When does democracy become.......

[cee-dee]

When does Democracy become mob rule?

Failing that, when does mob rule become democracy?

Democracy is supposed to be the rule of the people and that's usually decided by the majority supporting the same idea?

I'm particularly thinking about the case of Ched Evans and the statement made by the chairman of Sheffield United that Ched Evans was prevented from playing there by mob rule (otherwise reported as "mob-like behaviour").

Now it seems that Oldham Athletic are considering offering him a place and there's been reports that they won't be swayed by any similar protest. A bit insensitive that isn't it considering the many recent reports concerning Oldham and Rochdale abuses?

[suzieseaside]

Perhaps because they represent a community, even a country if they are in a World Cup squad, and should be better role models given that they are so revered by many who are obsessed by football (as well as overpaid) ?

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@suzieseaside wrote:

Perhaps because they represent a community, even a country if they are in a World Cup squad, and should be better role models given that they are so revered by many who are obsessed by football (as well as overpaid) ?

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I can see the argument but the reality is totally different - those footballers that I would consider as good role models make up a tiny minority!

Far more practical in my opinion to discourage youngsters from making footballers their role models than to try and make footballers good role models.

[suzieseaside]

I couldn't agree more, and I rather think that might be what emb meant.

I hate football, not so much the game but rather all the hoologanism associated with it, especially in the past, and the bad behaviour of a lot of players as well as their fans.  However, I think it would be a task to stop youngsters revering footballers given that such a large proportion of boys are obsessed with football.   Hence, perhaps that's why some people feel that Evans should not continue playing professionally.

Personally I care little, I didn't even know who he was until his crime was publicised and whether he was guilty or not of unconsented sex, at best he was a sleazy opportunist and certainly not someone to be emulated.

[upthecreekyetagain]

I love football, the game, the skill and especially the atmosphere.   I no more care what the moral standard of those playing is than I care about the personal life of composers, artists, actors etc.

Hooliganism amongst fans is essentially a thing of the past in the English game - of course there are occasional incidents but no more so than at other sporting events or musical gigs.

We've just drawn Arsenal at home in the FA cup - looking forward to that one 🙂

[lhasa.two]

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@upthecreekyetagain wrote:

I love football, the game, the skill and especially the atmosphere.   I no more care what the moral standard of those playing is than I care about the personal life of composers, artists, actors etc.

Hooliganism amongst fans is essentially a thing of the past in the English game - of course there are occasional incidents but no more so than at other sporting events or musical gigs.

We've just drawn Arsenal at home in the FA cup - looking forward to that one 🙂

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[lhasa.two]

Oh!? 

My reply went walkabouts but anyway here's a link from the Telegraph today which sums it up for me.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/11326603/Ched-Evans-latest-Shame-on-Oldham-for-even-thinki...

[tommy.irene]

More than 30,000 tell football club: Don't sign rapist footballer as Oldham Athletic's sponsors threaten to sever ties if he is given a deal Ched Evans's return to football was due to be announced this morning Oldham Athletic set to sign Evans but believed to have changed mind Key sponsor warns that if striker joins Oldham: 'We are out the door' Manager expressed grave reservations and sponsor wanted to pull out Online petition urging the club not to sign striker has 20,000 signatures Manchester police chief says club will 'send wrong message' if he signs Local MP says Evans should not get Oldham contract or sign for any club Evans, 26, has been without a club since coming out of prison in October Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2897095/Oldham-Athletic-set-pull-bid-sign-rapist-footballer-...

[potters_uk]

What happens when his review comes along and if his conviction was overturned.

What would the baying mob, self righteous sponsors and the media do then.

[evoman3957]

Backtrack............that's what having morals of convenience in a society does...........allows you to tailor them to fit whatever circumstances you want them to.

[cee-dee]

Lets just look at a few facts, not heresay, not conjecture, things that have happened so far.

August 2012, The first stage of Evans' appeal is rejected after a judge refuses his application for leave to appeal against his conviction.

November 2012, Evans loses his appeal after his case is rejected by three judges at the Court of Appeal in London.

October 2014, The Criminal Cases Review Commission confirm they are to fast-track Evans' case to investigate whether his conviction will be referred to the Court of Appeal.

(That process could still take up to 35 weeks.)

Soooooo, he's not appealing yet (again), he's only seeking to have his case referred to the Court of Appeal.

When someone's been convicted, they can appeal and appeal again. BUT, when someone's aquitted, the "victim" can't appeal and appeal again? Seems a bit unfair? Which side is the mob on?

[evoman3957]

The side of whatever "Tribe" they're in.

[aernethril]

That really sonds as if someone is desperately trying to pull strings behind the scenes to get the guy off.

I really don't understand how it can go back to the CoA when they have already rejected his appeal at that stage.

And again - if he was just some 'normal' joe bloggs guy in the street, he would not be having his case fast tracked at all.  It's all a nasty and cynical manipulation to get the original and further judgements overturned so he can be 'welcomed' back into the glory of football.

[cee-dee]

I thought it was time the proper facts were presented as it seems some were under some misapprehension of what's actually going on.

[suzieseaside]

I wonder if there would be less objection to Evans returning to football once the full 5 years of his initial sentence had passed? Would those against his return be more satisfied that he had done his time for his crime?

Pistorius has been banned from representing S.Africa at Rio, should he get out of jail for his manslaughter conviction before then, but apparently after 2019 when the full term of his sentence has passed, he could (if he wanted) compete in the 2020 Olympics.

[tommy.irene]

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@aernethril wrote:

That really sonds as if someone is desperately trying to pull strings behind the scenes to get the guy off.

I really don't understand how it can go back to the CoA when they have already rejected his appeal at that stage.

And again - if he was just some 'normal' joe bloggs guy in the street, he would not be having his case fast tracked at all.  It's all a nasty and cynical manipulation to get the original and further judgements overturned so he can be 'welcomed' back into the glory of football.

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I agree that someone is pulling the strings to get him back into football....But the public wont let them win..

[cee-dee]

Interesting?:-

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-30698382

[tommy.irene]

I wonder if he could be allowed to go back to work..http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/michael-salmon-trial-childrens-doctor-4928755?ICID=FB_mirror_ma...

[aernethril]

Oh dear God, that's just so sickening.

[cee-dee]

Breaking News:-

It's being reported that Oldhan Athletic are "close" to announcing that a deal's been reached to sign Evans.

[tommy.irene]

http://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/debateni/blogs/ruth-dudley-edwards/so-does-ched-evans-deserve-a-se... .So, does Ched Evans deserve a second chance? After Oldham Athletic became the latest club to consider signing the disgraced footballer, a petition against the move has become one of the fastest growing ever, with 30,000 names on it by Monday. But after serving his sentence for **bleep**, should he be allowed to rebuild his life, as many here have been allowed to do after heinous crimes? Two writers with radically different views argue the case for and against.