Drug smuggling grandmother.

[astrologica]

Over the weekend, Lindsay Sandiford, who was sentenced to death by firing squad for smuggling drugs to Indonesia, has announced that she is almost next in line to be executed. The authorities in Indonesia have taken a very hard line and have recently begun a wave of executions. An online appeal for funds for her to fight the execution has raised a pitiful amount.
I have been thinking about this and I don't really know where I would stand on this issue. Half of me has pity for her and thinks that she should be reprieved, but the other half has no pity for her and has more pity for the victims of drug smuggling who have their lives ruined. What do you good folks think......would you give her a reprieve?

[cee-dee]

No.

[Anonymous]

Everyone who wants to smuggle drugs knows the price when caught in those countries, so I can't feel much pity. I do pity her family members who might not have known that she did. If she is a grandmother you would think she'd know better than to do something that stupid.

I don't think anyone should get the death penalty by the way.

[wentvaleelect]

They know the risks, they know countries like this come down hard on scum like these so I've no sympathy for them. How many have died addicted to drugs, and the misery drugs bring to the relatives in their wake.

[malacandran]

Why should her being a "grandmother" make any difference to the crime she committed, and her punishment for it.

Is it a legal principle that being a grandmother, entitles you to get let off from doing a crime?

[suzieseaside]

Yes I would give her a reprieve.  I don't like capital punishment and I have no faith in the 'fairness' of the Indonesian courts.

She claims that threats were made against her family if she didn't carry the drugs, and who knows what the truth is.

Yes, I think she was stupid to ever get herself into such a position by associating with Ponder, Dougall and Beales, but I don't trust the judicial system in many countries where bribes are taken and where the organisers of drug crime are not punished to the same degree. It's likely that money talks irrespective of guilt.  The people she carried the drugs for only received 1 to 6 years sentence.

As Steve hill posted below the article about Lindsay Sandiford in the Independent:

There is a considerable disparity between the sentence handed down to Sandford and the other members of "her" gang who were also tried.

She allegedly carried the drugs for a British antiques dealer living in Bali, Julian Ponder, and his partner Rachel Dougall, and their associate Paul Beales. She co-operated with police in a sting operation to arrest them when she collected the drugs. The prosecution acknowledged that she assisted, and in recognition of this sought a 15 year sentence, not the death penalty. The judge ignored that.

Ponder faced the same charge, and received a 6 year sentence.

Dougall and Beales faced lesser charges and received one-year and four-year sentences respectively.

It seems fairly obvious that these people had sufficient money to buy their way out of trouble while hanging Sandiford out to dry. And that people in the Indonesian "justice" system received that money.

[suzieseaside]

Another one - Mary Jane Veluso, from the Phillippines is to be executed tomorrow.  She was a victim not a criminal.

Change.org have a petition to try to get a reprieve against her execution.  They explain what happened to her:

Mary Jane Veloso was taken into custody in Indonesia, due to the discovery of heroin in the lining of the suitcase that she carried to Indonesia. We believe that Mary Jane Veloso is a victim of Human Trafficking, who is innocent of knowingly carrying drugs.

Coming from a poor family in the northern Philippines, she had already once worked as a domestic worker (maid) in Dubai but returned to the Philippines after a few months. Mary Jane was the victim of attempted **bleep** in her place of employment; she left her employer due to the continued threat and likelihood of being raped if she stayed.

Mary Jane’s efforts to find a new employer as a maid through job-placement agencies brought no work. Mary Jane was recruited by a family friend (God-sister) Kristina “Tintin” Sergio under the false information that she was being employed as a domestic worker (maid) in Malaysia. Even upon arrival in Malaysia, Mary Jane understood that she would be working as a maid. Mary Jane’s recruiter, who Mary Jane trusted as a friend, bought her clothes and personal items. Finally, her recruiter’s boyfriend gifted Mary Jane with a suitcase. Mary Jane insists that she had no knowledge of the drugs that were hidden in the lining of the suitcase.

As a single mother of two, young sons, Mary Jane was desperate for employment which made her vulnerable to the Human Traffickers. Not fluent in English and limited in formal education, Mary Jane was swept up in a flood of circumstances that resulted in her conviction: she had no legal counsel for most of the process, she did not understand most of the proceedings, and her family received death threats from the drug syndicate, warning them not to go to the media or seek help.

Those who recruited and manipulated Mary Jane should be pursued, prosecuted, and convicted--not Mary Jane, who is a desperate and vulnerable victim of Human Trafficking.

There is no way that I can condone the execution of this poor woman.

[Anonymous]

I didn't know the back ground of the situation Suzie. I hardly ever read a newspaper.

Knowing this now  I hope she somehow escapes the death sentence.

[ravendays]

Let's face it our wonderful government won't even get involved with innocents abroad so they are hardly going to help the guilty...

[astrologica]

Thank you all for your input...some interesting responses there. I still don't know what to think. I have no sympathy for drug smugglers or dealers at all. And I don't have much of a problem with the death penalty either in some cases. For some murderers, like the brutal killers of Lee Rigby, or those that murder children, I would be willing to do the job myself...no problem. But there does seem to be some questionable aspects in her case, and I don't know whether I could go along with seeing her shot. And not because she is a grandmother...that doesn't make her a special case. I would think that another ten years in that he'll hole would be appropriate for her.
Drugs are a scourge...and an example must be shown. But the death penalty?.........I think I am wavering towards a longer jail sentence.

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@wentvaleelect wrote:

They know the risks, they know countries like this come down hard on scum like these so I've no sympathy for them. How many have died addicted to drugs, and the misery drugs bring to the relatives in their wake.

---

The danger with the argument that the offenders knew the risk of carrying out certain activities and therefore deserve no sympathy is attractive but dangerous.

What about the man who renounced his faith in Saudi Arabia and has received a death sentence - he knew the risk in doing what he did - should we have no sympathy for him?

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/saudiarabia/11431509/Saudi-Arabia-court-gives-d...

Or the blogger who is to receive a thousand lashes and possibly a death sentence - still no sympathy?

http://www.foxnews.com/world/2015/03/02/saudi-blogger-sentenced-to-1000-lashes-may-now-face-death-pe...

Is it only when we agree that the activities individuals have been accused of make them 'scum' that we tend to support the sentence imposed.  Doing so however undermines the argument, they knew the risk so no sympathy or "if you can't do the time then don't do the crime".

Nation States have the right to determine what is legal and the penalties to be imposed for activities that aren't.  That doesn't mean that individuals and states don't also have the right to condemn other countries' laws and describe their legal penalties as barbaric.

I personally consider state murder as barbaric - simply my own view.

[suzieseaside]

Eight of the nine scheduled for execution today were killed by firing squad but Mary Jane Veluso (who I mentioned above) was granted a last minute reprieve.  I'm glad to hear that.  

[suzieseaside]

http://www.theguardian.com/world/live/2015/apr/28/bali-nine-andrew-chan-myuran-sukumaran-executed-in...

[jd.linklater]

God only knows what Kim Jong Un would do with drug offenders, he's executed 15 people this year already for little more than disagreeing with him.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-32511431