Buying From Private Sellers Who Are Businesses.

[goingfishinguk]

Hope everyone is well.  I  know there is a lot of chat about private sellers who are clearly businesses.  My questions are:

1) Since you know they are breaking the 'rules' would you still buy something from them?

2) Would you be happy to pay the extra 75p plus 4% for something you have had for 'free' previously?

3) Would you be 'fair' in leaving a non-positive feedback stating you are unhappy that they are clearly a business acting as a private seller?

[andha-21]

So to summarise. You are asking if they would be okay with hypocrisy.

[the-nutwood-collection]

I never buy from businesses masquerading as private.  Nor do I buy from sponsored listings because I'm not rewarding eBay for the con trick that is PL.

I often have to go a very long way down the listings to find a seller, but they're there - and they get my business.

If it's a genuine private seller, I don't have a problem with the 4% + 75p.  I'm an ex-IT person and know how much data centres cost to run, so eBay are justified in passing the cost on to me.

As I wouldn't buy from a bogus private seller, the question about feedback is not relevant.  But, if it was, I wouldn't leave a neg because I had taken a conscious choice to buy from them - so I should be, if it were possible, leaving a neg for me for encouraging these pests.

[jimthing]

For the UMPTEENTH time on here, just because someone has thousands of items listed does not make them a  business seller. Classic example of many, a record collector selling-off their record collection they built up over decades = thousands of items. 

Idiotic premise of a question. How do you know they're masquerading as a business to start with. And even if they are, leaving someone bad feedback when nothing was wrong as a result is something only an idiot would profess as an idea on here. Goodbye. 🙄

[fatbobfan]

@jimthing you are right there grey areas, there are also CLEAR buinesses, many, many clear businesses. Who has 50 identical pairs of reading specs x 3 in pink blue, red then  150 identical glass cases x 7 when they are red, green, black, pink, etc etc. or 50 identical Samsung cases, or Apple cases, thats not a hobbyist or a lifestyle choice, its a resell business. Clear business

Would hazard a guess the OP has stiff competition from clear, businesses or hobbyists who some how acquire 600 identical pike lures, 500 crab hooks, 250 pole rests, or kilo' and kilos of fresh bait for months and months, nope its a business.

No need to be rude, its a fair question

@goingfishinguk 

1. I dont recall doing so, but do look

2. Yes

3. See your point, you could leave a positive service and product review but highlighting the issue.

Personally the platform is more to blame, People can only use the platform the way its given to them

@the-nutwood-collection PL works for some and not others, sadly its the only way for some sellers against private seller business being seen when your being undercut by numerous private sellers business or non business its an avenue and it works, again for some not all, sellers should look into PL thoroughly before going down the PL route, 

[andha-21]

Just to make sure I'm on the same page, PL is something like Promoted Listing?

If so, I can't see why it's necessary. I've never done it and have had loads of first page Google results. The photos at the top. Not paid a single penny to eBay for that.

[the_book_seekers]

1. No

2. Yes with a genuine private seller.

3. No. Leaving a false positive and breaking ebay's rules would be hypocrisy. 

[jonat_broad]

Aye but I would imagine the OP is talking about the obvious ones.

[jimthing]

"Obvious ones" is still making presumptions about the seller, due to their listings; i.e. complete uncertainty whether they are or not. So these are pointless questions, with pointless answers. 

[jonat_broad]

You’re telling me someone selling multiples of brand new items shouldn’t be a business seller?

[ruby*ryan]

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@goingfishinguk wrote:

Hope everyone is well.  I  know there is a lot of chat about private sellers who are clearly businesses.  My questions are:

1) Since you know they are breaking the 'rules' would you still buy something from them?

No

2) Would you be happy to pay the extra 75p plus 4% for something you have had for 'free' previously?

If you are still talking abut unreg business sellers, N/A, as I wouldn't buy from them anyway.

3) Would you be 'fair' in leaving a non-positive feedback stating you are unhappy that they are clearly a business acting as a private seller?
N/A as I wouldn't buy from them.

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[jimthing]

I'm saying that's still a PRESUMPTION, as no one else can be sure what's going on. Maybe they're selling off their deceased father's old stock left at home after closing a business; hence business non-operational. Maybe another load of reasons, that still doesn't legally make them traders, I'm afraid.

Making assumptions about others selling is all guess work and presumption of circumstances. 

[555njp]

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@the_book_seekers wrote:

1. No

2. Yes with a genuine private seller.

3. No. Leaving a false positive and breaking ebay's rules would be hypocrisy. 

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3/ I don’t really condone doing it, but it wouldn’t be a false positive as you would be leaving feedback for the seller, so it would be a genuine Negative.

Be interesting to see if the seller could then get it removed because it would be true, seller would be breaking eBay’s rules (and the law) by selling under false pretences…?

[trainofthought]

It may depend on what I buy. If I'm buying brand new sealed music CDs then I may have more reassurance from a business seller, but then again there's a greater chance that a "business seller" would have Russian made CDs (unauthorised) that are sealed but not entirely legit. It's less likely that a private seller would have multiple copies of such things. I am more reassured in buying some things from a private seller who is unbundling a genuine collection, knows what they have, care about what was once their pride and joy, and sometimes is less hurried and more particular about how they deal with the trade. Some business sellers who are just high volume car booters can be just pretty inept and their lack of sophistication in the diverse range they sell shows when they think a vinyl LP can be posted in a cereal packet and a collectable diecast model can be posted in a jiffy bag with the model rattling around loose in its box. Many genuine collectors and enthusiasts become credible private sellers and these I endorse, even if they scale up their selling to levels that others are irked by.

There's good and bad in private and business and if I'm buying I don't care the ebay status as long as the trade occurs without a problem. The status is available to check so we can choose beforehand. My preference, and the better transactions and more decent sellers are, in my experience, mostly private sellers.

I'm not worried about the additional costs - that's just for me to factor in my buying decision.

I only leave feedback based upon the transaction. I fail to see the point in buying off a private seller, knowingly, and then leaving a neutral because they're private. If you feel that strongly about them then don't buy off them. 

But the issue is how ebay structures their platform. Why make the distinction between private and business? Why apply different pricing structures? Why not same pricing structure but limit quantities for private? (More for business sellers, or even more at lower costs for business sellers?) And in terms of a sellers' obligation ebay could make that uniform across the board, they set the rules, so everyone could be, for example, required to have a returns policy. ebay have made this a contentious issue. Don't blame the private sellers who register as such and have for many years been gifted 1200 free listings per month! That was ebay's decision. At least now it is a more realistic 300 per month for private sellers.

[trainofthought]

You are right but the reality is that whilst there is no certainty that a private seller is or isn't a genuine business, there do seem many that are - but probably not as many as the moaning business sellers believe.

In truth, and if my family expire in the correct order (not a thing I'm wishing by the way), I'm anticipating having to deal with a number of large collections that will literally take years to sell on ebay. Alternatively I could, to avoid the complaints from the business sellers claiming I wasn't a private seller, just dump it through some local auction houses so the registered business sellers can buy large quantities at comparatively low prices and sell it on ebay themselves at a far greater price than I got from the local auction house? I bet they'd be happy with that? That's not going to happen. I will sell it via ebay, or similar, and it won't be a business because I haven't bought these items to trade.

I do wish business sellers would stop moaning about private sellers; anyone would think that business sellers have learned the hard way that the ebay promise of the benefits of upgrading to a business account was just a sales tactic for ebay to apply yet more crushing fees.

[the_book_seekers]

There was a time when having business account was an advantage, but that has long since been eroded by ebay leading to the mess we have now. Business sellers do not mind genuine private sellers, which has been said many times on many posts. Comments are directed at those who really shouldn't be using private accounts. The situation spoils ebay for genuine private sellers and business sellers alike. The cut in the number of listings and loss of the selling tools for private accounts can be attributed to these sellers and they may not be the last changes private sellers have to face. It's in our mutual interest that ebay deals with the problem and stops kicking the can down the road as it is doing at the moment. 

[bravergrace]

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@jimthing wrote:

For the UMPTEENTH time on here, just because someone has thousands of items listed does not make them a  business seller. Classic example of many, a record collector selling-off their record collection they built up over decades = thousands of items. 

Idiotic premise of a question. How do you know they're masquerading as a business to start with. And even if they are, leaving someone bad feedback when nothing was wrong as a result is something only an idiot would profess as an idea on here. Goodbye. 🙄

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Yes, you're quite right.  Someone may have thousands of items listed, and be a genuine private seller.   Sometimes it can be impossible to know .

But in other cases, there's no question, because the seller actually says in their listing  something like:

- "We will make this dog kennel to the exact size and colour you choose".

- "You can visit our showroom in xxxxx High Street - here is a photograph of it".

- "We stock dozens of different stairlifts/mattresses/wedding dresses, and get new stock in every month..  Email our trade sales manager to discuss bulk orders."

[555njp]

Agree!

In my category I have plenty of these masqueraders saying things like “New stock arriving daily”.

Just to be clear, us disgruntled business sellers are not complaining about private sellers at all. Why would we? Especially as most businesses will also operate a private account for selling off inherited goods and unwanted family items like everyone else.
Running a business is a completely separate activity but by doing it on the correct account is simply staying within the law.

The issue is simply that a HUGE percentage of alleged Private accounts simply are not.

And even the most intellectually challenged on eBay can spot them a mile off.

Selling all new items, in every size, shape, configuration, restocking to sell, thousands of listings, tens of thousands of feedback with statements like “please message us if you cannot see the size/type you want as we have lots more stock coming that’s not yet listed”

they are the problem and ARE NOT PRIVATE SELLERS!

So who is to blame? 100% eBay. For not having a fair and level playing field, for not acting on information received and closing down those cheating the system and making it attractive not to be correctly registered. Just to add, I noticed in the weekly chat that the community team whilst understanding this issue of businesses operating on private accounts is frustrating for business sellers, they don’t want anymore questions about it! Perhaps if they had done something to fix the problem rather than annoy all those legitimate Private sellers eh?

This issue is a reflection of society though. People are largely selfish, greedy and self-centred. If they can ‘get away’ with breaking the law they will (speeding, drug-dealing, riding e-scooters in public, claiming benefits they aren’t entitled to and selling stuff on the side without declaring themselves as a trader etc. etc…) they will.
Because nothing is policed and there are very few if any deterrents……..simple really.

[moldosgifts]

Ill post an example is this a private or business 

£2.20

Condition:

NewNew

Quantity:

4 available

This person commented on these boards today

I don't want to put much more up as this would identify them 

They have 200 such listings.

If private i would expect to see 1 item possibly preowned

Not multiples of the same item

This person appears to be a hobbyist but by offering their hobby for sale they need a business  account.

They will be aware of this we will see if they action the advice

If they don't they will be added to my list of accounts to report.

[moldosgifts]

1) NO

2) YES

3) Unethical so NO