horror.  Parents could be assumed guilty of poor parenting with no evidence.

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 14 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Anonymous
Not applicable

Creeky,

It might not feel so "benign" if you are the one under investigation when you have done nothing wrong. The stress can break people. It can alienate them from friends and family when information is wrongly processed, they can lose their jobs, put strain on their relationships etc... Once you have been given a label it will be hard to get rid of it.

 

I agree that children at risk need to be identified as early as possible, but it should not be left to people who are not trained to assess and handle this properly. There are already too many mistakes made by those that are supposedly qualified, so how will it go when teachers or learning support workers are thrown into the mix. They are not trained to look into sensitive family circumstances. Only severe cases will reach the headlines, but what of all the mistakes you never hear about.

 

My head teacher at primary school was the biggest B you could imagine. Heaven forbid if he would have had any say in family affairs.

I've seen a cleaning lady getting a job as a support worker at a refuge for abused women. She had no training whatsoever for the role. Someone who did have the proper training was passed over, as she was seen as a threat by the manager (who wasn't managing things very good, she was a bully). The cleaning lady was obviously no threat to her. I'm sure this wasn't an isolated incident. It happens all over the place.

So would you want any of those people become the Named Person?

 

 

 

Message 15 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

It seems to me that where there is little or no problems, so-called experts will find a big issue. They seem to descend like a ton of bricks on "easy targets" = compliant people but fight shy of dealing with the "tougher element" and we see many cases where children have ended up dead because of that.

 

Although a bit different to that which had been proposed, I think people should remember and learn from this fiasco (they never learn though do they?):-

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cleveland_child_abuse_scandal

 

 



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

Message 16 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Anonymous
Not applicable

One of my main worries would be the fact that social services are practically permanently understaffed. The Named people will have other jobs that take up their time and they won't be able to dedicate enough time to each case, besides lacking the training.

Therefor things will get missed or not looked at properly and maybe too quickly decided without enough data to support the actions taken. The frequent contact necessary with a child and the family would not be possible and thus monitoring a case thorough enough to come to the right conclusions or interventions doubtful.

Good communication between all the different parties that would deal with a case would be of prime importance and that is something I seriously doubt would happen. It only takes one person to forget to pass something on that might be important and things could go badly wrong...as we all know has happened in the past.

 

I don't have the answers, but good thorough training and having more than enough skilled people and the time to work for the safety of children would be needed for sure.

Message 17 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

It appears to me to be the State undermining the role of parents and that it will be for the State to decide whether or not a child is flourishing and what the parents must do and how they must do it.

 

It wouldn't be so bad if it were only aimed at children of risk but it's aimed at all children.

 

In my experience I saw this.

 

Standard yearly medical at school spots a slight throat inflammation, not bad enough for the child to complain about.

 

Doctor's opinion, it will clear up by itself, no treatment necessary.

 

Health visitor's opinion, which under the scheme would be recorded.    The mother was at fault for not attending the medical at the school (not something required) and the child's throat inflammation required the removal of their tonsils.

 

The eight indicators in the wellbeing wheel are areas in which children and young people need to progress in order to do well now and in the future. They allow practitioners to structure information (which may identify needs and concerns), and to plan. They are used to record observations, events and concerns and when putting together a child’s plan. The My World Triangle and the Resilience Matrix are then used to gather, structure and assist in the analysis of information.

http://www.gov.scot/Topics/People/Young-People/gettingitright/national-practice-model/observing-reco...

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 18 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

I don't have the answer either Harry.

 

How do you identify children who are at risk if you cannot or are not allowed to record information on all children?

 

Should doctors and hospitals report cases where they suspect abuse and if so, to whom do they report?

 

Should teachers do the same, what about Scouting and Guide leaders or the local football coach?

 

If a suspicion is reported and determined not to be a 'valid' report should it be kept on record or destroyed.

 

There are so many questions and so few answers which is why those animals in the North West got away with grooming and abusing young girls for years - there was no one responsible for their care and those who were in 'authority'  had no central point to voice and record their concerns and coordinate a system of care.

 

It is very easy to say that schemes such as this undermines parent responsibility, and I agree they do, it mustn't be forgotten that there are many parents who have already abrogated that responsibility - what happens to those children?

Message 19 of 32
See Most Recent

SNPs Orwellian 'Named Person' for all kids scheme, blocked by Judges

Members of professional bodies that deal with children are already expected to inform social services of they have a particular concern about a child and of course a record would be kept of such a report.

 

The problem with the Scottish proposal is that children would be expected to fit a decided mould through their lives and any deviation would be recorded in their dossier. Whether or not such deviation would truly mean the child was abused or neglected would be immaterial. It would be a tick box exercise.

The private information recorded could also be shared with other public bodies without consent being needed thus being a breach of the right to privacy and a family life.

 

Part of the judgment gives a good idea of the Supreme Court's opinion.

 

“The first thing that a totalitarian regime tries to do is to get at the children, to distance them from the subversive, varied influences of their families, and indoctrinate them in their rulers’ view of the world. Within limits, families must be left to bring up their children in their own way.”

 

A large part of the problem in the North West was that often the young girls involved were regarded as the offender and not the victim.

___________________________________________________________
Parents of young, organic life forms are warned that towels can be harmful if swallowed in large quantities.
Message 20 of 32
See Most Recent