Royal mail charging £5/7 fee when correct postage used, using VALID commemorative postage stamps

[shopping-ferret]

I post out a lot of large letter, lower value items and some standard size letter items.  I have done this for nearly 2 decades and often bulk purchase stamps from stamp dealers, at some discount.  I do not often use the barcoded types, usually, but the older yet perfectly valid commemorative stamps.

Since the end of April, I have had so many buyers opening INR cases, many of these have had their items posted the same day as each other.  About 1-2 weeks later, I will receive a letter from RM saying I have fees to pay, or else the fee card gets sent to the buyer.  When I check my records, the correct postage has been applied.  I often use 1st standard stamps, which cover a 2nd large letter postage and from experience and because I know what idiots many RM jobsworth staff and clueless, untrained temps are, I even write on the package '2nd Large Letter'); yet despite this, they either cannot add up, or the stupid scanners they are now rolling out around the country are incorrectly rejecting non-barcoded stamps apparently some of the time; or else what they deem is underpaid postage.

I have just had 3 cases opened.  All posted the same day.  All have the older pictorial, but still valid for posting stamps.  All values correct and comprising of a single 1st (standard letter) stamp or 2-3 stamps adding up correctly to £1.55 or more.  All have a note written on that they are 2nd Large.  But yet these packages on some days - are being pulled out and then the fee to deliver notifications are sent for invalid stamps (!!!) or underpayment (!!!).

I am so sick of the incompetence of RM.  Seems they are desperate to charge for anything they can to caw back the millions they were fined for their failed services, and they know much of the time people will either take the loss and probably lose the sale and the item, or else just pay the fee.  When they send the letter to me, I generally have no idea who the recipients are and therefore what the value of the item is, so do not pay it.    If sent to the recipient, sometimes they pay, then I have to reimburse them and sometimes they ignore the card or the card is not sent to them and I refund them for the item not received.

The last time I complained about this, I got some fool of a supervisor arguing that I had put a 1st class stamp (standard) or a large letter package - even though I had marked it 2nd, which means there was 15p more value placed on the package than was required - telling me it was not enough postage for 1st class and that the stamp had 1st class on it!!  In the end I was compensated - with postage stamps.  I researched this and read in their own published information that what they did and are doing, is wrong.

Any other sellers ever come across this issue, who use to the old issue but still valid postage stamps?  I suspect it depends if the scanners are installed in your areas.

Before anyone tells me to stop using the old VALID postage stamps - this problem only happens now and then.  The great majority of the time, successfully delivered.

Interestingly, last year, the scanners were identifying many barcoded stamps as counterfeit and found to be faulty so they had to suspend the fees for a while. 

I think this is possibly another big scandal in the making. 😡

[ruby*ryan]

You need to complain to RM every time it happens ... I just hope you like Vivaldi's Four Seasons (unless they have changed the hold music!). My hours spent on the phone to them over false 'overweight' parcels, means that I can no longer hear that music, without wanting to do serious harm to someone!

I have some valid stamps here, but am reluctant to use them for the reasons you have given.

[technthread]

I use 4x 22p or 3x 29p stamps for letters. In the past 6 months I have had 1 out of maybe 200 that seems to have been incorrectly surcharged. It was very frustrating, and as the sender relying on the buyer to quiz RM about it I was pretty powerless to do anything. Once they paid the surcharge and I had partial refunded them it seemed pointless to chase RM about it just to get fobbed off.

I have enough stamps for around another 400 letters and once done I won’t be buying discounted stamps again. It is time consuming to apply them and I hear the forgeries are getting so good, they are nearly indistinguishable.

And to add, if eBay hit an account with an MC011 wanting proof of postage, it is a disaster for stamp users. Everything points to it being safer for our eBay accounts if we move away from using them longer term. 

[shopping-ferret]

I think you're less likely to have issues with standard size letters and using 3 stamps all the same values. 

Stamps I use are often the ones with 1st class (standard letter size) on them stuck on to large letter packages. Some of RM's pea brains can't work out that it more than covers 2nd class LL. 

This occurs in batches occasionally. Maybe it's the same pea brain jobsworth who is doing this. 

[vintage-emporium-jedburgh]

its just not worth the hassle to use stamps of any flavour

especially the vintage commemoratives

RM are  disingenuous 

Hopefully someone with more money than us will take them to litigation 

[shopping-ferret]

I have thought that too, however considering the lower value items I sell start at £3.50 and postage is a minimum of £1.55, the only way I can make any profit is by using cheaply obtained stamps.  There are lots of genuine older commemorative stamps around, but the issue is the idiots of RM or flaws with their scanners sometimes reject those stamps.  The majority get through fine.    I do feel this is a much wider issue with the scanners.  I mentioned if you Google, that last year, they admitted the scanners were wrongly identifying counterfeit stamps.  Since they permit commemorative stamps to still be used, their machines or humans are not fit for purpose and need to be held accountable for error judgements.  I think I will make a complaint.  I have now had 3 buyers all report item not received for packages all posted on the same day with correct value postage stamps used.  Suggests to me some individual does not have a clue about the stamps being valid for postage.   I expect to have a certain loss margin, but not for this kind of thing happening involving batches of large letter packages.   

[xyz307xyz]

As well as writing "2ND SP" or whatever - large and underlined, I put the amount e.g. £3.90; and take a photo.

[shopping-ferret]

Just typed out a reply which has disappeared!

Yes, I do that too although try not to overwhelm the small packages involved so usually omit the value.  I also photograph every prepared packages, hence I can see if a buyer reports item not received that I have attached correct postage and left directions for the RM idiots.  Most of my packages are about 3" x 8" cardboard envelopes so not much space for full specs to be included!  However, no guarantee RM are going to even read any written text, and I am pretty sure the stamp scanners don't.  It is apparent either humans are not confirming rejects or that nobody is doing that job all of the time.

Again, this only happens some of the time and come in batches of items posted together.

[tascio1]

Like you, I've used commemorative stamps for past 20 years. All have come from RM presentation packs. To date, not had a single one rejected though. The only difference to you is that with large letter I've always used commemorative issues rather than ordinary 1st. Touch wood, this will always be ok but goodness knows what will happen if ebay decide to go the simple delivery route for business sellers!!

Incidentalky, it is possible to still use stamps for Special Delivery on ebay simple delivery.

[technthread]

Do you know if Royal Mail’s swap out scheme accept those stamps in presentation packs for new barcoded ones? I have never sent them in as they are all loose but I’d love to get rid of them tbh.

I have seen the presentation packs are listed on eBay around the £1.90 free postage mark but I haven’t got the patience to list them all just to make a bit of extra money on them. 

[xyz307xyz]

AFAIK the only ones which can (and should) be swapped out are here: https://www.royalmail.com/sites/royalmail.com/files/2022-03/Stamp-Images-for-swap-out.pdf

You can't send general commemorative stamps for (99.9999%) sure.

[xyz307xyz]

How do you get the option of Special Delivery on ebay simple delivery, please? I've not seen it nor any mention of it.

[technthread]

Thanks. That’s why there are so many for sale on eBay then 😆.

I might do job lots of 20 presentation packs at 50% off face value or something to get them moved on. 

[xyz307xyz]

Also note that postally valid stamps are prohibited from simple delivery.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/posting-items/setting-postage-options/simple-delivery?id=5575#se...

Edit - just noticed you're a business, so that doesn't matter to you.

[shopping-ferret]

I would use barcoded stamps and sometimes you can get those at a little discount.  The reason I use the commemorative stamps is otherwise I am making no profit when the item is say a £4 sale and after Ebay fees, including taking into account my cost price, shop fees, packaging costs; using 2nd large letter barcoded stamps at £1.55, simply makes no sense.  So the discounted older stamps allow a profit margin for these smaller value items.  I occasionally get buyers message me to say how they love the stamps (some collect them).  But yes, I suspect some of the  issue is the scanners read it is a 1st class (standard letter stamp value £1.70) being used on a large letter package (price £1.55).  Most of the time there is not an issue but as I said earlier, it appears that on the odd days, they get rejected.  I have even had it declared I have reused stamps and this is not true as they are all new, but occasionally won't stick too well on the packaging material so I may use a little glue.  There is nothing wrong with doing this.  I feel as if some days there is a certain RM employee who is out to just be difficult, or else plain stupid.  The rejected stamps are supposed to be checked by a person.

Another issue I had is that I bought batches of brand new, self adhesive sheets of 2022 issue commemorative stamps in 2 different denominations from a seller and turned out these are counterfeit.  I am currently having problems with him and I get the feeling he is a crook knowingly selling counterfeit items.  I have reported the matter to Ebay and to an extent they have helped but due to the fact I have a lot of unused stamps and cannot even open a return case as time has expired, so now have to turn to my bank card issuer to see if I can claim back my money that way.   I am hoping Ebay will remove his account, however there are many more like him on Ebay.  In the future, I am going to start changing what I sell and stop selling items below a certain price.  I will be semi retiring so have already started on streamlining my business.  Ebay is still a good income source for me, but I have downsized.