Buyer Protection is coming soon

[nutrafituk]

Just announced - finally some sort of good news for business accounts basically saying ONLY PRIVATE SELLERS will have this fee added (£0.75 fixed + various %). Hopefully that will make a difference for genuine business sellers and make those dodgy ones re-think their position:

We’re excited to announce that from 4 Feb, buyers will benefit from a brand new protection every time they shop on eBay. What’s even better is that this comes at no extra cost to you or your buyers. To give your buyers more confidence and security when shopping, Buyer Protection will be included on every purchase on ebay.co.uk. We’ve kept things simple for you, so there’s nothing you need to do to access this protection. These are all part of our efforts to make eBay the best marketplace for our community. Here’s how the recent changes will benefit you.

Why Buyer Protection is good for your business As a business seller, Buyer Protection is included for free for you and your buyers. They’ll get the protection, without the cost. With Buyer Protection, all buyers and sellers will now get 24/7 customer support where you can connect with a real person by phone whenever you need, or start a chat to get quick answers. We’ve also still got you covered with secure transactions, thanks to payments that are encrypted end-to-end and handled by our trusted payment partners.

We’re always looking for more ways to help drive sales to your business, so from 20 Jan, Coupons, Multi-buy and other discount tools will only be available to business sellers. You can look forward to more exclusive benefits in the future. Learn more about Buyer Protection What’s changing for private sellers

• We recently made changes to our fee structure so it’s free for private sellers to sell on eBay (excl. Vehicles). As part of this, from 4 Feb, a Buyer Protection fee will be added to listings from UK-based private sellers so we can make investments into these protections. This fee will be included in the item price and be paid for by the buyer. As a reminder, this is free of charge for business sellers.

• To give buyers more protection and encourage timely shipment, private sellers will be paid once the item is delivered. There’s no change for business sellers and you’ll still receive your payouts as quickly as you do today.

• We know it’s important to have a fair and equitable marketplace for all business sellers. That’s why we’re monitoring trading activities on eBay to help business sellers using a private account transition over to a business account, or restricting selling activity as necessary.

[discre]

It is NOT a 'trading allowance' and is for anyone with additional income AND the two can be combined:

For clarity, this is from the HMRC web site:

'You can get up to £1,000 each tax year in tax-free allowances for property or trading income from 6 April 2017. If you have both types of income, you’ll get a £1,000 allowance for each.'

The allowance is intended to cover income from incidental 'trading' on platforms such as eBay by any individual regardless of whether they operate a business or not.  If a 'genuine private seller' buys something with the intention of selling it to make a profit, that profit (up to £1000)  would be covered by it.  If the same individual sold some of their chattels (eg an old cooker) for more than it cost that wouldn't be a taxable event unless the sale value was over £6000, as the intention when buying it was to use it,rather than sell it at a profit.

[papso22]

If someone buys something with the intention of selling it that makes them a business (trader), not a 'genuine private seller', in fact a 'fake private seller'.

It's a trading allowance, it only applies to traders, not individuals selling off their own unwanted goods which they have had use of.  It exists to help small and start up businesses run by individuals, which may indeed be 'hobby businesses' but they are still businesses just in a smaller way.

It's £1,000 turnover, not profit. 

While you can claim both trading and property allowances, you can't combine them by offsetting an unused allowance for one against the other. 

The £6,000 is a capital goods tax thing, completely different to trading allowances, and which may come into play for a private seller.

Full info here:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tax-free-allowances-on-property-and-trading-income

[therenewalworkshopltd]

Guys. your talking about different things.

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/tax-free-allowances-on-property-and-trading-income

And self employed.

https://www.gov.uk/become-sole-trader/register-sole-trader

[discre]

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@papso22 wrote:

If someone buys something with the intention of selling it that makes them a business (trader), not a 'genuine private seller', in fact a 'fake private seller'.

No it doesn't! 

If I make a duck noise that doesn't make me a duck!

If I always make a noise like a duck and start wearing feathers maybe then people might begin to wonder but until I start swimming in a pond, eating fish, and sinking when someone throws me a piece of home-made bread, the odds are still on me not being a duck.

If you buy an old bike from Joe thinking you can make a couple of quid selling it to Peter, that doesn't make you a business, and nor will it make the taxman chase you for his share of the couple of quid.  It's a ridiculous suggestion.  

If you realise there's money to be made selling old bikes and start doing it full-time or even part-time, that's an entirely different matter.

The £1000 is intended to cover sales (turnover) of the odd item here and there.  That doesn't make the seller a business - or indeed a duck!

[papso22]

You only get into the realms of a trading allowance if you are trading.  Trading is business.  

What don't you understand about that simple concept?

[bzmotman]

This page from HMRC is helpful

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/check-if-you-need-to-tell-hmrc-about-your-income-from-online-platforms

A couple of excerpts

"You may need to tell HMRC if you receive income through an online marketplace or social media. This could be whether it’s your main source of income or an additional source — sometimes called a ‘side hustle’.

Income could be money, gifts or services you have received from:

• selling personal possessions
• selling goods"

"You’re probably trading if you sell goods that you have:

• bought intending to sell for a profit
• made, including items you make for a hobby"

"After earning some money from selling unwanted clothes, you start buying items from car boot sales and charity shops. You sell these items through online marketplaces, with the intention of selling them for more money than you paid for them. This is something you do regularly.

You have received income through an online platform from selling goods and you may need to tell HMRC about this income." 

Note the "intention" - whether you actually make a profit or not is irrelevent it is the intention.

You are quite correct in that if you earn, not profit, less than £1000 then it does not need to be declared to HMRC however you are still trading. So in your example buying a bike to do up and sell means you are trading its just that if you earn less than £1000 from doing it you dont need to tell HMRC.

I wouldn't claim that doing up 1 bike makes you a business or that you should have an Ebay Business account but if that 1 bike becomes a regular thing thats a different matter.

If you have turnover of say £50k but make a loss of £2k you are still trading and a business even though you havent made a profit so need to report to HMRC.

[insidethe93]

Thanks for correcting me. Still, given even just the two examples I mentioned (EDDs, messaging system), my faith in eBay has been severely eroded and, sorry, I don't trust them any more.

[the-layer-laboratory]

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@insidethe93 wrote:

Thanks for correcting me. Still, given even just the two examples I mentioned (EDDs, messaging system), my faith in eBay has been severely eroded and, sorry, I don't trust them any more.

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Don't be silly, you don't need to explain yourself to anybody. Please don't mistake my input for being a fan of ebay. I don't trust them any more than you do.

[dion5feb2016]

You are not the only one, they are becoming less and less trustworthy as time goes on

[the-nutwood-collection]

I have been buying postcards from eBay for years.  All the sellers I deal with are business sellers, so there must be a profit in selling postcards - even after deducting eBay's rapacious fees and the 30p +VAT transaction charge.

If I want a postcard, I buy it - unless it's silly money and, even then, I may buy it.  It'll annoy me that the seller's going outside the price band - but I'll buy it.  That's because collectors are a 'must have' group - within reason, they'll pay the price if that postcard isn't in their collection. 

Just adjust your prices to allow for the new fees.

[the-nutwood-collection]

Buyers want to know when their item will be delivered

If I buy an item that is <£10 and will fit through the letterbox, I don't need to know when it's going to be delivered, and I certainly don't want to pay extra for the information.  It'll arrive, maybe within eBay's estimate, maybe not - but RM or a carrier will deliver it in their own sweet time.  I'm cool with that - anything that's <£10 isn't something I'm waiting for - it's just a commodity.  If I need something urgently, or it's valuable, or it's something I really, really want and would be upset if I didn't get - then I'll upgrade the shipping.

I only need delivery info if the item's too large for the letterbox, then I'll leave a note on the door telling the courier to leave it in the safe space, or valuable - in which case I'll make sure someone's here to accept it.

So many small items now arrive tracked - for me, it's just not necessary, and I doubt I'm the only buyer that thinks this.

[the-nutwood-collection]

Etsy covers INRs and (I think) damage in transit if the item is sent tracked or if non-tracked postage is purchased through Etsy - I don't think it covers late deliveries.  The buyer has to jump through hoops if they're claiming damage - that'll put a lot of chancers off.

You're right - serial claimers of non-delivery will be closely monitored by Etsy and, presumably, dealt with if Etsy is the one to pay compensation.

[studiomaster_uk]

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@bazinga-games wrote:

I guess eBay are trying to reap back some of the money they are losing.  For instance, if a buyer has to open a Case because the item they bought from a private seller is faulty, etc, the seller SHOULD deal with the Return according to eBay's rules, but if they don't, eBay refunds the buyer and tells them that they don't need to return the item to the seller.  I believe in these situations eBay refunds the seller out of their own pocket.

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I think this normally only happens where there is a case (or sufficient evidence thereof) of an errant buyer, a 'bad actor', making a wrongful or unreasonable claim or return. Ebay may then make a 'goodwill' refund at no cost to the seller. The only problem is that this means the errant party 'gets away with it', hence it acts to condone,  support and, one might reason, encourage the errant behaviour.

Thus it would be somewhat concerning to think that these proposed buying fees would provide a 'treasury' which might then be used to fund such causes.

[studiomaster_uk]

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@tressygirl wrote:

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@studiomaster_uk wrote

OK, so what additional benefit are buyer's actually going to receive for their money come 4th February?

A good question to bring to the table for the weekly Chat tomorrow,  with Community managers at 2p.m.

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Regrettably, myself, I'll be tied up with the day job. Perhaps you would be kind enough to do so and report back? Many thanks.

[tressygirl]

I usually catch up on the Weekly Chat well after it has finished myself. 

It will be there for you to view the whole chat.  Just go to the top of the page when you log into these board and from the tab>>  Help From the Community click on  Chat with the eBay Community Team, and you will see today's Chat, and all the previous ones too.

@studiomaster_uk 

[dion5feb2016]

Didn’t know that, good to be aware as am busy too. I haven’t posted too much on these message boards, haven’t had to, have received a few bits of good advice, comments etc. This time the emails haven’t not stopped coming with responses to mine and other users, and it’s been going on for days, just shows how some people are so incensed by this! Thanks for posting re catch up on the conversation.

[tressygirl]

You're welcome @dion5feb2016  as said,  I usually catch up On Weekly Catch up much later on, that's if my little grey cells remind me to do so. 

However,  think I'll be there at 2 p.m. today, coffee  at hand ,  the questions will be interesting,  the answers more so ! 🤗

[moonspender]

Will try and attend but i suspect there will be no forthcoming answers as per

[tressygirl]

If you miss it @moonspender   it will be there for a Catch Up later if you wish,  from Help with the Community tab >> Chat with Community Team.

[moonspender]

I take it it will be the same ebay staff ... no senior ebay decision makers involved ?