13-02-2014 2:34 PM
http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/dave-lee-travis-trial-verdict-3140440
Let's hope he can put all this behind him now and get on with his life!
15-02-2014 8:31 PM
Sorry, Saasher - but are you and I living on the same planet? You think it's acceptable that he may have lied and then it's okay for the jury to have found him "not guilty" because they are too stupid to make up their own minds? You think he's lied and it's okay, because he might get away with it. Really?????
15-02-2014 8:40 PM
@kiss*my*pixel wrote:Sorry, Saasher - but are you and I living on the same planet? You think it's acceptable that he may have lied and then it's okay for the jury to have found him "not guilty" because they are too stupid to make up their own minds? You think he's lied and it's okay, because he might get away with it. Really?????
What a load of **bleep** is been said on this thread...HE WAS FOUND NOT GUILTY..LIVE WITH IT..
15-02-2014 8:40 PM
Cee-Dee - you are putting forward your hypothetical scenario of a car crime on an equal level, which it is not. There cannot always be any physical evidence of an assault - an unwanted "grope" doesn't leave evidence, also there may not always be witnessess (calculated by the perpetrator).
And in my real life, I (and colleagues) DID complain, but naturally, nothing was done, it was simply dismissed as "harmless fun". In those days, it was seen as "the norm".
15-02-2014 8:44 PM
I think that selective reasoning just proves how unreliable some arguments are and a read of this article (I see we have Guardian fans on here) might just show why DTL was found Not Guilty:-
http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/feb/13/prosecution-case-dave-lee-travis-fell-apart
This bit hasn't had much publicity:-
"Halfway through the trial, a member of the public contacted the DJ's legal team after reading about the claims in the Sun.
He told them he had an amateur video, filmed at the opening of a hospital radio station where Travis was alleged to have sexually assaulted a carnival princess while they were alone, touring the wards.
The video was crucial, Travis's barrister Stephen Vullo said, because it suggested that at no time was Travis away from his wife, Marianne, and therefore he could not possibly have molested the girl."
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-02-2014 8:47 PM
So one crime with no physical evidence is different to another where there is also no physical evidence?
So, as it's not "the norm" now, why aren't you doing what DLTs accusers did?
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-02-2014 8:48 PM
@kiss*my*pixel wrote:Cee-Dee - you are putting forward your hypothetical scenario of a car crime on an equal level, which it is not. There cannot always be any physical evidence of an assault - an unwanted "grope" doesn't leave evidence, also there may not always be witnessess (calculated by the perpetrator).
And in my real life, I (and colleagues) DID complain, but naturally, nothing was done, it was simply dismissed as "harmless fun". In those days, it was seen as "the norm".
Yes it was the norm and no one was taking to court for it.. But they are beeing tried now for it ..you can get big money now for your story and can sue.
15-02-2014 8:51 PM - edited 15-02-2014 8:52 PM
15-02-2014 9:02 PM
@saasher2012 wrote:
No what I find unacceptable is the fact that a man accused of a crime even when cleared because of lack of evidence etc is automatically thought to be lying. Purely because he is male& although we do not know him personally we assume the papers reports on him are the truth, he seems to be being punished for others misconduct .. I also despise the wrong doings to women, but have also seen the treatment of women to men in the working place It cuts both ways. It is a sad fact women do lie to get back at men & they use this to it's full advantage, to the detriment of women who really need help. All I'm saying is there are faults on both sides.it is within our capacity to see both sides with an open mind without prejudice & fairness.
This is a very good post and i would give it 10 out of 10.. as shown on here people wont let him be Not Guilty.
15-02-2014 9:10 PM
Cee-Dee - I put it behind me (it wasn't nearly as serious as some of these claims, as I've mentioned in the WR thread), and two of the old guys are most probably dead now, hopefully (actually, I know for sure one of them is). Mine were isolated incidents and I got out of them unscathed. That is not the point - the point is, worse things happened to other people, they weren't believed, now they may be. The point is, these women are brave enough to come forward now, having been afraid to speak out before, and now are still not being believed. I'm just trying to get you to understand that things like this happened but people like you refuse to believe it. You all just think that because they are well-known names, they couldn't possibly be guilty. Well of course, they could - possibly. Not saying they are, but just ..... possibly
15-02-2014 9:15 PM
I understand what you are saying CD, if a man cannot prove his innocence because of lack of evidence , does that mean he is automatically guilty. Of course he isn't! Just because you don't like the the man & he has never hidden the fact he flirts.doesn't make him guilty, he may have lied but the fact remains he was cleared by a jury of equal numbers of male & female .
The accusers have the same problem but in fairness they can also lie, & the reasons for it have been covered on this thread & on the WR thread.
Hang on just a second, Saasher - I was commenting on your post (quoted above ^^) where you said "he may have lied but"
I asked why you think it is acceptable that he may have lied and managed to get away with it.
15-02-2014 9:24 PM
@kiss*my*pixel wrote:Cee-Dee - I put it behind me (it wasn't nearly as serious as some of these claims, as I've mentioned in the WR thread), and two of the old guys are most probably dead now, hopefully (actually, I know for sure one of them is). Mine were isolated incidents and I got out of them unscathed. That is not the point - the point is, worse things happened to other people, they weren't believed, now they may be. The point is, these women are brave enough to come forward now, having been afraid to speak out before, and now are still not being believed. I'm just trying to get you to understand that things like this happened but people like you refuse to believe it. You all just think that because they are well-known names, they couldn't possibly be guilty. Well of course, they could - possibly. Not saying they are, but just ..... possibly
I know were your coming from.. but these men were found NOT GUILTY by a Jury of 12 people.. Stewart Hall was found GUILTY.. and no one is talking about him..
15-02-2014 9:28 PM
15-02-2014 9:43 PM
Stuart Hall changed his plea and pleaded Guilty.
I see the evidence at #44 has been ignored?
Going back to earlier comments about celebrities being able to afford a top legal team thereby implying that the defence team was somehow stronger than that of the prosecution, I think Miranda Moore would be highly offended by insinuations that she is somehow "inferior" to Stephen Vullo.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
15-02-2014 9:55 PM
15-02-2014 10:01 PM
15-02-2014 10:06 PM
PS - I'm going to apologise for not keeping up with all the posts, I can't get used to this new format. In the good old days, the newest post just used to appear at the bottom of the thread. This new system has replies leaping around all over the place and I simply cannot find them all, therefore miss a lot!
I'm going to say goodnight now, anyway - Goodnight all
15-02-2014 10:17 PM
No it's not, read it properly, the relevant part was the C & P I posted.
A man contacted the defence team as he had a film of one of the events where DLT was supposed to have molested one of the complainants. The film proved he was with his wife all the time.
It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.
16-02-2014 12:19 PM
#47 Excellent post, Sam very well said.
I can assure you I know which planet I'm on, it is one without prejudice & I hope compassion for both sides, no one will win in this case both are harmed in one way or another!
Amen to that
16-02-2014 12:37 PM
16-02-2014 2:44 PM
Reading the responses to the Roache thread and this one, I wouldn't like to face a jury comprised of some of the respondents.
I've been having similar thoughts myself, CeeDee brrr .... although in all honesty, most of us are guilty of prejudice in one form or another during the course of our lives.
I remember the Joanna Yeates murder enquiry in Bristol when it was reported that the girl's landlord Chris Jefferies had been arrested. I took one look at the pictures of him and immediately decided that he was guilty based purely on the fact that he had a bit of an 'oddball' appearance
He later wrote about the mental torture he went through during that time and the utter devastion that those false allegations had had on his life and I felt thoroughly, thoroughly ashamed of myself.
Hopefully now, if I ever get called up for jury service that incident alone will have taught me not to be so judgemental.