OK, in or out?

[cee-dee]

How about an RT poll?

No reasons, no argument, no debate just a straightforward IN or OUT.

Me? OUT.

[cee-dee]

When they're found here, they'll be easier to send back without the EU "freedom of movement" malarky.

[upthecreekyetagain]

I don't understand - the EU don't stop us sending any illegal immigrants back, do they?

[fallen-archie]

I thought we could expel illegal immigrants, nothing to do with the EU. Given so many come from Pakistan and Nigeria surely the authorities can deal with it.

[cee-dee]

The rules are geared towards them coming here and also we have to jump through hoops to get rid of them.

All they've got to do it to make sure they don't have a passport so when they're found, they have to be released because they can't be deported because there's no way of proving where they came from, then they disappear again.

[upthecreekyetagain]

Again I don't understand - what rules are you talking about?

As for individuals with no passport the situation will be exactly the same whether we are in or out of the EU.

[cee-dee]

You best look the rules up yourself.

[upthecreekyetagain]

Difficult to find something that doesn't exist

[upthecreekyetagain]

The only rule relating to illegal immigrants I can find is the Dublin Convention - this allows a member of the EU to deport a failed asylum seeker back to another EU country if they first travelled through that country - if we leave the EU we won't even be able to do that.

I really do find it tiresome that points raised on both sides of the EU referendum debate so often have little or no foundation in fact and those making the points are unable to back up their assertions.

If we leave we'll lose x number of jobs, the economy will suffer, holidays in Europe will be more difficult, working/retiring in Europe will be harder, inter-agency cooperation will cease decreasing our security etc.

Staying in means more immigration, a less efficient NHS, loss of sovereignty,(whatever that means), reduce the risk of terrorist attacks etc.

As soon as you challenge any of those propositions you soon find that there is very little hard evidence to support any of them.

[joe_bloggs*]

[cee-dee]

You didn't look did you? They're there if you look, should take less than 10 seconds to find.

[fallen-archie]

So you are suggesting anyone found on British soil without a passport or formal I'd cannot be expelled? Surely if that is the case the politicians need to do what they are paid for and enact legislation to address it.

[dark_castle1]

Still voting     OUT

[cee-dee]

Well, that seems to be the case. If, when they (the authorities) find an illegal and they can't find any document which proves their (the illegal's) country of origin, they can't send them to a detention centre while they're prepared for deportation, they have to be released but are supposed to report to a police station at regular intervals but what happens then is they just disappear.

The process is then repeated if they're found again but the next time they're then charged with failing to report. If they're bailed again, they just clear off again.

When first found, the reason they're "illegal" is because they can't produce any document proving that they entered the country legally.

[upthecreekyetagain]

It is a problem, one that all countries face, not just members of the EU.

I'm still searching for those rules you mention - surely you can spare 10 seconds of your time and provide a link 🙂

[upthecreekyetagain]

---

@fallen-archie wrote:
So you are suggesting anyone found on British soil without a passport or formal I'd cannot be expelled? Surely if that is the case the politicians need to do what they are paid for and enact legislation to address it.

---

It's a real problem and I don't know what the answer is.  If you don't know where someone has come from nor how they entered the country how can you expel them.  

Let's say you decide they came from India - you can't just put them on a plane to India without any documentation - they'd just be sent straight back by India.  Can you imagine the reaction here if for instance India started sending people here without any documents other than a claim by the Indian government that they were English!

[cee-dee]

No, if I keep you looking, it'll stop you arguing

You watch, when you find them you'll argue about them

[upthecreekyetagain]

As I said earlier - as soon as you ask anyone who makes an assertion that this, that or the other will/does happen because we are in/out of the EU they simply cannot back it up.

You've just the joined the likes of Cameron and Boris - all words and no substance.

[evoman3957]

[cee-dee]

OK then, PROVE that there's no rules (they're actually quite extensive).

(You can always tell when an argument's lost, personal insults start).

[fallen-archie]

In reply to the troublesome twins up there ^^^ if an immigrant turns up without any paperwork as seems to be the latest ploy, would we not be better off detaining them outside the mainland until such time as they prove who they are, where they are from and their reason for seeking to live in the UK. There is no need to treat them inhumanely but we need some kind of plan to contain the problem and to deter economic immigrants coming here. The other area of concern that requires greater thought is the role of those in ethnic communities who seek to protect and provide shelter, food even employment. All of this is possible inside or outside the EU.