Getting a bit sick of this over charged postage.

[gogetafix]

The last few months I've been buying from ebay quite frequenty. On some small items I've bought the postage has been set on the listing at £3.20 (Second Class Small Parcel). When the items arrive they have been sent as a Large Letter for £0.96p. I do know that postage includes packing as well. The latest parcel that I had arrive was just a very cheap jiffy bag. No extra bubble wrap or anything. So not a lot of cost with the packing. 20p at most.
Knowing these boards I know some my cry "Well you were happy to pay the postage price" and yes this is true I was happy to pay the postage price because I presumed it would be sent as a small parcel. The items I buy aren't that flat so I presume they would be over 2.5cms in depth. Perhaps the sellers thinks the item will have to sent as a small parcel hence the £3.20 Second Class postage price. 
When these sellers post their parcels and find out it can be sent as a Large Letter and pay for that service they pocket that difference in cost and don't bother sending their buyer a message and say it was sent as a Large Letter and not a Small Parcel so here's a small refund. These people must think their buyers are stupid. 
I also know these sellers have fees to pay but keeping the cost of postage that wasn't paid is all a bit of a con in my opinion. If it were me I'd partially refund the buyer. 

[plpmr]

This fantasy about being overcharged has been going on for a long as I can remember.

Perhaps its time for eBay to do away with postage leaving it up to sellers to work the cost into the price?

That would also do away with requests for combined postage.

However I'm sure the diehards would still find reason to complain.

[nik_moore]

Who mentioned anything abuot being overcharged? Mentioning that the seller profits from p+p isn't against anything, it's merely pointing out a fact to future purchasers.

[hill-walker]

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@nik_moore wrote:

Who mentioned anything abuot being overcharged? Mentioning that the seller profits from p+p isn't against anything, it's merely pointing out a fact to future purchasers.

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fact = opinion

[mrs-trebus16]

Large letter prices can vary depending on weight as well as size. Other things to factor in are printing the postage labels (paper, ink, printer maintenance), cost of fuel to go to post office and varying types of packaging.  So, a lot of sellers just factor a set amount

I once put £2 in the parcel because the buyer bought two of the same item and both had the same postage amount (two seprarate listings). I didn't even get a thank you message, no feedback, nothing. I won't do it again

[hill-walker]

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@mrs-trebus16 wrote:

I once put £2 in the parcel because the buyer bought two of the same item and both had the same postage amount (two seprarate listings). I didn't even get a thank you message, no feedback, nothing. I won't do it again

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Similar experience here; a guy recently bought two small items from me, and paid in full, with two lots of P&P. I put both in the same box, and once his items had arrived, I sent him a part refund, of the second lot of P&P.  Never heard a word back. Didn't leave FB either.  😞

[txt.ltd]

the displayed postage charge should not reflect the cost of postage. here is an example for a VAT-registered seller:

packaging costs £0.10

RM48 1g-1000g packet: £2.72 (£2.56 * 1.06 (surcharge))

so we're at £2.82.

charge that, then, right?

no.

sometimes the per-order fee is included in the 'first-item' postage element.

so add that (£0.30) and we get to £3.12

VAT has to be paid

fees have to be paid

increase to cover VAT and fees at the same time (£3.12 / (1-((0.2/1.2)+0.129))

gives £4.43, which is 163% of the actual postage cost.

there are other elements in postage too, for example if an item weighs 500g the seller may charge £3.50 then £1.00 per additional item due to the need to make several packages the heavier the order gets

overall it's pretty complicated and I can now say due to my selling that I understand these high postage costs better

[mrs-trebus16]

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@txt.ltd wrote:

overall it's pretty complicated and I can now say due to my selling that I understand these high postage costs better

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Exactly right, if someone doesn't experience something they judge and critcise

The CEO of Sainsburys went to work every job that was 'beneath' him so that he could better uderstand what every job entailed. When I had my company I did the same and found two things. One was that I understood the pitfalls of any job my workers did. Two, I knew when they were not performing properly or pretending to work (things not done that I knew could have and should have been.

So, if you are a seller, you understand the different elements of postage costs, variances in packaging and the cost of it, what your printer costs you to run and the same for your car and it's journery to post your items. You also understand the importance of star rating and feedback (not so much nowadays). This is just for private sellers. Businesses also may be VAT registered, may have rent and business rates to pay, utility bills, may have staff to pay etc., the list could be endless and all costs have to factored in to make a viable buiness

Buyers who have never sold anything have no idea what selling entails and simply think every penny is profit

[txt.ltd]

yes, you're so right in this. and it's worse when buyers speak out about it as if they are a victim of their own choices.

never heard a buyer complain about the eBay fees in a sale price either.

wouldn't be surprised if at least a third of buyers either:

• don't think about the cost of selling on eBay that is included in the prices
• think it's free to sell on eBay

also it irks me when buyers complain about how much profit they think sellers are making. as if they understand anything about that, i.e. profit is where all operational expenses must come from before net profit is realised. of course it is going to be higher than they imagine.

[txt.ltd]

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@plpmr wrote:

This fantasy about being overcharged has been going on for a long as I can remember.

Perhaps its time for eBay to do away with postage leaving it up to sellers to work the cost into the price?

That would also do away with requests for combined postage.

However I'm sure the diehards would still find reason to complain.

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they would probably complain that the postage charge is 'hidden' 😂

[txt.ltd]

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@kempseykate wrote:

On the other side of the coin, although I have automatic combined postage set up on some listings, it's not an exact science, so someone buying multiples can still be 'overcharged'. When this happens I make part refunds back - as I do when someone buys multiple items that don't have auto discount set up.

How many of  these buyers thank me for the part refund, (which I don't have to make)? About  1 in 100 😞

I have also sometimes had to pay more than I charged on P&P (after packaging it went up a weight band!) 

So to all those moaning about being 'overcharged', leaving neutrals/negs for 'overcharged' P&P,  how many of you 1) thank the sellers that do make part refunds, and 2) would message a seller to say you notice postage was undercharged,  would they like the extra to cover it? I guess that would be 1 in 100 as well!

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Kate, honestly, don't bother doing this. Save your good deeds for the grateful. If somebody asks for combined postage you could give it to them if you want, otherwise take the money and run - after all it was agreed to in the sale.

I used to be kind-hearted like you are. My rules now:

buyer contacts me after purchase (and after dispatch) asking for partial refund of 'overpaid' postage: refuse; report buyer to eBay for asking for something not in the listing; trust in eBay to remove negs; block buyer.

buyer contacts me after purchase (but before dispatch) asking for partial refund of 'overpaid' postage: do not respond; report buyer to eBay for asking for something not in the listing; ship items if they have tracking, otherwise don't ship items and await eBay's contact, then try to get orders cancelled; block buyer.

buyer contacts me before purchase asking for combined postage: accept if it's more than 1 hour before postage collection time, otherwise block buyer and don't respond.

[nik_moore]

Wow, well aren't YOU the charmer... 

[gallovidian]

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@txt.ltd wrote:

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Kate, honestly, don't bother doing this. Save your good deeds for the grateful. If somebody asks for combined postage you could give it to them if you want, otherwise take the money and run - after all it was agreed to in the sale.

I used to be kind-hearted like you are. My rules now:

buyer contacts me after purchase (and after dispatch) asking for partial refund of 'overpaid' postage: refuse; report buyer to eBay for asking for something not in the listing; trust in eBay to remove negs; block buyer.

buyer contacts me after purchase (but before dispatch) asking for partial refund of 'overpaid' postage: do not respond; report buyer to eBay for asking for something not in the listing; ship items if they have tracking, otherwise don't ship items and await eBay's contact, then try to get orders cancelled; block buyer.

buyer contacts me before purchase asking for combined postage: accept if it's more than 1 hour before postage collection time, otherwise block buyer and don't respond.

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That doesn't seem the way to address someone who attempts to do what is right.Leaving aside the fact that a buyer might be asking you to comply with ebay policy, there is no way ebay are going to penalise a member for asking for anything, without the threats which might shift it into the area of unjustified demands. A seller who accidentally undercharges on P&P is at liberty to ask if the buyer wants to add more, although he mustn't hint at refusing to sell without it, and if he is prudent will say he won't.

I know I have thanked sellers in feedback for a spontaneous refund of overpayment. Not much point in looking, though, as it hasn't happened often,

Anyway I notice that in a pattern common in muscle-flexing posts, you appear not to charge excessive postage. You are leading from behind, or below or somewhere. Why should kempseyKate sacrifice her custimer relations just to keep you happy?

[katt100]

I always refund my buyers if postage is less than stated but I don't ask the buyer to pay more if I end up paying more for postage which has happened a couple of times.

[txt.ltd]

thank you Nik but I don't know what you are implying!

am I charming?

am I not?

I would not consider either!

[txt.ltd]

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@gallovidian wrote:

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@txt.ltd wrote:

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Kate, honestly, don't bother doing this. Save your good deeds for the grateful. If somebody asks for combined postage you could give it to them if you want, otherwise take the money and run - after all it was agreed to in the sale.

I used to be kind-hearted like you are. My rules now:

buyer contacts me after purchase (and after dispatch) asking for partial refund of 'overpaid' postage: refuse; report buyer to eBay for asking for something not in the listing; trust in eBay to remove negs; block buyer.

buyer contacts me after purchase (but before dispatch) asking for partial refund of 'overpaid' postage: do not respond; report buyer to eBay for asking for something not in the listing; ship items if they have tracking, otherwise don't ship items and await eBay's contact, then try to get orders cancelled; block buyer.

buyer contacts me before purchase asking for combined postage: accept if it's more than 1 hour before postage collection time, otherwise block buyer and don't respond.

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That doesn't seem the way to address someone who attempts to do what is right.Leaving aside the fact that a buyer might be asking you to comply with ebay policy, there is no way ebay are going to penalise a member for asking for anything, without the threats which might shift it into the area of unjustified demands. A seller who accidentally undercharges on P&P is at liberty to ask if the buyer wants to add more, although he mustn't hint at refusing to sell without it, and if he is prudent will say he won't.

I know I have thanked sellers in feedback for a spontaneous refund of overpayment. Not much point in looking, though, as it hasn't happened often,

Anyway I notice that in a pattern common in muscle-flexing posts, you appear not to charge excessive postage. You are leading from behind, or below or somewhere. Why should kempseyKate sacrifice her custimer relations just to keep you happy?

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I'm not sure where those bees in your bonnet have come from, gallo! I'm not as nasty as you may think! Maybe I'm just being straightforward and my message has been misinterpreted.

I advise you read the abusive buyer policy:

Don't demand something not offered in the original listing

 Not allowed

• Requesting a shipping service not offered by the seller
• Requesting the seller ship to an address other than what you included in checkout
• Requesting to use a payment method not offered during checkout
• Requesting the seller hold your item so you can pay later
• Requesting a partial refund without returning the item
• Request additional items or services not included in the original listing or asking for a discount
• Finding an item on eBay and taking the sale off eBay

Due to this policy, I will continue to report all buyers who request additional items or services not included in the original listing and all buyers who ask for a discount. Of course I do this only after a sale (i.e. when the browser becomes the buyer)

I'm not sure why you think that because you personally make a point of thanking sellers for refunding postage that it means Kate's own statement (that she gets 1 out of 100 thank-yous) is somehow not important? I am tyring to advise her based on my own experience as a seller: i.e. don't bother wasting your time proactively trying to make buyers happy; it's not your job as a seller and you might as well keep the money.

If you think Kate can't make a decision on her own and just has to follow every piece of advice then that is entirely NOT my feeling on the matter; not sure why you are trying to put words in my mouth. I'm not leading anything... have you heard of advice before? Are you angry with me or something? Please tell

I would also advise that it is prohibited for sellers to ask for extra postage costs from buyers post-sale because that constitutes an attempt to change the terms of sale; if a seller does this to you, I recommend that you report them to eBay so we can all have a better marketplace with more accurate postage costs for as many listings as possible.

[gallovidian]

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@txt.ltd wrote:

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• Request additional items or services not included in the original listing or asking for a discount

.

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I suppose it comes down to whether you consider asking someone if he would care to do something, as being the same as demanding it.

A weakness of the reporting system is that the unsuccessfully reported party never hears of it, and doesn't have a chance to invoke the False Reporting policy.

The line you showed us in bold refers to things ebay policy says should pass from one to the other. The opportunity to be relieved of money which pays for nothing isn't actually, as you put it earlier, offered in the listing.

Unless your P&P charges have become more moderate recently (which is the object of the policy), it is unlikely that you are receiving any such requests to report.

[txt.ltd]

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@gallovidian wrote:

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@txt.ltd wrote:

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• Request additional items or services not included in the original listing or asking for a discount

.

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I suppose it comes down to whether you consider asking someone if he would care to do something, as being the same as demanding it.

A weakness of the reporting system is that the unsuccessfully reported party never hears of it, and doesn't have a chance to invoke the False Reporting policy.

The line you showed us in bold refers to things ebay policy says should pass from one to the other. The opportunity to be relieved of money which pays for nothing isn't actually, as you put it earlier, offered in the listing.

Unless your P&P charges have become more moderate recently (which is the object of the policy), it is unlikely that you are receiving any such requests to report.

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"The line you showed us in bold refers to things ebay policy says should pass from one to the other. The opportunity to be relieved of money which pays for nothing isn't actually, as you put it earlier, offered in the listing."

I actually laughed. So thank you for that because it's been a while.

"the opportunity to be relieved of money which pays for nothing"

... what in the world is that?

the opportunity.

yes, I agree, I am not offering opportunities in my listings... not sure how that's possible... opportunities are not goods or services, are they...

So I'm going to try to translate that term you used - to better address your reply:

"the opportunity to be relieved of money which pays for nothing"

"the opportunity to be relieved of surplus"

"the potential relief of surplus"

"potential refund of surplus"

is that roughly the same?

because I agree: I am NOT offering potential refund of surplus in my listings.

but you think that a buyer asking for refund of surplus is somehow not a policy violation because it's not in my listing.

well, I ask you: what is a refund of surplus? it's a discount...

it's also:

• Requesting a partial refund without returning the item

Maybe you think that if the buyer asks "is it possible to get X" that they somehow aren't asking for X. Is that it?

Also, can you be more clear on your comments about my P&P charges, e.g. what do you mean by 'more moderate' and why do you think MY P&P charges have any bearing on the obligation of sellers to report buyers for policy violations?

[naughty_neena]

Its easy

You either know or you dont whether you want the item at the price + postage.

No good throwing a wobbly because it cost more than anticipated to send.

I have bought things high postage cost low item cost and vice versa.

if your that concerned about postage try the high street there is no postage

[nigel_paul_wright7557]

Due to previous problems I always send signed for now.

I also add on ebays fee's for p+p.

So tends to be mostly £4.45 plus 55p for packing, fee's  etc.

[gallovidian]

ebay invite us to rate the P&P charge with a DSR rating, and in the absence of instructions or advice (which it would be), it seems illogical to suppose that it shouldn't figure otherwise in feedback.

There are only two things to which that can refer. By far the most common is how the buyer found the P&P as specified in the listing, which he paid. But it could apply when he queried it, and is satisfied or dissatisfied with what he ended up paying.

The latter wou