False claims made by buyer to claim free postage on returns.

[oneholidaygirl]

I am becoming disillusioned with the returns system.  Customers are claiming item is faulty so that they can claim free postage on the return.  Recently a customer claimed thermal tights irritated her daughters skin and so claimed that the item was not as described to claim free postage on the return. When the item arrived back it was abvious that the package had never even been opened. I sent a report to Ebay to say the system was being abused. I received an acknowledgement to say the case would be investigated and six weeks later I have not been contacted. This has happened several times before, Ebay needs to set up a system which is fair to both buyer and seller equally

[susapric-68]

Not really much ebay can do, they have no idea it's a false claim. you can report it but it's rare for ebay to take action. I had one this week marked as nont as described but in the comment the buyer added they though it was smudgeproof and waterproof, I told ebay i never made those claims in the listing so it IS as described. eBay refunded the buyer out of their own pocket and i got a message it would not affect me and feedback would be removed, I got told to report the buyer for abuse of return policy

[oneholidaygirl]

Hi, thank you for your reply.  I know you have to accept these things but it is so annoying when Ebay do not even reply to my claim. Lets just keep our fingers crossed for more honest buyers, they are out there because I have had some lovely buyers. Take care.

[sheba-knows-best]

If you are a top-rated seller justify your case in the box when you refund the buyer.

Then at the next step report the buyer for abuse of SNAD.

Ebay will not only automatically refund you the cost of the label but also block negatives from the buyer (I am not 100% certain on the latter, but in my case, bngs have been left - I can see them on my sales page - but they do not show up in my feedback)

Make sure you block the buyer in your blocked buyers list.

[4_bathrooms]

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@oneholidaygirl wrote:

Customers are claiming item is faulty so that they can claim free postage on the return. 

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When this happens you need to report the buyer via the case. When the return shows as delivered there will be a "Report a problem" link at the bottom of the case; use this selecting "Buyer misused returns" (or the nearest equivalent option). If you do this and eBay agrees they will credit up to £3.50 towards the return label cost, remove any associated negative feedback and the return won't be counted in your service metrics. The buyer will also receive a flag against their account for abusing the Money Back Guarantee.

[cke786]

If you have a Twitter/X account, I'd also recommend contacting @askeBay on there, as they will be able to give you additional assistance in sorting out any issues!

[btr.style]

'Ebay will not only automatically refund you the cost of the label'

Unfortunately not true. They can be reported and eBay may or may not refund the label cost. Usually they don't in our experience even when it's clear cut and there's no way to know the status of this. 

One of several, from a few months ago was a buyer who purchased a size 16 coat which was listed accurately. It was a Barbour coat and pretty standard measurements for a 16. They opened an INAD claiming it didn't fit them, too big and therefore they consider it to be a size 18. 

Of course that's nonsense. The size on the label was listed. Everything was accurately described and it was just a case of didn't fit and not anything we did wrong. Reported to eBay and never had a postage credit. To add insult to injury, the coat had clearly been left in a cigarette filled room before sending back as it stank of cigarettes. 

Plenty more clear cut ones eBay didn't provide any postage credit. 

[the-nutwood-collection]

I agree with @btr.style - getting a label refund out of eBay for a blatant use of INAD to get a free return just doesn't happen.

I have made several reports where the MBG was obviously abused, but only one refund - and that's because I called CS.  I haven't the time or the inclination to ring CS every time it happens - for the fees I pay, I expect it to be automatic.  eBay facilitates these nuisance buyers, the very least they could do is to refund the label.

[btr.style · Accepted solution]

Totally agree there. I mean, what is it? £3.45 or something like that?

They have a report and hope system but can't be bothered to look at cases. As you say, eBay send us good and bad customers but won't do naff all when the bad customers shaft us out of money. Bad enough when losing the money we initially paid for postage but then the double whammy, paying for the return and when selling again paying more postage. 

It's always the way though. eBay say they support businesses when actually they bleed them dry. They do all those fancy videos welcoming businesses knowing full well they'll give fee promos to businesses on private accounts, while genuine businesses get nothing. They'll sit by while customers make fake INAD claims and not compensate a penny, and of course they'll just fill the platform with various bugs. The joys. 

Definitely it reached new lows when they couldn't even be bothered to offer some sort of promo for business sellers at Xmas. Even 10% off fees would have sufficed. We just never get anything back, no little bonuses. Just rubbish videos about what they've wasted their money on to 'support' businesses which actually doesn't support them where it matters at all. 

[sheba-knows-best]

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@the-nutwood-collection wrote:

I agree with @btr.style - getting a label refund out of eBay for a blatant use of INAD to get a free return just doesn't happen.

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Them I'm bemused. Because I'm always credited (I just checked my refunds against my SNADS in seller metrics). The payments are made in bulk - once a month. You need to go to seller hub - payments - select adjustments (see screenshot below). You can see mine for November and December. If the amounts look minimal it is because I don't get many SNADs (although 9 out of 10 I do claim for, as I rarely list incorrectly). I include full measurements, size guidance, usually 16-24 photos, material details, as much as I possibly can. To give you an idea - it usually takes me 20 minutes to list one of my most expensive items even after the photos are done. I tissue wrap and box. I make it look a bit like a present. I also include a bit of a 'sweet' thank you card. My mom (little old lady writing at 78) writes them for me. Whilst nothing can stop a hardened scammer, I think a personal touch tends to make people feel a bit loathe to claim SNAD unnecessarily.  So whilst my returns rate is a depressing 12% (the higher the prices, the more people can be bothered to return) - my seller metrics are always in LOW (green). Just food for thought x

[the-nutwood-collection]

I have posted about not receiving label refunds a couple of times before and usually receive a responses either agreeing, or disagreeing - similar to that of @sheba-knows-best .  It seems as though auto refunds are a lottery, some sellers get them, others don't.

I do check my payments - the refunds aren't there.  I used to get an email which had a column for label refunds - and there were never any refunds.  I haven't missed the refunds, I simply haven't received them.

My INADs are not ones where there could be a difference of opinion between buyer and seller about whether the item is in 'good' condition.  They're for ribbon, and examples of the reasons given are 'Not long enough to go round my gift', 'I thought it would be longer', 'Too narrow, not what I want'.

The listing Title, Item Specifics and Description mention the width and length numerous times.  If the ribbon length is not long enough to go around the parcel, or the buyer doesn't know how long a metre is, or can't visualise '10mm (3/8")' and know it's a narrow ribbon it's not a fault with my listing, it's a remorse return.

This is why I'm as mad as a hornet that I don't get a refund for the label.

[sheba-knows-best]

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@the-nutwood-collection 

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Just checking you have looked in "adjustment" as I described? Only paid once a month so easy to miss...

And you are TRS?

And do you always report the buyer after issuing the refund?

If it is yes to all three, I'm bemused and would be mad as a hornet too...

[the-nutwood-collection]

Yes to all three.  Thoroughly check the financials, I'm TRS, and always report the buyer - including completing the optional section to give full details of the abuse of the MBG.  I receive a message thanking me for reporting the buyer and inferring that eBay takes the report really seriously - the usual weasel words.

I just accept it and move on.

[sheba-knows-best]

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@the-nutwood-collection wrote:

Yes to all three.  Thoroughly check the financials, I'm TRS, and always report the buyer - including completing the optional section to give full details of the abuse of the MBG.  I receive a message thanking me for reporting the buyer and inferring that eBay takes the report really seriously - the usual weasel words.

I just accept it and move on.

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It is very weird.

I don't believe in 'personal' or conspiracy theories, I think it is all computerised. So I wonder where we differ? How about your SNAD seller metrics??? I'm green at 0.49%

[the-nutwood-collection]

My INR rate is 'High' for December 2022 - November 2023 at 1.6% compared with my peers at 0.44%.  The reason that it's 'High' (in eBay's opinion) is because I will not refund for an item not received unless the buyer opens a case. 

Why do I make them open a case?  This is simply because, when I refunded three INR transactions outside a case (just to get the nuisances off my back), I received three defects for Out of Stock.  There is a thread about this on the Experienced Seller board, and Marco confirmed that, if you refund for anything other than 'Buyer and Seller Agreed to Cancel', it's treated as an Out of Stock.  So ... I have three defects for giving buyers a freebie, buyers that chose to have the item sent 2nd Class freepost at a time when RM were constantly in the press for late deliveries.  The buyer could have selected 1st Class, T24, Special Delivery or courier to get the (according to them) urgent item faster, but they didn't.

One buyer was extremely reluctant to open a case, but I held firm.  A couple of months later I got a neutral 'Item not received - had to open case for seller to issue refund'.  My assumption is that she tried to order more of the fibre she didn't receive, and found herself blocked, so lashed back with a neutral.  She's a business, masquerading as a private seller, doesn't take returns - pot, kettle, black.

My INADs are zero for the same period.  This is because I became so fed up with the lack of buyer protection and inaction against these pests and 'private' sellers, I closed the shop, reduced the number of listings and never list new stock on eBay.  I don't promote so, mainly, the only buyers that find me are my regular customers.  Bliss.  Absolute bliss.

As an aside - I logged into my private account today to try to fix a search that's bringing back rubbish.  There were loads of messages, 80% off seller fees, max £1  seller fees.  I guess my un-refunded labels went towards financing these deals.      

[sheba-knows-best]

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@the-nutwood-collection wrote:

My INR rate is 'High' for December 2022 - November 2023 at 1.6% compared with my peers at 0.44%. 

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Then this is the difference between us and may well explain the 'computer says no'. Because postage labels paid is a bit of a 'reward' for ebay's version of good behaviour maybe? I'd be interested to know if the other posters who don't get labels paid are also 'high' or 'low' on metrics.

If you think I'm sitting here feeling smug, I'm not. Although I am sitting here thinking of all the hoops I jump through and the humble pie I eat (with ebay, usually with buyers - in terms of polite messages when they are probably a scammer - although I also make buyers open INRs and INADS).

To me, your whole post sounds like someone sulking and refusing to join in the silly game anymore.  Hence your dealings with INAD you're doing it your way, whatever.  I get it, if I have to do any more sell similars I think I will scream, but it is just a game, and you either join in, or sit on the side. Time and time again on these boards, posters have admitted that when they grew disenchanted things just got worse.  Ebay doesnt care - or even notice - either way. At least you have your regular customers, I wonder if there is a way you can work on getting more sales from them, and maybe growing them one by one. OJewellery does a regular newsletter (see post about sharing sales tips) which might work for your customers? 

[the-nutwood-collection]

I am definitely not 'sulking and refusing to join in the silly game anymore.  Hence your dealings with INAD you're doing it your way, whatever'.

I believe you mean INR not INAD.  My dealings are solely based on the fact that if I issue a refund outside the INR function, I will get a defect.  I have three defects for 'Out of Stock' - I was not out of stock, I am never out of stock, I am up to my eyes in stock because I have 130 different colours and have to hold sufficient stock to fulfil an order of any size.  Mine is not a one-off business like yours - a buyer can order 5g or they can order multiple kilos.  I must have the stock to support this.  Also, my items are imported - I can't nip down to the local cash and carry and get more at the drop of a hat.  I have to wait my turn in the supplier's order schedule, then wait for FedEx to haul it to the UK, wait for UK customs to process it, wait for FedEx to haul it from Stanstead to Birmingham - with an intermediate stop in Bedfordshire.

I didn't select 'Out of Stock' as the reason for issuing a refund - it was the eBay app that decided I was out of stock and awarded a defect accordingly.  If I get any more defects, I'm heading towards an extra 4% in fees.

Therefore I consider that, by forcing the buyer to open an INR, I am making a sound business decision to avoid extra fees.  I am not 'doing it your way, whatever', I am minimising the chances of paying even more fees to eBay.

The catalyst for many INRs is eBays fantasy EDDs and no fault of mine.  An order placed on Christmas day was given an EDD of December 28-30.  There was absolutely no way that an order posted 2nd Class on the 27th was going to get there on the 28th.  It was highly unlikely that it would get there by the 30th.  Then there was another bank holiday.  The buyer raised an INR.  I had to refund.  It arrived the day after I'd refunded.  The buyer didn't tell me or offer to pay - just thought herself lucky to have a late present from Santa.

I am not 'disenchanted'.  It's eBay's platform, and they set the rules.  The rules are that if I don't promote and give them another 13.5% in fees, I'm consigned to the 'See More' group.  That's fine with me - if they don't want my business, that's their choice.  I realised, back in 2021 what the ramping up of their PL activities was going to lead to, so I clambered into a lifeboat and made haste to safer ports - and I'm very glad I did.

No, I don't waste my time on 'sell similar'.  My opinion is that the theory is just snake oil and it's only effect is to increase traffic on eBay's servers - servers that we sellers pay for.  A seller 'sells similar'.  They get a sale.  They then spend time selling similar hoping for fairy dust to fall upon these listings.  Correlation is not causation, and there is no way of setting up a valid control to test the theory.

My regular buyers are business buyers.  When they get an order, I get an order.  I can't grow their orders without getting more customers for my business buyers.  I concentrate on growing my business, not other people's businesses.

I realise you're trying to be helpful, and I thank you for that.  However, I'm not a seller that goes on these boards to ask 'where have all the sales gone'.  I just accept that they're gone - eBay was good for my business, now it isn't any more.  That's just business life - highways builds a bypass, and nobody stops at your shop any more.  Time to look for new premises with footfall, not stay where you are and lament your lost customers.

[magmarkets]

I sold one of those 3 wick candles and got a message from the buyer saying it didn't smell of what it was supposed to be and returned it as 'defective', so got her postage repaid. Now I can't sell the candle, so I'll take my cost of the candle off the refund...

[btr.style]

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@magmarkets wrote:

I sold one of those 3 wick candles and got a message from the buyer saying it didn't smell of what it was supposed to be and returned it as 'defective', so got her postage repaid. Now I can't sell the candle, so I'll take my cost of the candle off the refund...

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Probably not wise. 

Firstly you are a business seller on a private account (Magmarket, books, magazines and more) with over 2k listings. Evidently a business seller (a seller who buys stuff in to sell for profit) trading illegally with no returns accepted. By law you have to accept returns as a business seller for any reason. Had you complied with the law, the buyer might have been able to return the item under didn't like it and thus they'd have paid for the return. Instead they have had to do it under defective item or be lumped and out of pocket with something you legally have to allow them to return. 

Certainly witholding them of the candle cost is not only unprofessional as a business (leaving you right open to negative feedback) but again breaches business trading laws. If you can't sell the candle because it's been opened..... Well.... That's tough I'm afraid. 

Suck it up, move on and in future comply with the law when trading as a business.