Fraudulent Autographs

[nicesfgwm]

People are selling forged autographs on eBay.
Many celebrity autographs have been forged and are available on ebay..

I contacted the seller of one, and asked him to take down the fraudulent merchandise.   He refused.  

I contacted eBay showing the forgery and what the authentic autograph looks like, and  complained that this is damaging to fans and collectors.

I received notice from eBay that the seller did not violate their terms of service. “We looked into your report and didn’t find the listing to be in violation of policy.  This determination was made by a customer service agent.”

I wanted to appeal this, but eBay does not provide an option to do that. And I certainly don’t believe that their policy is to allow fraudulent merchandise to be sold.  No doubt a mistake by the Agent.  So what do I do? 

I’m just reaching out to other people…. I think it’s terrible if fans and collectors are being ripped off by scrupulous forgers.

what can be done?  is there a customer service number I can reach? i have contacted the Australian government on scams but have not heard back yet.

Caveat emptor!

[jckl1957]

A Customer Services agent would not have the expertise to determine that an autograph was a forgery so they allow the listing to stand.

Sellers are responsible for their own listings and Ebay do not allow fakes.

If somebody buys an autograph and it turns out to be fake, the buyer has 30 days to return it at the seller's cost.

Through cases being opened and feedback being left, bad sellers are weeded out.

Ebay will not act on a single report - if sellers have frequent returns and poor feedback, they do eventually get restricted.

I would guess that forged celebrity autographs are widespread - not just on Ebay.  Desirable items are always copied and faked.  As you say, 'buyer beware'.

[plpmr]

these are the UK boards and you are in  United States, best log into your designated site - https://www.ebay.com/

[nicesfgwm]

My dear Mentor,  the forged autographs I am referring to are listed on Ebay UK, not on USA.  Therefore, I brought the subject up on the UK site.   Seemed reasonable at the time.

One seller has forged Charles Martinet, Hulk Hogan, and others.   
it is importantl to note that a person from  France, or even

 an “Aussie”, could easily list fraudulent autographs on Ebay UK.

I saw the forgeries on the UK site, so reported the sale of forgeries to Ebay UK, and failing to get the items removed, put this warning up for the UK buyers.

so please beware..

Also just a note, signature authentication with PSA takes more than 30 days, which is the allowable time to return merchandise to the seller. So it’s really not the beginning collector or intermediate collectors fault if he is unknowingly buying forgeries.

I feel that eBay has direct responsibility to take customer complaints on criminal forgery very seriously, and not leave it up to the marketplace to decide if criminal activity is taking place and therefore collectively shuns the seller.  No effect there, as there are always new buyers and other countries with ebay.  The criminal’s  market never dries up unless they are stopped.

I have complained here, and reported the seller to the authorities in Australia, and am contacting interpol, since it is a criminal matter, with  victims in multiple countries.

I hope this help protect the innocent.

[plpmr]

While your efforts are to be admired, there's a problem for eBay employees who look at your report, you say -

“I contacted eBay showing the forgery and what the authentic autograph looks like”

Since it's all online where anything can be manipulated who is to say which is the real one and which the fake?

This is eBay's policy on autographs -

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/prohibited-restricted-items/autographed-items?id=4283&st=3&pos=...

[nicesfgwm]

It’s very easy to see PSA cards with Charles Martinet’s authenticated autograph on it.

And I believe I sent an authenticated PSA registered card. And the difference is very clear between the two autographs.

The market itself cannot correct for criminal forgery. eBay needs to help the community by acting on tips of criminal activity.

I wish that went without saying. But apparently it’s the wild, wild West, and not a safe environment for people to trade autographed merchandise, which is enhanced in value by authenticity, and easily manipulated by fraud and criminal forgery.

Charles
Sent from my iPhone

[plpmr]

Apart from the fact that anything can be manlipuated online there have been problems with authenticators as well.

Just one example is operation bullpen in 1990's [USA].

In the UK and elsewhere there have been problems with highly regarded authenticators certifying a genuine item as a fake [Victor Hugo cover].

So its really up to the buyer to do their homework before buying and even after receiving the item.

[red_magpie]

apparently it’s the wild, wild West, and not a safe environment for people to trade autographed merchandise

Correct. If the US user agreement is the same as UK, eBay actually warns buyers that eBay makes it clear that "they do not guarantee the existence, quality, safety or legality of items advertised, or the truth or accuracy of descriptions". eBay is a jungle.

You can find eBay's UK autographed items policy below. This has changed considerably over the years. Once it carried an explicit warning that listings for allegedly autographed items may be fraudulent. This is now watered down with questionable assurances like "We investigate concerns from our members in regard to autographs". Like many things on eBay, it is wise to be sceptical.

https://www.ebay.com/help/policies/prohibited-restricted-items/autographed-items-certificates-authen...

here.

[nicesfgwm]

I think you’re assuming a level of sophistication that the average enthusiast cannot possibly achieve.

You go to a comic convention and you see Autographs for sale… The assumption is that they are real. And when you doubt that you can grab an authenticator and have them come with you, or buy the merchandise and get it authenticated.

But with a 30 day turnaround with eBay stating that you can send it back in 30 days and the seller will pay for the shipping if it’s not authentic… First of all this impossible because you can’t find authenticator that will flip things in 30 days, and second of all, put some unfair burden on the purchaser rather than on the person who sells.

Let’s not forget that knowingly selling fake merchandise as authentic, or autographs that have been forged, is illegal.

So imagine I have a store and I allow you to sell genuine Louis Vuitton in my front window, and I find out that it’s all fake, don’t I have an obligation to shut you down? Can I not be criminally prosecuted by knowingly, allowing fraud to happen at my store?

Does eBay allow fake Versace, fake Gucci, fake Louis Vuitton merchandise to be sold? I don’t think so.

And I would additionally ask, are there no laws that protect the consumer?


Sent from my iPad

[nicesfgwm]

If you think about it, it’s pretty absurd, the notion that I can allow you to sell fake cigarette lighters that are actually guns… Or merchandise that is guaranteed to be Louis Vuitton when I know that it is not… And that I can do that with absolute impunity?

I don’t know… I’m not a lawyer. But that seems absolutely immoral on the deepest level.

[tobiasd4]

If buyers suspect an item is fake, they open item not as described case.

Seller provides returns label and refunds in full on return. 

Ebay do not require proof of authentication. 

I know you are trying to help, but as ebay never see the items, they can't verify if genuine or not, 

Hence their 30 day MBG.