Should Faith/Religion Have Such a High Value In Our Society?

[lambsy_uk]

I'm not here to trample all over people's faith/beliefs but to ask if/why such beliefs should hold such high value in our society?

So where am I comming from? Well we can freely question almost anything in our society/lives; morals, political beliefs, actions and reactions, motivations, interactions, foreign policy, education, welfare, how we raise our children, law and order and so on..........

However we are positively discouraged from questioning people's faith/beliefs/religion! We are also actively encouraged to accommodate and allow for people's religious beliefs, and this is the bit that really irks me! Why is it that if something is done in the name of a religious belief/practice then we are expected to accept it with little fuss where if any other excuse were used we'd be up in arms?

We endure arguments of whether animal rights should take precedence over religion, whether saving the life of a child should take precedence over their parent's beliefs, should freedom of expression take precedence over religious sensitivities?

For me you may as well base stuff on the football team you support;

"I can't comply with the company dress code because I'm a United fan and therefore I must be allowed to wear a United shirt at work."

As far as I'm concerned this is no more ridiculous than anything done/not done in the name of religious beliefs!

So why do religious beliefs hold such high status and is it right that they do?

[saasher2012]

Thank you for your honest answer much appreciated!.

[bankhaunter]

As regards the original question,should religion have such a high value in our society?

From the link I gave earlier "Call someone an Imam, Priest or Reverend and there is nothing they can't get away with".

A person of faith is one who will believe virtually anything on no evidence whatsoever, is that in itself worthy of respect or disdain?

[**bustysinclaire**]

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@joe_bloggs* wrote:
As regards the original question,should religion have such a high value in our society? I think as has been already stated control of the population was the main idea,The queen is the governor of the church of England,we have unelected religious leaders sitting in the house of lords passing legislation over us,time I think for total separation.We might as well have retired football managers sitting in the lords,after all I,m sure more people go to a football match on a saturday than go to church on a Sunday

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I find that one very hard to answer really, because of being a JW.

Our belief is that the worldly religions are not in harmony with Gods laws so we believe the worldly religions meddle in world Government affairs, they should stay seperate from them.

However, we also believe that worldy Governments stand in their relevant positions because Jehovah allows them to, because they serve his purpose in the outworking of his promises for mankind.

We are instructed by our God to be obedient to those Governments and the laws of the land.

We are also instructed to stay away from false religions (wordly religions) so as a JW religions are harmful so I say no the should't be valued in our society. But Jehovah God should be as He is the almighty whom we owe our very existence to.

If I was still as I was before I became a JW, then I would answer that religions of allsorts were the cause of all troubles and to "he.." with em they have no place in our society. I was leaning towards not being an out right atheist but definately had no care for the religions of the world.

[**bustysinclaire**]

We were designed in a way to enjoy food - look at our taste buds.

So the ability to eat was just for pleasure and served no purpose in sustaining life or is it that taste buds evolved to help avoid harmful food, food essential for life.

No  xx

Again Why? indeed, Jehovah saw fit to design them that way.

So God designed some animals in a way that was entirely unsuited to the food they eat. Can we deduce therefore that God was remarkably inefficient or could it be that the story is just that, a story.

No

He had a reason for doing that yes, but the reasons for doing it I believe a valid ones, I certainly don't believe it was a deliberate engineering of sin, as they did have freedom of choice,

How could it be freedom of choice since God knew beforehand what would happen when he put the tree there, he was the only one with the freedom of choice hence it being done deliberately.

I don't agree, like you are I even (though imperfect) know how to choose to be law abiding or not. He expected obedience as that is what was required.

The Elders always get their direction from Jehovah.

So you cannot disagree with them and they do have power over you. If they don't why do you need them, can't you think for yourself and come to your own conclusions?

Elders are our way to gain Jehovahs Direction but we choose to.

Forgive me Bank I am not really sure what you are asking for, is it possible for you to rephrase it just a little,

I thought it a fairly simple question, if you say your god is exercising his powers why can't that exercise be observed.

We know how the natural world evolved and there is no exercise of power there, if it is anywhere else give an example that cannot be explained other than by the action of a god.

His power can be observed everywhere, just ones like yourself are closed to it.

Bank if you really are so interested in finding answers to all these wonderful questions you only have to seek out your local Kingdon Hll and you will be warmly welcomed and gladly given a bible study and answers. Or you can log on to JW.org. xx

[**bustysinclaire**]

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@saasher2012 wrote:
Thank you for your honest answer much appreciated!.

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You are very welcome saasher....really xx

[**bustysinclaire**]

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@bankhaunter wrote:

As regards the original question,should religion have such a high value in our society?

From the link I gave earlier "Call someone an Imam, Priest or Reverend and there is nothing they can't get away with".

A person of faith is one who will believe virtually anything on no evidence whatsoever, is that in itself worthy of respect or disdain?

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Your are entitled to your opinion, millions have the opinion there is solid evidence.

[joe_bloggs*]

"However, we also believe that worldy Governments stand in their relevant positions because Jehovah allows them to, because they serve his purpose in the outworking of his promises for mankind.

We are instructed by our God to be obedient to those Governments and the laws of the land"

How can you square that with hitlers Germany?

[bankhaunter]

His power can be observed everywhere, just ones like yourself are closed to it.

I see a natural world that has involved over millions of years, I see no evidence of a supernatural power, it is interesting you have no example, look around you (God did it) is simply not good enough.

Bank if you really are so interested in finding answers to all these wonderful questions you only have to seek out your local Kingdon Hll and you will be warmly welcomed and gladly given a bible study and answers

I would rather look at the discoveries by scientists, they are really exciting, than from those dragging the interpretations they want from an old book written by Bronze/iron age people and I certainly have no intention of wasting any of what life I have left in a pointless belief in a non existent being.

Incidentally if the Bible is inspired by God why didn't he make it easier to understand with the use of plain statements?

[bankhaunter]

Your are entitled to your opinion, millions have the opinion there is solid evidence.

Show me incontrovertible evidence of a supernatural being, it either exists or it doesn't.

[cee-dee]

Earlier in the thread, mention was made of Man polluting the World.

Now one of the greatest causes of pollution is volcanic eruptions. I think a couple of places (of many) in the World which pose the greatest volcanic pollution are Iceland and Indonesia.

Volcanic eruptions throw out masses of Sulphur Dioxide (amongst other things) which oxidise in to Sulphuric Acid and given the right conditions can fall as acid rain.

That being so, I'd like to know how believers reconcile that with the actions of their god? "Oh but that's natural" or "Ours is not to reason why" just won't cut it either!

[merehazle]

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@astrologica wrote:
Book hunter.....I don't know why you have to be so offensive. You make assumptions about people that you know nothing about. The one thing I do know is that a few years ago a lot of people left this board, and the reason that they left was you and your nasty offensive posts. They are designed to provoke and get people's backs up. People like you spoil perfectly good and interesting discussions.. I pity you.
Oh......and I don't read the Daily Mail.

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Well  Book hunter ?

[merehazle]

Well Book hunter ?

[tommy.irene]

Could someone tell me if someone on this thread is useing 2 different ids..... this is good for some to believe in.....      https://uk.news.yahoo.com/video/indian-teen-tail-worshipped-god-133500978.html

[tommy.irene]

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@merehazle wrote:

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@astrologica wrote:
Book hunter.....I don't know why you have to be so offensive. You make assumptions about people that you know nothing about. The one thing I do know is that a few years ago a lot of people left this board, and the reason that they left was you and your nasty offensive posts. They are designed to provoke and get people's backs up. People like you spoil perfectly good and interesting discussions.. I pity you.
Oh......and I don't read the Daily Mail.

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Well  Book hunter ?

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First ive heard of this.. why would people leave .. If you cant stand the heat you shouldnt be posting on here..It was the Tearolls that drove people away.. 

[tommy.irene]

http://www.omgfactsonline.com/worlds-largest-family/     ..The head of the household, Ziona Chana, is part of a religious sect that allows its members to have as many wives as they wish…and he is constantly searching for more!

[bookhunter2007]

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@merehazle wrote:

Well Book hunter ?

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Well, my last attempt to 'engage' with you on this thread was met with a response of “Zzzzzzzzzzzzzz” and a jpeg of what appears to be a wolf. 

As for, should Faith/Religion Have Such a High Value In Our Society? And so why do religious beliefs hold such high status and is it right that they do?

It’s a good question, and a suitable reply would probably need to be somewhat more elaborate than this one. But what I will say, as an atheist I do see some good that does arise out of some aspects of faith and religion.

Emphasis should also be placed on the value of society by religions. In other words, I think it would only be fair to judge the value of faith/religion in society by what faith/religion puts into society in the first place.

If a society is to be judged by how it treats its weakest and most vulnerable. Then I think a good indicator would be to compare the attitudes towards ‘charity’ between religious types and non-religious types.  According to an ICM poll, the top charity givers were Muslims on an ave of £371, then Jewish on £270, then Protestants on £202, then Catholics on £178, and then Atheists in last place on £116.  

You could argue the toss of what constitutes ‘charity’ in the above cases, but it is quite striking how atheists finished last by some margin.  Thus I think it’s only fair that the ‘value’ religion places on society is reciprocated, or at the very least acknowledged when an act in the name of religion has benefited society as a whole.  The interpretations of what 'benefits' society is another matter entirely.

On the flip side, the very idea that acts in the name of religion are altruistic or for the force of ‘good’ for society may not necessarily be so, despite the 'belief' that it is: 

http://scienceblog.com/60730/mother-teresa-anything-but-a-saint/

[merehazle]

 

Booooooo! 

Attempt to waste my time.  Here some more zzzzzzZZZZZzzzzzzz.  And yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah! 

Come on England. 

[astrologica]

Tommy....believe me...it wasn't trolls that drove people away from this board. I was in private e-mail contact with some posters at the time. And they left because of one poster. It is a shame, because this particular poster is capable of posting sensibly, and engaging in debates in an interesting manner. But at times he/she takes a dislike to a poster or posts, and then their posts become offensive and provocative. I totally agree that if one doesn't want to be challenged, then one shouldn't post, but some people might not agree with that. I concur with the old saying...' If you don't want to be criticised, say nothing, do nothing...be nothing'.

[tommy.irene]

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@bookhunter2007 wrote:

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@merehazle wrote:

Well Book hunter ?

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You could argue the toss of what constitutes ‘charity’ in the above cases, but it is quite striking how atheists finished last by some margin.  Thus I think it’s only fair that the ‘value’ religion places on society is reciprocated, or at the very least acknowledged when an act in the name of religion has benefited society as a whole.  The interpretations of what 'benefits' society is another matter entirely.

On the flip side, the very idea that acts in the name of religion are altruistic or for the force of ‘good’ for society may not necessarily be so, despite the 'belief' that it is: 

http://scienceblog.com/60730/mother-teresa-anything-but-a-saint/

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Some good reading here..

[bankhaunter]

Emphasis should also be placed on the value of society by religions. In other words, I think it would only be fair to judge the value of faith/religion in society by what faith/religion puts into society in the first place.

Subtracting of course the harm done to society and individuals by those religions and some of their other actions such as the iffy rushed canonisation process of Mother Theresa.

The results of the survey are interesting but it would be good to know how the subjects were chosen as it may have little to do with actual religious observance, many who would call themselves Christian are rarely seen in a church.

Even if some religious groups do a lot for charity that doesn't confer any right for their opinion on other matters to carry more weight.

I take a daily trip on a train and one day the train crashes, others by me die but I survive. Now I am an expert on train safety, all sorts of people ask for my opinion and I am frequently interviewed.

Am I more knowledgeable after the crash than before, no of course not but it would seem my views are regarded as more worthy of respect, I must be listened to.

That's how it is with religious leaders they are given respect for no other reason.