Entering your own tracking number for non Simple Delivery items where compensation cover needed

[j.p.greenwood]

Members should read this post first to understand that Simple Delivery, in many cases, will not give you any compensation coverage.

https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Seller-Central/Where-you-REALLY-stand-on-shipping-using-Simple-Deliv...

So, my concerns are that members will ship items using Simple Delivery and not realise they may not be covered, if E-Bay update information regarding my earlier post I'll add extra info here and in that post.

Please also clearly understand that Simple Delivery is still getting rolled out, not every member is at the same point in the rollout, so what is currently suggested here may not work for you or may work today, but not in a week.   I can't control that so won't be able to offer any advice what to do if it doesn't work for you.

This method is based upon using the web interface to do this, I don't use the App so if App users could perhaps add comments about the methodology to do it that way that would be incredibly helpful.

The current system, while not currently clear to many, has a couple of specific issues with regard to how shipping works, how it's tracked and how the tracking info automatically releases funds to sellers.  The method detailed here should hopefully address some of those issues and still allow members to fully comply with E-Bays myriad of sometimes contradictory rules.

So, here's a 'workflow' of the current system......

1.  List Item, choose shipping options within Simple Delivery (courier, express or standard etc...)

2.  Buyer buys item.  E-Bay generates shipping information for either EVRI or RM shipping label.

3.  Seller packages up item, takes to either EVRI or RM drop off point with information required to generate shipping label.

4.  Package enters shippers network, tracking number automatically populates E-Bays internal systems.

5.  Package arrives at destination and is marked in couriers and E-Bays systems as delivered (I don't want to get into the minutiae of what is and isn't a genuine delivery in this message, that's a conversation that's being had numerous times elsewhere already).

6.  48 Hours later E-Bay should release the funds to the seller.

That is a simplified workflow, it doesn't address all cases, but covers the bulk.

However, if sending items, that according to the current information I detailed in my previous post linked above, are not eligible for compensation according to E-Bays published rules, how can you send items, still get compensation cover, still comply with the E-Bay rules and NOT end up having to end up paying for two lots of postage?

Here's a way I believe works, complies with the current rules and means sellers don't end up out of pocket.

Firstly, when making a listing you MUST choose the option that you, the seller, will pay for the postage, but before listing calculate the postage costs using the alternative shipping method of your own choice, not using Simple Delivery and then either decide to add that amount to your listing price before listing or you may decide you'll pay this postage cost yourself, that's your decision to take.

Follow the same procedure in 1 & 2 above.

Now, for 3. above instead buy your own postage, perhaps by Royal Mail Special Delivery, perhaps some other method that ensures that your item has compensation coverage.  Package up item and apply postal label of YOUR chosen postal method.

Drop off already fully labelled (using label you bought from alternate courier service) item at your postal service of choice as per 4 above, DO NOT use the Simple Delivery label or information, except keep it to ensure you can get this charge refunded (see below).

Package enters couriers network as per 4. above, however, you now have to manually enter the tracking number from the alternate shipping method you chose.

Go here

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sh/ord/?filter=status:ALL_ORDERS

You'll see, inside each order, there's a 'Tracking' field, you should be able to either click the 'Tracking' field directly or the 'edit' button beside it.

Add or edit the new tracking information, this should get accepted by E-Bays systems.

Hopefully if all's gone to plan, E-Bays systems will automatically now detect a successful delivery and automatically release your funds two days later.

The last thing you need to do is get the refund for the Simple Delivery you didn't use.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/claims/simple-delivery/refund/seller

I'm not sure exactly when you can make this claim, personally I WOULDN'T make it under any circumstances before your funds were released as it may confuse E-Bays internal systems.  I would make it the day I transferred money from my E-Bay balance to my own bank and not more than a couple of days after that as it may 'time out' thus depriving you of the opportunity to get the refund.

Hopefully this method, will allow members to ship items with the appropriate level of compensation where E-Bay Simple Delivery precludes it, meets E-Bay rules as everything is being done above board and in a transparent way, allows members to be able to get their payments in the same timescale as the current Simple Delivery system and means members aren't being penalised for requiring compensation coverage that Simple Delivery just doesn't allow.

I hope this is of use to people, as I stated earlier though, Simple Delivery is still being rolled out, it's possible that future changes may 'break' this method, so please don't hold me responsible if that ends up being the case.

[lucy_farmer]

'The last thing you need to do is get the refund for the Simple  Delivery you didn't use.'

'I'm not sure exactly when you can make this claim,'

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I think it's within 14 days of down-loading the S.D. label. 

[450-262541]

I'd strongly advise any one NOT to go the 'Seller Pays For Postage' route.

I can see why on the face of it, it seems a good idea : offer free postage , you get to choose how you deal with it. I thought so myself at first.

But once you try claiming back the postage for several orders a day it is just unneeded stress. You should make the claim immediately because if you're doing several orders how are you going to remember which you've done and which you haven't? You get no acknowledgement of any submission and I have my doubts about getting every label cost back that I've asked for. Are you going to remember to check every 14 days after every single order that you've been refunded? And if you aren't refunded, how are you going to prove that you sent the request in within the timeframe that will just have expired?

The workarounds already add a lot of time to dispatch, don't waste even more time submitting a claim and then checking up on it to see if you  have or haven't had your money back 

Go 'Buyer Pays For Postage' instead every time.

No buyer is going to mind paying around £3 for postage and getting  a message from you saying you've upgraded it to RM Special Delivery at no extra cost to them. They will 100% get a refund automatically and even though most buyers don't understand how it is working yet, that is also a bonus for them that you can point out that 'you' have done for them.

Put in the description that the item will be sent by RM Special Delivery and build the postage cost into your sale price just as you would for Free postage.

Simples 😃

[450-262541]

Another advantage I forgot to mention is that , maybe one day soon, ebay will tinker with the system to block some workarounds that are publicly mentioned on this forum since they've already tried very hard to block off most of them. 

They'll never be able to stop you using the Buyer Pays method in my last reply because that is, in itself, the essence of Simple Delivery

[xyz307xyz]

"I'd strongly advise any one NOT to go the 'Seller Pays For Postage' route. ...

But once you try claiming back the postage for several orders a day it is just unneeded stress."

My reading of the original message is that is a process for items that should not/cannot be sent Simple Delivery.

"However, if sending items, that according to the current information I detailed in my previous post linked above, are not eligible for compensation according to E-Bays published rules,"

Indeed when I wrote (shorter) versions of the same process a while back, for specific cases that was true.

I expect it would be a lot of hassle to send a lot of items which could be sent Simple Delivery and then claim the label costs back. Ebay may also not be too happy with a seller who is [repeatedly] avoiding Simple Delivery just because they want to.

[450-262541]

I also read the original message before I replied to it. 

What I've said applies here because that is specifically why I'm using RM Special Delivery instead of Simple Delivery for exactly those sorts of items, to ensure I have that cover if the buyer claims it didn't arrive or arrived damaged. 

"Ebay may also not be too happy with a seller who is [repeatedly] avoiding Simple Delivery just because they want to." 

So what?

I'm not too happy with ebay [repeatedly] forcing Simple Delivery on me just because they want to.

And how are they ever going to even know, if as far as they are concerned,  the buyer is paying for the postage using Simple Delivery?

[xyz307xyz]

Fair enough. If you are sending items with ebay says can't be sent Simple Delivery then clearly that works well for you.

I'm not arguing with you but for anyone else who is just avoiding Simple Delivery on items which could be posted Simple Delivery then ebay could easily total up the number of refunded to buyer labels for items per seller. If Simple Delivery was Simple to avoid, in my view there wouldn't be much point making in mandatory in the first place - but maybe that thinking is just too ... Simple.

[vinylscot]

I can't see any reason why either of the above strategies wouldn't work. As of right now, they don't appear to breach any of SD's rules.

Indeed, one of the reasons eBay allows you to request a refund for an unused label is "I wanted to add additional protection to my delivery". Although it hasn't been widely publicised, I think that is the way to send items, when you really are not confident of Simple Delivery providing enough protection.

However, note, at the moment, that eBay are insisting refunds are requested within 14 days of the sale of the item, not the dispatch date or the receipt date, so you are pretty time-limited. (I do believe this is one condition which is possibly illegal, as eBay is proposing to keep payment for a service they have not provided - I would expect this to be changed at some point to a more automated refund system, if there is a legal challenge.)

With regard to how eBay feels about those who continually do this, I don't think there really is anything they can do, as the t's and c's currently stand. They have allowed this opt-out, although they're doing their best to keep it quiet, so I would think they will need to allow sellers to decide when to use it, whether occasionally or every time.

I don't agree that you should go "buyer pays postage", as that leaves the seller needing to add more into the item price to cover their actual postage fees. There is no reason why the buyer should get literally "free" postage, unless you particularly want him to. (I appreciate this whole scenario is most appropriate for higher value goods, so with something costing £500, £3 is neither here nor there, so it may be insignificant, but it does introduce an unnecessary "kink" into the process - what if eBay doesn't refund the buyer? Do you want buyers to find out you seem to have done it the "wrong" way? etc.) I would always go "seller pays postage" to try to keep it simple.

[450-262541]

Clearly they have gone to a lot of effort to try and make it mandatory, and if it worked great for me I wouldn't bother about that. But it doesn't work for me when they is so much uncertainty about whether or not certain high value items will be compensated for if they are, or are not, on various exclusion lists. Nor does it work at the moment for regarding combining multiple items into one or more parcels. Also I can make more money by sending some other items more cheaply with Yodel rather than with Evri or RM, that alone is worth the extra minutes it takes to do.

Hopefully they will total up all the refunded labels, then they will see how many people are not just rolling over. So far it isn't in the ebay usage terms and conditions that you HAVE to use Simple Delivery or else you can't use the platform. And whilst it is causing so much chaos to implement correctly, they really would be foolish to press that too hard. The thread on here about that poor seller who has accidentally ended up as a test case - no way do I want to be in that position and yet I want to continue selling stuff in the meantime.

I'm just advising people as to what I know is an easier way to get by than jumping through the hoops necessary to reclaim unused postage paid for by the seller if you offer the postage for free.

[450-262541]

By all means act as you wish, but you appear to be missing the fact that you'd not need to add in any more to the sale price than you would if it was 'seller pays' to cover your costs. And even if ebay doesn't refund the buyer, they won't mind because they know that they'll have paid £3-ish for a £10-ish service and that their ( for example in your case) expensive record is much more likely to arrive safe and undamaged. The refund will come 30 days later when they've forgotten about it, but they'll still think more highly of you as a seller for 'giving them a refund' than they would if you'd just listed it as Free postage in the first place. Most buyers won't even know or care what the 'wrong' way is unless they happen to be a well-informed seller themselves.

[j.p.greenwood]

My workflow is specifically designed, as is stated, to allow members to not end up paying two lots of shipping costs.  If members are happy to pay both sets of shipping that's a decision for them to take.

[450-262541]

I never said anything about sellers having to pay two lots of shipping costs.

You either haven't read my reply properly or you have misunderstood it.

With all due respect to the fact that I can see from your post that you've put this up to try and help people, which is why I decided to add to it, your 'specifically designed workflow' reads as if you actually haven't tried it out yet yourself in practice.

I've been doing this for the past three weeks ever since they switched one of my accounts over to Simple
Delivery.

If you ran your 'workflow' for several orders a day for three weeks you'd encounter the same issue I did regarding the seller postage refund. 

Try it.

[the-nutwood-collection]

With regard to how eBay feels about those who continually do this, I don't think there really is anything they can do ...

What they can do is send your listings down, down, down, among the weeds - like they do if you don't pay for PL.

[450-262541]

I know that you didn't actually address this to me but if you don't mind me adding my tuppence; I can't say either way from my own experience if that is, or is not the case, because I don't know as I don't go chasing buyers who haven't the sense to look beyond 'Best Match' search results.

As long as I reasonably do OK in 'Price&postage- lowest to highest' searches without it becoming a race to the bottom, that's all I'm after and there is nothing ebay can do to push anyone's listings down in that regard.

I've never paid for PL, and never will 😃