Wickedness.

[cee-dee]

How else can you describe what's happened in Manchester?

Although there's as yet been no confirmed link to any "organisation" or followers of any "group", it's probably going to be determined soon.

SO, isn't it about time that certain beliefs are picked apart in an effort to show that such beliefs are a complete and utter load of garbage? Waging deliberate war on non-combatants is the ultimate act of cowardice and dealing with those involved or concerned after the event doesn't really help. The way forward is prevention and re-education to show those current followers that their way is the wrong path to follow.

At present, it seems that no-one dares to raise a voice in opposition for fear of retalliation and such retalliation seems to be the only way such brainwashed "followers" respond. They won't listen to any form of criticism or enter any form of discussion about "their way". Violence is all they "know".

It's all down to "control", follow us or suffer the consequences.

Unfortuately, some amongst us may well respond to such acts of wanton terror by resorting to violence of a like kind and it may well be that other "innoicents" might suffer. Where will it all end?

[javikha_4]

I am sure all those international agencies are all wrong and I should have read autotrader's international parts section, instead

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@astrologica wrote:

Maybe it's time for a few internment camps for all those people who the police and authorities say are 'on our radar'. Why are they walking the streets , with the ability to do what they did in Manchester? If they are foreign and 'on the radar' then deport them. If they are British and 'on the radar' then intern them.

incidentally....I see that Calais is becoming a very dangerous place again, in spite of the camp being razed to the ground a while ago. Lorries and tourists are once again having to run the gauntlet of those trying to get here illegally.

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And we all know how effective internment camps are - not!

Start locking up people, (again), without a fair trial and the terrorists have won.

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@mikes*corvettes wrote:

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@upthecreekyetagain wrote:

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@mikes*corvettes wrote:

Whose parents are Libyan refugees.

If they were not allowed in here then he wouldn't have been here to do what he did, would he ?

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And what reason would you have had 20/30 years ago to stop a Libyan refugee settling here. 

Easy, (and lazy), to look back and say that an individual was a 'risk' - not so easy to look forward and identify an individual or group that will be a risk sometime in the future.

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Pc Yvonne Fletcher and Lockerbie good enough reasons ?

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No - both those horrific acts were linked to Gaddafi and his regime - Abedi's parents were fleeing from the same regime and have since returned to Libya following the overthrow of Gaddafi. 

What I don't understand is why this murderer was apparently allowed free entry back into the UK without investigation just days ago following a visit to Libya and possibly Syria, despite laws being put in place potentially making such trips illegal. 

It is also incidentally being reported that a number of members of the Muslim community had reported Abedi's behaviour to the police via the 'Prevent' initiative.

[astrologica]

My post said 'maybe'........it was a suggestion. I don't have the answers to this problem. And I doubt if you and other liberal minded people on here would be so magnanimous if you were, today, planning a funeral for your little eight year old daughter, murdered by these animals. What would be your solution? Do you have one? Or are you , like most liberals today, nice and cosy in life and unlikely to be affected in any way by these things?

My grandson lives and works in Cardiff. I spoke to him yesterday and he said that Cardiff looked like downtown Beirut.....crawling with armed police and soldiers. Reassuring to some, yes, but this is the UK..in 2017....is this the future of this country? If so, then we have made some very bad mistakes, and we continue to do so. Not rounding up these 'on the radar' people, and the dangerous radical preachers has not worked, so maybe we should try the alternative. 

[mikes*corvettes]

Read about how the family came to immigrate to the UK in the first place. The father, Ramadan Abedi, had to leave Libya because he feared being arrested by Gadaffi.

Why?

Because of his connections with Islamic terrorist groups!

What is astounding is the UK government would allow residency to someone the Libyan government was going to prosecute for Islamic terrorist activity.

[margaret*e]

Two 17 year olds from South Shields near me confirmed dead today, two  people from Gateshead still missing.

Because of an evil person, not a refugee, he was born here, attended a university here.

What reason could he have to murder innocent children?.

[mikes*corvettes]

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@marg*e wrote:

What reason could he have to murder innocent children?.

---

Do you really have to ask ?

[margaret*e]

The father has been arrested too.

Not so innocent people.

[cee-dee]

How do you define a terrorist?

Depending on where you look from, one man's freedom fighter is another man's terrorist.

You'd have thought that someone being given a refuge from a murdering dictator would be grateful to the country that provided such a refuge? In the case of that bloke, obviously not?

How do you tell one persons attitude from another? If he'd been identified as a potential bomber beforehand, what would you do with him? As he was born here, he couldn't be deported?

Now a group of people have been arrested and if they're found to have links to those radicals, what do you suggest be done with them?

Taking a hard line, they could be locked up, but for how long and to what end? Would it "cure" them?

Taking the liberal line, should they be told not to be naughty and just let go?

Questions, questions, questions but no answers?

[joe_bloggs*]

Fighters say government operated 'open door' policy allowing them to join rebels, as authorities investigate background of Manchester bomber

http://www.middleeasteye.net/news/sorted-mi5-how-uk-government-sent-british-libyans-fight-gaddafi-12...

'No questions asked'

One British citizen with a Libyan background who was placed on a control order – effectively house arrest – because of fears that he would join militant groups in Iraq said he was "shocked" that he was able to travel to Libya to fight in 2011 shortly after his control order was lifted.

"I was allowed to go, no questions asked," said the source, who wished to remain anonymous.

He said he had met several other British-Libyans from east London who also had control orders lifted in 2011 as the war against Gaddafi intensified, with the UK, France and the US carrying out air strikes and deploying special forces soldiers in support of the rebels.

"They didn't have passports, they were looking for fakes or a way to smuggle themselves across," said the source.

But within days of their control orders being lifted, British authorities returned their passports, he said.

"These were old school LIFG guys, they [the British authorities] knew what they were doing," 

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@astrologica wrote:

My post said 'maybe'........it was a suggestion. I don't have the answers to this problem. And I doubt if you and other liberal minded people on here would be so magnanimous if you were, today, planning a funeral for your little eight year old daughter, murdered by these animals. What would be your solution? Do you have one? Or are you , like most liberals today, nice and cosy in life and unlikely to be affected in any way by these things?

My grandson lives and works in Cardiff. I spoke to him yesterday and he said that Cardiff looked like downtown Beirut.....crawling with armed police and soldiers. Reassuring to some, yes, but this is the UK..in 2017....is this the future of this country? If so, then we have made some very bad mistakes, and we continue to do so. Not rounding up these 'on the radar' people, and the dangerous radical preachers has not worked, so maybe we should try the alternative. 

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I am far from 'liberal minded'.

However you don't have to be 'liberal minded' to object to your 'suggestion'.  

I don't want to be a citizen of a country that locks people up without 'due process'.   Let's make it clear, I have absolutely NO sympathy for extremists/radicals of any religion - my suggestion would be to apply resources to gaining evidence to convict them if they have done anything illegal and then throw away the key.

[astrologica]

Yes Marge....an evil person. and also a Cannabis addict, as quite a few of these evil murderers have been. And what do the Liberal Democrats want to do?....legalise Cannabis. You couldn't make it up.

[astrologica]

Well, lets hope its not one of your loved ones needing a funeral while they are 'gaining evidence'.

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@mikes*corvettes wrote:

Read about how the family came to immigrate to the UK in the first place. The father, Ramadan Abedi, had to leave Libya because he feared being arrested by Gadaffi.

Why?

Because of his connections with Islamic terrorist groups!

What is astounding is the UK government would allow residency to someone the Libyan government was going to prosecute for Islamic terrorist activity.

---

Ramadan Abedi was a member of LIFG who attempted to overthrow the Gaddafi regime.  LIFG at the time was supported by British Special forces on the ground and with arms supplied by the West.  When the coup attempt failed it is hardly surprising he gained residency in the U.K. In 1992.

Do you suggest that the British special forces shouldn't have been allowed to return home either because the Libyan government wanted to prosecute them?

[mikes*corvettes]

Yet another terror attack, this time on London Bridge.

Must be white anglo saxon protestants on the rampage again....

[right-then-petal]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-40146916

[mikes*corvettes]

12:46am
Knifeman shouted 'this is for Allah' - reports
An eyewitness on London Bridge, told the BBC he saw three men stabbing people indiscriminately, shouting "this is for Allah".

He told how he saw a van driving on the pavement with people running out of the way, before three men got out.

[right-then-petal]

Six people have been killed and three suspects shot dead by police after terror attack at London Bridge and Borough Market

[al**bear]

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@mikes*corvettes wrote:

Yet another terror attack, this time on London Bridge.

Must be white anglo saxon protestants on the rampage again....

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Not sure but what's your assessment on these men?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-40144921