GPSR Compliance

[bojangled]

This is as clear as mud to me. Been to the gov. advice website and various others.
How does a 1972 poster fit in to this process?

It's not an exempt category. 

Advise buyers this item is for viewing only ? 

My initial reaction, sadly, to to switch EU and NI off. 
Jo

[ett1954]

" A book might present no appreciable danger as an object yet contain text or advice that could cause great harm." - this shouldn't be an issue as individual countries already have their own regulations and controls in this area; banned content, banned authors, etc.  In addition eBay has its rules on printed media which are even more strict than those the majority of countries enforce.  In both the rules are rigorously enforced.

[bravergrace]

I have had messages from a regular customer in the EU.

It seems that last week, eBay wouldn't let him read my listings, and instead showed him a message stating that eBay cannot show them, as the seller does not deliver to France.  This week, he is no longer getting this message, and it looks as if he can purchase (though he has not actually done so).

So perhaps this will be the route eBay choose if a listing doesn't comply:  eBay will not allow EU customers to read the listings or purchase from them, and state this is all the seller's fault.  I assume this would not apply if the EU customers have a UK shipping agent?

My buyer seemed to take it rather personally, which is a shame, as I really do not have the stomach for all this compliance nonsense to protect my customers against possible self-harm resulting from cross-gartering or dropping a dictionary on their toes.

I'm certainly not going to pay out good money upfront to a firm promising to ensure compliance.  It's a scammer's charter.  Perhaps next summer, there will be sensible clarifications and more sensible options available.  

The most basic parts of the procedure seem impossible if you sell collectibles and vintage stuff.   How can one supply the maker or year of manufacture of a pair of vintage clogs, or the current address of Millicent who hand-embroidered that lovely handkerchief for Edward VIII's coronation?

[cooksongold]

" I assume this would not apply if the EU customers have a UK shipping agent"

It wouldn't - because all you can see is you are delivering to a GB address. Unless the shipping agent was in Northern Ireland of course.

[carogojo]

I would still love to know how this will be policed. If I just continue to
send parcels to Northern Ireland, for example, what will happen ? Who will
check what ? I presume they aren't going to open every parcel ? The whole
thing seems to be an ill-thought out nonsense.



ebay tell me that Post Offices will refuse to accept parcels to the EU or
Northern Ireland. I don't believe that - my post office has never heard of
GPSR, and has had no guidance, and will send my parcels in the normal way.
So what happens then ???



Roger Johnstone

[jonat_broad]

You could apply that logic to may things though. Don't buy a train ticket because the inspector isn't on every train or at every station.

You assume they may check some parcels. And of course, if you get caught....

[4_bathrooms]

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@carogojo wrote:
I would still love to know how this will be policed. If I just continue to
send parcels to Northern Ireland, for example, what will happen ? Who will
check what ? I presume they aren't going to open every parcel ? The whole
thing seems to be an ill-thought out nonsense.

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The policing is being done by eBay not customs. A buyer in Northern Ireland won't be shown non-compliant listings and if they do find a listing by some other means (such as a direct link) they'll find they won't be able to finalise their purchase. 

[555njp]

Looking at the Chinese sellers that are still sending to EU, it would appear that a lot of the details I.e. RP contact details, manufacturer, etc. need to be visible on the outside of the packaging, much like it needs a CN22.

I’ve noticed this information has been appearing on external packaging for a while.

So, presumably, from 13th December, if this is missing, the parcel may either be rejected at the Post Office, the sorting office or destination customs…?

[jlovie]

How will the postal services know if an item has been sold by a business or a private seller on eBay?

[giftgrab]

It does , in the name of trade need to be fixed as you say and I hope the uk gov do something about this especially with NI. 

eBay being the giants that they are could work out an RP solution I believe. 

I wasn’t aware that the rp needs to evaluate, I was under the impression we supply the docs that they request and hold them for the marketplace authorities in eu when needed and any issues would fall back to us? 

[giftgrab]

I believe you are right, and it does ring significant bells in relation to EU packaging regulations et cetera. It’s been something that has been created as generated money and wealth for companies that would never have even had a niche in this field and the regulation and worth of them seems to be minimal

I don’t think the Ebay with Their massive teams would have an issue regulating the RP role. Also, I don’t see why Ebay while we’re at it couldn’t have a percentage charge for the eu packaging regulations.

their massive teams wouldnt have an issue regulating the RP role.

Also, I don’t see why Ebay while we’re at it couldn’t have a percentage charge for the Ebay packaging regulations.

This would generate them an incredible amount of cash in extra sales and a minimal amount of admin as most of it would be AI generated.

Ebay could make small adjustments by taking on the role that we would have to play, which causes us a lot of cash anguish and risk and they could simply automate the whole process, allowing millions more parcels from us to enter the EU.

also while I’m on a partial rant, we have long been awaiting GSP to allow us to use countries rather than having to blanket them all. As most of us would like to avoid North America and the current SAD lawsuits that seem to be floating around. if you haven’t seen SAD lawsuits check them out on Google it’s frightening.

[blackcatbooksuk]

This has probably been answered on this thread already so I apologise in advance if it has (It is a rather long thread), but does this really apply to books? Seems complete overkill if it does and I have read that it doesn't. Does anyone know for sure? 

[trafton.-47]

It absolutely does apply to books, I'm afraid. Even though a book is an inherently safe item, a risk assessment needs to be carried out, and the origin and safety status of all components (paper, board, ink, glue, ribbon, laminate, coatings etc) need to be recorded. You will need to provide your contracted authorised representative/responsible person (AR/RP) with all this guff, which they then keep for 10 years. The name, address, email, website etc of that AR/RP needs to be on the book itself and on invoices, shipping/delivery notes etc and on the outside of the packet or box.

If you are the publisher, the printer should be able to provide all the information about the components. I've just received today a really good document of compliance from a printer, but some suppliers are a long way behind the curve on this. If you are a bookseller, then you need to get this information from the publisher/s.

And, yes, it is complete overkill. It's legislation conceived and written by the inmates of an asylum. But it will be the law on Friday the 13th (how appropriate...). 

[blackcatbooksuk]

Thank you for the reply. It really is stupid. I will be deactivating GSP on the 13th then, as I already did NI after Brexit.

[555njp]

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@jlovie wrote:

How will the postal services know if an item has been sold by a business or a private seller on eBay?

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Good point, or indeed if it’s just a parcel (gift) being sent to a relative and not an online sale.

[trafton.-47]

The commercial transaction versus gift aspect is something that struck me earlier today. If there's no obviously commercial paperwork included with the item and no 'corporate' label on the outside, then a single item might well pass as a gift. But the reverse might be true as well.

I'm planning to self-publish a book in 2025, and obviously I hope that I'll sell most of the copies. There will, though, be a number that I will want to give as gifts, not least to those kind souls who've provided advice and encouragement. 

The Regulation is silent (I think) on the status of non-commercial transactions. We would assume that it doesn't apply to private exchanges between individuals in which no money changes hands. But the Reg does say it also applies to items that are free, so there's an element of doubt and scope for confusion. Does that include personal gifts? Surely not. And yet there's that nagging fear that mission creep will scoop up cousin Francine's copy of Daciana's Revenge along with the bulk sales to Shakespeare & Co bookshop in Paris.

In practice, how will an EU MSA, postal authority, delivery company etc distinguish between the same item being supplied to some EU addresses as a personal gift and some as a commercial transaction? The concern is that gifts will automatically be assumed to be commercial sales and treated accordingly. If the full panoply of paperwork is apparently missing, some friends and family may be deprived of the opportunity to follow the adventures of their favourite vampire.

[555njp]

I know from my private account that the GPSR fields are in place there too.

I did suggest some time ago that maybe the regulation applying to all online business transactions may also include private account sales too so treating eBay as the business offering the items, therefore every listing would need to comply.

Plus of course eBay has a serious issue to deal with regarding business sellers operating on private accounts just to dodge fees. This in turn offers a way to circumvent the regs, 

a loophole I expect the EU to close off pretty quick….!

[stevensonplumbing]

The EU "GPRS police" have stated that they'll be making test purchases, with hefty fines for offenders.

The post office isn't going to care less about what's in the packages going through their system. 

[trafton.-47]

The Post Office - just like any distributor, fulfilment company, warehouse etc - will greatly care about the packages going through its system because it will be on the sharp end of the market surveillance authorities' big stick if it sends non-compliant packages into the EU. And it already does care about what's inside the packages it handles, hence all the questions about what's inside, the value etc and the leaflets telling you about prohibited items. Just like an airport check-in counter, the PO is the first line of defence in a co-ordinated international system.

[r1804auri]

Curious, why do sellers turn off international sales if eBay stated that they would hide visibility of ineligible listings?

Also, how does this work with sales through GSP? Can the seller control which countries it goes through with GSP? If, for example, one still wants to sell to non-EU/NI countries using the GSP programme?

- Apologies if this has been asked and answered, it's a long thread and only managed to read a couple of pages.

[555njp]

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@r1804auri wrote:

Curious, why do sellers turn off international sales if eBay stated that they would hide visibility of ineligible listings?

Because we don’t trust eBay to just hide the listing from EU & NI, also, if a sale is made as a breach of GPSR it is likely the seller and not eBay will take the fine.

Also, how does this work with sales through GSP? Can the seller control which countries it goes through with GSP? If, for example, one still wants to sell to non-EU/NI countries using the GSP programme?

- Apologies if this has been asked and answered, it's a long thread and only managed to read a couple of pages.

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As I understand it, you have to opt out of GSP completely to avoid inadvertently sending in breach of GPSR. Or ensure your listings are fully compliant.