MESSAGE TO EBAY: YOU GIVE WITH ONE HAND AND TAKE MORE AWAY WITH THE OTHER!

[whitehouselearning]

MESSAGE TO EBAY

YOU GIVE WITH ONE HAND AND TAKE MORE AWAY WITH THE OTHER!

Your new rules are both unfair and highly prejudicial to private sellers for the following reasons:

1. Buyer Protection Fee means that if a seller lists an item for £18.51you will change that to £20.00. How is this protecting or helping sellers to sell their items at a reasonable price?
2. You have decreed that you will immediately add the Buyer Protection fee to all existing Buy-It-Now listings. Not only is this extremely unfair it is also utterly deplorable and its lawfulness is questionable. Such retrospectivity is rarely applied to our laws the expectation of individuals being, that if their actions today are considered by a future court, the applicable law at that time will be performed; but it also flies in the face of all acceptable business practice because it invalidates what was previously valid by enacting that, as at a past date the rules shall be taken to have been that which they were not.
3. Calling this a "Buyer Protection Fee" is an invidious euphemism which is not fooling anyone since it is, in fact, yet another means for you to earn more money off the backs of struggling sellers.
4. You are giving buyers 24/7 customer support so that they can connect with a real person by phone at any time of day - but you have failed to afford sellers - who really need this - the same facility.
5. "Paid After Delivery" means sellers cannot post very light and low cost items by ordinary mail but must swallow the extra cost to send them tracked and which, in many cases is more than the sale price of the item.
6. Your new rule for "untracked deliveries, or tracked deliveries with no delivery confirmation signal, that funds will be available 14 days from the order date", is simply shocking because (which is not exhaustive):

          (a) You know perfectly well that couriers habitually leave items on the doorstep

          of buyers so that it could be stolen or unscrupulous buyers can falsely claim that

         they never received it; and  

         (b) You get to hold on to our money for even longer than when you used to charge 

         sellers a commission and paid out promptly; thereby earning vast amounts of

        interest for yourselves.

1.  Your 'Simple Delivery' means that sellers are forced take their items to a Post Office or drop it into a post box if it will fit. But, what about disabled sellers who cannot do this and rely upon collection (which Royal Mail provides for free)?
2. 'Simple Delivery' is provided by Packlink whom I would not use again if you paid me to do so since, in my experience, they are a thoroughly disreputable firm who use every possible device to avoid paying sellers the compensation they have paid for and have proven to be due.
3. Needless to say, you are undoubtedly earning a fat commission from Packlink as well.
4. The only 'new' assistance your rules offer sellers is that neutral or negative feedback for delivery-related issues can be requested to be removed from an account. This is nothing new as it was supposedly already in existence and I am forced to observe, from personal experience, that this quite the most disingenuous fairytale as you have failed to remove any such feedback in circumstances where the buyers have been proven to be lying.
5. The Global Shipping program. You are already charging private sellers an international fee of 3% if the delivery address for the item (entered by the buyer during checkout) is outside the UK which you unfairly calculate on the total amount of the sale which includes the item price, any handling charges, postage, and any applicable taxes.  
6. On top of all that, you have decreed that, on 20th January 2025, all active listings using the Multi-buy discount tool will automatically become multi-quantity listings, and the discounts will be removed.

In conclusion, I have shown that you have now made eBay a more horrible place for private sellers than before you brought in the 'free to sell' by clawing back even more than the commission you previously charged thereby (allegedly) giving with one hand and taking more away with the other.

I rest my case.

[whitehouselearning]

Well said Sishi! Very few sellers fail to respond and I certainly don't.

In fact, just recently I had an issue with a buyer who claimed he had received a "bashed" printer but when I received it back it was in perfect working order. I refused the return and I reported the buyer but  ebay completely ignored that report,  found for the buyer, refunded him from my account (£63.00) and charged me £7.93 (including VAT) on top of that for the return postage.  I appealed and, in finally granting it, an ebay rep (not a bot) wrote,

"...based on your account, I can see a history of taking care of your buyers, so I'd like to take care of this case for you.

We are truly grateful for your enthusiasm on selling products here on eBay and
providing excellent services to your buyers."

The moral of this story is that, you can take ebay to water and you can force them to drink - but the cost in time, aggravation, frustration and sheer angst is enormous! And they have the nerve to call it "Seller Protection"!

So yes, Ebay gives with one hand and takes more away with the other - CRIMINAL!

[lucy_farmer]

'......yet under the new system, this wouldn't be sufficient for eBay, as it was sent standard, not tracked. Surely if RM provide a reference number which does prove delivery, then that should be enough??  '

If you are posting by the new 'Simple Delivery' system: 

If the parcel is never marked as delivered you will have to wait 14 days to get your money (though you do get it in the end...)

If the parcel is never delivered -i.e. goes missing/ or buyer claims never have to recieved it, ebay should cover the refund themselves (so you get to keep your money)

Whether the 14 day hold on the money outweighs the benefit of not having to refund missing items, is the question.

I've been selling for 20 years ( though probably only about 500 sales in total- the rest of my feedback number was for buying) and only had *ONE* item not arrive. So for me, I'd take the risk of selling as it is now, rather then the 'new rules'.....

But I'd imagine it all depends on *what* you're selling. If it's in a category where lots of sales 'don't arrive' (hmmmm.....oh yeah?) then it may be a good thing...

[whitehouselearning]

I am genuinly confused. What method that records delivery other than tracked? You surely don't mean 'recorded delivery' which costs more than tracked.

[blackcatbooksuk]

"So yes, Ebay gives with one hand and takes more away with the other - CRIMINAL!"

Yes they gave you an advantage over business sellers. Now they are ever so slightly levelling it up, private sellers are in meltdown.

[blackcatbooksuk]

I am not attacking you by the way. So I hope you don't see it that way.

Personally Ebay should have just left it as it was before the "Free fees for private sellers came in". They created a system that was ripe for abuse. 

[whitehouselearning]

Gosh! No, blackcat, I did not think for one minute that you were attacking me.  But thanks for being so kind as to check.

[cassidy_r_private]

The only thing I find shocking is that anyone could have thought zero fees on "private" sales would continue forever.

Ebay have played a blinder IMO. They set a trap.

I imagine that the 1000s of people trading illegally on this site might actually be persuaded to either move elsewhere or trade under the same terms that the rest of us have had to comply with for the last 20 odd years (I have a business account for my business).

[whitehouselearning]

You are so right blackcat! I must say, I also never thought zero fees would continue unblemished and I was just waiting for ebay to wipe out any benefit and gain more money for themselves.

It is exactly what you said, they set a trap!

[vintique*violet]

Genuine PRIVATE SELLERS - are in no way competition for any business... there is no levelling up, what eBay have done is to penalise small  private sellers who many are long term and hold good standing accounts hoping that those who are BUSINESSES masquerading as PRIVATE sellers are hit harder so that they perhaps move over to a Business account  ( many will just close their private account or stop selling their " business"  items they purposefully moved over,   and continue with  their business account as 1000's have two accounts) so I cannot see this being the case. 

The " free to sell" was a guise..., a step to entice ready for their plan to introduce the new BPF, the holding of their funds, Simple Delivery , so eBay will be recouping far more and restricting many genuine small private sellers who will now find it difficult to continue for many reasons. 

[whitehouselearning]

---

@whitehouselearning wrote:

You are so right cassidy! I must say, I also never thought zero fees would continue unblemished and I was just waiting for ebay to wipe out any benefit and gain more money for themselves.

It is exactly what you said, they set a trap!

---

[cassidy_r_private]

Suspect that those selling by auction will be less impacted by this policy than those using BINs.

Whilst unpopular with busy private sellers who are simply having a clearout, it will make life rather uncomfortable for those private sellers who are in fact trading.

I'm torn really. Following a bereavement, I have a lot of family stuff that is no longer required that I need to shift, so this is annoying - I'll probably have to lot as auctions to make it work. Shipping not an issue, tracked 48 is cheap on this site.

However, on my business account, I have to compete with multiple competitors, some who are much busier than me, who do not appear to be registered for VAT, don't display their addresses, don't accept returns etc etc and have been allowed to get away with it for years. Good riddance as far as I'm concerned.

[vintique*violet]

Why would auctions be less "impacted"   than BIN regarding the new implementations?  

I am so sorry to hear of your bereavement... ( I am in a similar position)  ...I have considered  listing as much as I can  prior to the new introductions/restrictions but have lost heart, and have a number of  bags/boxes ready for charity,  and a couple of items which probably would have made a " bob or two" have been given away to a recent visitor who liked them. 

[cassidy_r_private]

Thank you.

Having once made a career out of buying at live auctions where all sorts of fees are added to your bid, you only need two bidders who haven't factored in any additional costs. The prices will still settle at their natural levels - after all, an item is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

On the other hand, if you have structured all of your listings to cover a specific price point, ie, £4.99, £9.99, £19.99 - your pricing is going to be a right mess in February.

[cassidy_r_private]

"I have considered  listing as much as I can  prior to the new introductions/restriction"

Probably the best strategy. Panasonic have a new FF mirrorless camera coming out imminently - rumoured to be 61 megapickles like the Leica SL3 - it is indeed a really good time to "get on with it".

[papso22]

Tracked postage is tracked every step of the way.  RM also do postage where they scan once, on delivery.

[funkybunnie-direct]

marco@ebay kat@ebay @*vyolla* 

What exactly do you mean by "trading correctly on a business account "? Are you implying that I am trading fraudulently as a private seller when I should be trading as a business? Because if you are, that is a very serious allegation which, you not only have no right to levy but will have the consequences it deserves.

I await your response.

That sound very much like a threat which personally (even though not directed at myself) I find very offensive and completely out of order within chat. In defence of *vyolla* when looking at your listings the first that I see is a brand new item with 10 copies available. Unless you just happen to have been given 10 copies of this item for Christmas and decided that you didn't want any of them it would suggest that you have purchased them in order to sell on (and hopefully make a profit). And this is not the only item that you are selling that has multiple copies. Before you take offence perhaps you should read ebays definition of private and business sellers, along with HMRCs definition. 

[insidethe93]

If considering delegating, in case you haven't heard of them, maybe consider agents (aka Trading Assistants)? who'll sell on eBay on your behalf, for a fee of course. I read about them recently and have just googled "ebay selling agents" and quite a few came up.

I read that these agents can do the following for you: list items for sale on eBay, answer buyer queries, collect payments, ship sold items.

I also read that the fees can be hefty, up to 35% of the price, but you are, as one put it "leveraging the agent's expertise in pricing and listing". They may have a physical shop or work remotely, be individuals or be a team with "dedicated sorting facilities for your items".

I've never used one so don't know any more.

[insidethe93]

eBay is acting like a capitalist mill owner during the Industrial Revolution, increasingly dictating more about how people conduct their lives (their selling and buying lives) than is reasonable.

For instance, eBay say it'll withhold a seller's money on proof of delivery or, if none, for a whopping 14 days. It'll happen a lot given so many items these days are being delivered but tracking's not catching up either in a timely way or not at all ever. (It's happened at least 20 times on items I've bought in recent months.) eBay hopes/encourages sellers to effectively spend that money on buying on eBay. It reminds me of the Industrial Revolution's 'truck' system whereby the mill owner held on to workers' wages and paid them as much as possible with vouchers they could spend only in the mill owner's shop whose prices were higher than normal shops.

Once eBay have your money, they almost need to have their fingers prised apart to release any, as if they've forgotten it's not their money.

[the-online-oasis]

Totally correct !! 

I really haven't got a clue why eBay is so keen to change the rules for private sellers.  My guess is that they see private sellers as to bothersome for the eBay cooperation as they want an Amazon style selling platform.  But that wouldn't work as Amazon is a completely different enterprise with a different concept. 

Shame that the people behind eBay keep changing the goal posts for private sellers ever so often who are mostly hobby sellers. Does it really make sense to start squeezing pennies out of those sales when there is already an army of eBay business sellers generating a good deal of profit?  

Ebayers (buyers and sellers) have noticed that the platform has changed a lot over the last few years. It's now so automated and outsourced in order to save staff all in the name of making profit, profit, profit ........

[whitehouselearning]

It is most regrettable that you felt my response to *vyolla "very offensive and completely out of order". The fact remains that it was *vyolla words that were very offensive and completely out of order; accusatory; disrespectful; not within eBay's published definition, "we want to keep our platform a safe and respectful place for all" and emphatically not   what one should expect from 'an experienced mentor'. Suffice it to say that I stand by my response - which, if you had looked at the numerous responses I have received, you will see that I am not alone in that!

Of your rather rude comment "when looking at your listings the first that I see is a brand new item with 10 copies available. Unless you just happen to have been given 10 copies of this item for Christmas and decided that you didn't want any of them…" And even worse: "…it would suggest that you have purchased them in order to sell on (and hopefully make a profit). And this is not the only item that you are selling that has multiple copies." You do not specify to which items you are referring but I can reference two of them which should immediately disabuse you of your wholly unwarranted 'suggestion' that I have "..purchased them in order to sell on".

The first is "NEW AMD SOCKET AM4 CPU COOLER & FAN-ALUMINIUM FINS-THERMAL PASTE [712-000052]" of which I currently have 16 on sale. During my working time as an IT engineer, I was primarily engaged in building PCs for kids and the older generation exclusively pro bono. Because of that and, as per my motto "Recycle Everything",  a substantial amount of equipment (often hardly used) was donated by businesses and, of course, some private. In this particular instance however, the coolers were left over from machines I had built  but had only used the CPU's.

The second is: "FLAVOURS OF BABYLON - A FAMILY COOKBOOK BY LINDA DANGOOR" which just happens to be one that I have edited, and if sold, I will not earn a penny!

So just to be abundantly clear, there is not one item in my listings which I have purchased in order to sell on.

If there are any other items I have not covered, do let me know before you also fire off accusations to which you have neither foundation nor justification.