OK, in or out?

[cee-dee]

How about an RT poll?

No reasons, no argument, no debate just a straightforward IN or OUT.

Me? OUT.

[fallen-archie]

That's very sad Lynda, but forgive me asking what a GP might have done as opposed to a paramedic which might have extended the life of a 93 year old? 

[goldenwonders]

---

@5129frederick wrote:

Question:  What do you call a strange man with an unpronouncable name who bangs on your door at 1am?

Answer:  "Ah, Doctor.  Do come in ..."

---

Usually I'd call him/her Dr Singh, Dr Shawa, or maybe any number of other Asian, African names because the majority of overseas doctors that make up the professionally qualified members of the NHS come from outside the euro zone!

As for how they sound or how they look - well I don't care because if you are trying to put a racist slant on it, that is totally irrelevant and you have completely missed the point.

The issue here is there are limited resources that are available and if we continue to flood this country with the ever increasing number of health travellers - then kiss goodbye to the muticoloured NHS!

But maybe you're convinced that all the migrant lines in Calais are made up of doctors, nurses with the occasional brain surgeon thrown in for good measure, all coming to support the good old UK! Obviously there were no jobs for them elsewhere in Europe as they made their way to Calais.

Vote Out

[joe_bloggs*]

I wonder if any of this will affect the Eurovision song contest ? I've never heard anybody mention it 

[upthecreekyetagain]

---

@goldenwonders wrote:

---

@5129frederick wrote:

Question:  What do you call a strange man with an unpronouncable name who bangs on your door at 1am?

Answer:  "Ah, Doctor.  Do come in ..."

---

Usually I'd call him/her Dr Singh, Dr Shawa, or maybe any number of other Asian, African names because the majority of overseas doctors that make up the professionally qualified members of the NHS come from outside the euro zone!

As for how they sound or how they look - well I don't care because if you are trying to put a racist slant on it, that is totally irrelevant and you have completely missed the point.

The issue here is there are limited resources that are available and if we continue to flood this country with the ever increasing number of health travellers - then kiss goodbye to the muticoloured NHS!

But maybe you're convinced that all the migrant lines in Calais are made up of doctors, nurses with the occasional brain surgeon thrown in for good measure, all coming to support the good old UK! Obviously there were no jobs for them elsewhere in Europe as they made their way to Calais.

Vote Out

---

Very unlikely they are all doctors but there are obviously enough refugee doctors to make it worthwhile for the BMA to have a special programme to assist refugee doctors to set up in this country.

During my recent stays in hospital there were significant numbers of EU migrants, mostly from Eastern Europe, amongst the catering, cleaning and porter staff.  They may not be doctors but then again the hospital couldn't have worked without them.

40% of doctors in this country are from the ethnic minorities as at the time of the last census in 2011.  These aren't however likely to be subject to deportation if we leave the EU, irrespective of where there origins are but who will decide the 'fate' of all the support staff.

Why haven't any politicians, (that I've listened to), come out and said what they'd like to see happen in regard to current EU migrants?

[start-the-fire]

poll of the day by AOL of 18,000 odd votes 64% vote out  24% in  and rest undecided.

[evoman3957]

Poor old Terry Wogan, I used to love his commentaries on Eurovision. His dry wit & occasional sarcasm, was lost on them there foreigners......it used to have me roaring though.

[mikes*corvettes]

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@upthecreekyetagain wrote:

Why haven't any politicians, (that I've listened to), come out and said what they'd like to see happen in regard to current EU migrants?

---

If the out vote wins any changes won't be made overnight.

I dare say any EU migrants not working at that time will be asked to vacate immediately and those in employment will be given the option to stay and carry on working for a further 12-24 months if they so wish as long as they carry on being employed.

This will give us time to rebuild our infrastructures and recruit - train UK citizens.

[goldenwonders]

Very unlikely they are all doctors but there are obviously enough refugee doctors to make it worthwhile for the BMA to have a special programme to assist refugee doctors to set up in this country.

During my recent stays in hospital there were significant numbers of EU migrants, mostly from Eastern Europe, amongst the catering, cleaning and porter staff.  They may not be doctors but then again the hospital couldn't have worked without them.

40% of doctors in this country are from the ethnic minorities as at the time of the last census in 2011.  These aren't however likely to be subject to deportation if we leave the EU, irrespective of where there origins are but who will decide the 'fate' of all the support staff.

Why haven't any politicians, (that I've listened to), come out and said what they'd like to see happen in regard to current EU migrants?

---

Creeky, there may indeed be a significant number of migrants from outside the EU working in support NHS roles but what has that got to do with closing the door on the EU? Why should they be removed, they have jobs and are contributing, give them a visa! Indeed if we left the EU they may all get pay rises and be paid a better wage which would also prove more attractive to our own British workers - of all colours and creeds! (just so Frederick can't push the racist card!)

The BMA are so desperate for doctors they will recruit anywhere they can, just as they have been recruiting nurses in the Phillipines for years. Again at the expense of trained UK nurses who cannot get jobs! You have to ask why that is? - It's because there is plenty of cheap labour outside this country - so - rather than pay a realistic wage it's better to grab someone who'll be happy with less because they would not get paid anywhere near as much in their own country. It keeps wages down but above all It's living off the backs of poverty!

You asked what would happen to all the migrant children if we left, well I am a realist not a racist! Do you really believe we can support an ever growing population of migrants all at the expense of depriving a reasonable education for our own children? UK Education is rapidly going down the pan - it cannot cope, and it's today's generation of British children who are the losers! Is that fair??? Maybe we should give a little more consideration to our children.

Vote OUT

[upthecreekyetagain]

Again - you MAY be right as regards EU migrants in this country as MAY Mike - but have you heard anyone in a position to actually make such a decision say what WILL happen - or is this just another of the great unknowns?

What of European defence? - NATO has passed this over to the EU in practical terms - will we leave?

What worries me is that if we get an IN vote won't this mean that the electorate has given Parliament a mandate to approve closer ties with the EU - of course it might mean the eventual formation of an elected European government.

As regards your description of the education system it is not one that I recognise despite living just a few miles from one of the most diverse and numerous ethnic population centres.  My daughter is a teacher as is my son-in-law - both have a high proportion of pupils who don't have English as their first language - yet their student results are amongst the best in the country.  No doubt there are many schools that do fit your description but to suggest that they are the norm does a disservice to our education system as a whole and is still amongst the best in the world.

[mikes*corvettes]

The other question that also needs an answer is, what's going to happen to UK citizens who live and work in EU countries and may have even bought property in their respective country of choice.

[goldenwonders]

---

@upthecreekyetagain wrote:

Again - you MAY be right as regards EU migrants in this country as MAY Mike - but have you heard anyone in a position to actually make such a decision say what WILL happen - or is this just another of the great unknowns?

What of European defence? - NATO has passed this over to the EU in practical terms - will we leave?

What worries me is that if we get an IN vote won't this mean that the electorate has given Parliament a mandate to approve closer ties with the EU - of course it might mean the eventual formation of an elected European government.

As regards your description of the education system it is not one that I recognise despite living just a few miles from one of the most diverse and numerous ethnic population centres.  My daughter is a teacher as is my son-in-law - both have a high proportion of pupils who don't have English as their first language - yet their student results are amongst the best in the country.  No doubt there are many schools that do fit your description but to suggest that they are the norm does a disservice to our education system as a whole and is still amongst the best in the world.

---

Sorry Creeky the You Tube video leaves me a bit bemused? Am I correct in assuming its been made by 'New Jersey Minority Educational Development' - not sure what they know of the realities of UK education?? Myself I normally associate You Tube with video's about aliens and conspiracy theories, sorry I'm being facetious.

Since you chose 2015 as a guide did you know that and I quote..."The proportion of teenagers achieving the top grade at GCSE declined for the fourth year in a row". That was during 2015.

I am not sure where your daughter and son-in law teach, or how long they have been teachers. So I think we clearly are going to have to differ about the quality of UK education, but maybe you should look at todays BBC news story about the lack of teachers and falling standards in Stoke on Trent - just another inner city where there are serious problems - just as I said earlier with core subjects such as Maths!

A maths teacher is worth his/her weight in gold, in fact any 'good teacher' is worth their weight in gold.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/education-35631030

There are so many unknowns - either in or out - that's why we all have to make up our own mind, but maybe nows the time to be positive.

[cee-dee]

Amazing isn't it? My OP was clear enough wasn't it? =  "No reasons, no argument, no debate just a straightforward IN or OUT" and look what's happened?

It was supposed to be a straightforward poll. Gone out of the window now and particularly annoying after UTCYA was most considerate in starting a new thread specificlly for debate and is all that silly quoting really necessary?.

[right-then-petal]

[jd.linklater]

Just had a recount of the votes on here so far while trying to eliminate the duplicates that have appeared through quoting previous posts .

20 out

3 in

5 undecided

1 spoilt paper

[start-the-fire]

Sorry CD, but think you have to shoulder some to blame your post at 14 started the off track as it were 

Spoiler

, still half of viewed voted, and some would have looked in on other ids, Though forum ebayers may cast a disproportionate view of the general population whos to say.

[baybizz]

Out. It's been a con trick from the beginning.  We were sold a European Common Market, a free trade area.  But the European Superstate had been planned in the background by Jean Monnet & co, and Heath and Wilson knew it.  Everyone voted yes for a so-innocent-sounding Common Market - and once the vote was in the bag, the carefully hidden EU Superstate political monster heaved itself up out of the bog... 

For anyone interested in reading how it was done:

>> The Great Deception was the pretence to the citizens of the European countries involved that successive treaties embodying economic integration were needed to give more jobs and economic growth, when the real agenda throughout has remained political integration, the construction of a federal European superstate under the joint hegemony of France and Germany...

https://archive.irishdemocrat.co.uk/book-reviews/the-great-deception/

[5129frederick]

Hey, Goldilocks:

Perhaps I should explain something to you.  What I came out with was a JOKE.  OK?

J.O.K.E.  An old joke at that.  It's been around years.  What I came out with is no more racist than a Bernard Manning mother-in-law/thick Irishman/Jewish joke or any other joke.  I don't give a damn whether somebody is black, white or Caucasian - if they can do the job as well as the next man/woman then so be it.  The one thing I will NOT do is worry about whether or not it will cause offence to a VERY small minority of hypersentative individuals who seem only too ready to rally round saying:  "That man is a racist/heathan because he made a joke about an Irish priest by the name of Patrick."  They're standard stand-up comedian jokes which you can hear in any pub or workshop any day of the week.  

[dark_castle1]

yes fred a VERY OLD joke that I heard many moons ago and that is why I did not laugh  lol.

As for you being racist ! that is the one certainty in here is that you are in no way racist and I for one am very pleased to see you back in the forums.

[lucybelle2006]

In

And scrap that stupid "deal" too. If we are to be part of a union then we all need to follow the same rules, not get special treatment to keep us part of the group

Plus. I think immigration is a wonderful thing and needs to be encouraged for the good of the human race

[*.*..lola..*.*]

I'm on the fence with Creeky