Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!


I have a recent post entitled "Buyer raises bogus refund claim. eBay chasing me. Buyer reported. How long until resolution?"... that tells the 1st t part of this story.

 

I just sent the scammer a message that contains the following text that tells the 2nd...

 

Start of message extract --------------------------


Oooh, I can see what you are up to brother.

This is the sequence of events...

1/ I spoke to eBay UK support and told them all about the buyer that is a scammer
2/ They spoke to the eBay technicians in the US and removed your ridiculous request from the order
3/ You notice this and raise another request, including pictures of the watch with the strap removed

 

Lol, as usual you are showing your lack of basic intelligence brother!!!

 

This will be the next sequence of events...

1/ I will speak to the same people as I just finished speaking to and get them to remove the second nonsense claim.
2/ I will explain that its likely that the not so intelligent buyer will just raise another request as he knows it will stop me getting the money I am owed for the watch and it will remain on hold

3/ I will advise them that to save everyone's time its just best that the US technicians remove you from the platform, otherwise it will be highly likely you will just keep on raiseing false requests and they will have to waste time deleting them every time that I ask them to do so.

 

They will probably realise its best all around just to delete your account.

 

4/ Just to twist the knife a little I will ensure that I post the photo from my listing with the strap attached and ask them to compare it to the photo you put in your request with the strap removed . That will prove to everyone that you deliberately damaged the watch and are indeed a scammer!!

 

This is beautiful brother, simply beautiful !!

 

End of message extract------------

 

I dont think I need to say another word on the above as I think its self explanatory. I have been condesending and rude to him which is unfortunate, but bloody hell... I think I am entitled to do so and vent some frustrations by now!!

 

I really hope that eBay does the right thing on this occasion. I dont want to blackmail anyone but I will repeat my intended use on this platform going forwrard. I reach retirement soon and part of my retirement portfolio is 16 luxury watches with a combined value well in excess of £200,000 possibly close to quarter of a million.

 

To test out the Authentication Program I brought and sold a couple of watches over the last couple of years. A Omega and a Tudor. I currently have a Datejust listed and am intending to sell other watches to liquidate some assets and in order to fund my retirement in the not too distant future..

 

If this f*cking idiot remains on this platform or eBay thinks to penalise me in anyway for this bullsh*t that I did not create there is no way my other watches are coming anywhere this platform and I will also delist my Datejust.

 

I am even thinking of contacting a few watch dealers now for some indicative quotes regardless of how this unfolds such is my level of frustration an anger. I may not get quite as much for them, but when eBay's ever incresaing fees are factored in there is not too much in it these days.

 

Many of the watches were purchased decades ago and have already appreciated significantly so its not altogether necessary for me to get top dollar for them. Furthermore the lower offer price from the dealers is very much offset by they pay out immediately rather than me have to wait for it to be sold on here (.... and deal with all the scammer enquiries for the watch of course. Re: the Datejust I must have had at least 3 in my Inbox so far)

 

He is clearly just trying to be awkward and waste my time. Not just mine though, but also yours and the technicians who will have to keep removing the bogus requests too.

 

Enough already! Please sort this out in a satisfactory manner once and for all.

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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

You are using Ebay without really knowing how it works.

Your comments in here are not 'picked up by support'.  There is no part of this Community Forum that can be used for directly contacting Ebay.

You have spoken to Ebay 'I spoke to eBay UK support and told them all about the buyer that is a scammer'.

If you have a further issue, you should go back to 'Ebay UK Support'.

 

"There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.”
Søren Kierkegaard, Danish philosopher (1813 - 1855)

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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

redwick1
Experienced Mentor

If you see the top of the page we are not ebay staff just ordinary members like yourself.

We can not sort anything out but can try and give advice on how to solve problems

Ebay will not remove a buyer on one members complaint

if there is a problem then it is all sorted out through a dispute

If the buyer says Not as described then you send a pre paid label for the return.

once you have the item back then you refund in full

Ebay will almost always go with the buyer.

Ebay is working on members being able to leave photos with their feedback eventually.

To try and blackmail a member in any way on this site is liable to get you removed from ebay.

It is not allowed and if you mention members by their account name it will be removed and you will get a warning or be removed

It is always risky to sell expensive items on ebay so you are right probably best to sell to a dealer. A little less for the item but cash in the hand.

If the buyer reports that feedback that you have left on a positive dot it will be removed and you get a black mark.

Sellers are not allowed to leave a positive dot with negative comment for buyers. That is why there is no red dot

 

 

_____________________

We are just ordinary members trying to help.
Message 2 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

Thanks for your message.  I raised 3 queries recently that were picked up by support. I thought it was posted but here clearly not from what you are saying. Can you please confirm which option in the drop down menu I should be posting this too.

 

You miss understood my blackmail comment which does not refer to the scammer. I was referring to my potential sale of my watches on the platform. I will edit a version of the text when you have informed me where to send it and remove that part to ensure there is no confusion. 

 

All that I wrote about the watches is kind of irrelevant now anyway, as it seems highly likely they will not go on the platform given what you have said about eBay removing users. 

 

Please explain what you are referring to regarding the positive dot because i have no idea what you are talking about. 

 

I very much appreciate your response.  Please feel free to delete this post from here if appropriate, but please do tell me where I should have posted it.

 

Thanks in advance

 

 

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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

So let me get this straight. 

 

The user can rip the straps off the watch and then legitimately say that the item is not as described after he deliberately damages it?

 

eBay is so automated that they cannot compare the picture of the watch with the straps on in  my listing with a picture of the watch with the straped ripped off in his refund request?

 

The strap was superglued on as I mentioned clearly in my listing(.....so they were hardly easy for him toremove...) yet he can rip them off and cry foul against me?

 

I am beginning to think I have already made my last sale on this platform. 

 

I just cannot adhere to these rules

Message 4 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

You are using Ebay without really knowing how it works.

Your comments in here are not 'picked up by support'.  There is no part of this Community Forum that can be used for directly contacting Ebay.

You have spoken to Ebay 'I spoke to eBay UK support and told them all about the buyer that is a scammer'.

If you have a further issue, you should go back to 'Ebay UK Support'.

 

"There are two ways to be fooled. One is to believe what isn't true; the other is to refuse to believe what is true.”
Søren Kierkegaard, Danish philosopher (1813 - 1855)
Message 5 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

The user can rip the straps off the watch and then legitimately say that the item is not as described after he deliberately damages it?

 

I don't have time to read your whole, very long posting, but your question above caught my eye.

 

I'm afraid that the answer is yes, they can. Sellers often allege that buyers have returned items that they have damaged, stripped parts from or simply switched for another one.

 

In theory, eBay's conditions of returned items policy should protect sellers, see: https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/policies/member-behaviour-policies/condition-returned-items-policy?id=47...  In practice, this often counts for nothing because the seller can't prove what the buyer received, or its condition.

 

A typical response from eBay was that "As we did not see the item, either as received by the buyer or as returned to the seller, we are not in a position to determine who has the valid case, or take sides". eBay's idea of not taking sides was to give the benefit of any doubt to the buyer, and make the seller refund them.

 

eBay is unregulated, so there is no right to any independent appeal against their decisions. eBay has become a very risky place to sell things.

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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

Many thanks for your response red_magpie

 

I am sorry for the long messages.  There is no denying I do get carried away sometimes and write too much when I am angry and frustrated but equally  I do think everything I have stated is relevant in some way. 

 

I always believe its best to write too much rather than two little when it comes to context with technical problems and to provide as much detail as possible, but that is perhaps more relevant when the  arbiter is an actual person as oppose to a computer server

 
I do now understand what you have said and it does make perfect as regards an explanation.  It makes less sense as a policy directive but that doesnt matter much at this point 
 
The scammers first bogus claim was removed on the back end yesterday
 
His latest one keeps my funds on hold.
 
Can someone please arrange for the latest one to be removed like the one yesterday please?
 
I suspect he will just raise another claim to ensure my payment is delayed but all I can do is adhere to your guidlines and if necessry post again soon with a title beginning  "Scammer back for round 3.... then rounds 4, 5 and maybe even 6 of course. Who knows but I have little doubt he will just continue to raise claims
 
This was done yesterday so I see no reason why it cannot be done again as the underlying situation is exactly the same, other than him providing more inciminating evidence by including a picture of the watch he damaged by himself in his latest claim.
 
Many thanks in advance

 

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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

I appreciate you are very busty and not keen on my long messages red_magpie but I need to get this off my chest. Hopefully someone will read it,even if its not you. 

 

I just had heart failure an was discharged a cpuple of weeks ago after a month in hospital 

 

All I want to do is spend time with my two daughters, rather than deal with scammers and questionable eBay policies. 

 

I have been writing and responding to posts at 1am, 2am,3am, 4am, 5am .... I am not getting more than 2 hours sleep a night at the moment.

 

I am sure you can appreciate I would rather utilise my time better than arguing over a scammer and a £20 eBay sale for a tatty ten year old GPS watch that is splattered with superglue!!

 

My wife can see I am not in a good place and is urging me to delete my acount and never use the platform again.

 

Although I initially resisted, with every passing day her advice makes more sense to me.


Here some (perhaps final....) thoughts on your systems ....

POINT NUMBER 1 -
If I dare name a user in a post in this forum the mods are all over me like a rash. I am not so sure what the crime is but whatever, I accept the policy. In order for someone to spot my egregious error presumably the mod actually reads the message and is a human being but perhaps I am mistaken as AI is very smart these days. eBay can afford to employ people to police what appears to be an inconsequential policy, yet cannot afford to employ a few human beings who will actually read details of complaints and disputes and have the authority to act accordingly?

 

I would argue that a $10b company with eBay's resources should be doing better in this regard. I wouldargue that its just not very satisfactory for a company of this stature to present itself in such a soulless, rigid and autjoritrian manner . One of there problems is that there are no viable alternatives to eBay. Its quite weirdd that no competitors have evolved as Facebook Marketplace and Gumtree dont come close to eBays capabilities and its clearly a healthy business

 

I suspect the lack of competition has made the organisation somewhat arrogant and makes them beleive they can introduce any kind of wacky policy on a whim, safe in the knowlege we all have to comply as there is simply no competition to turn to.

 

eBay seems to consist of 99% computers and a bunch of policies. Lol, I would imagine the Christmas parties are quite dull. What do you? Wheel all the servers in to one massive room and put paper hats on them all?

 

When I go to book as doctors appointment the line is always busy and I am told that "I am caller number x in the queue" and that the "estimated wait time is y minutes". Would it be so crazy for eBay to employ a few more humans and introduce such a system? Even if people had to wait a long time for their complaint to be read, I am sure they would be patient if they knew it would eventualy get picked up by a human being who could make an informed decision and have authority to act accordingly on it. I know i would.

 

Give the job to Tressygirl!

 

POINT NUMBER 2 -
By definition eBays patrons are both buyers AND sellers. Its clear that the buyers are well protected through the MBG, but eBay appears to have little regard for looking out for sellers...... or protecting them against scammers.

 

THe ironic thing in all this is that eBay is alienating the exact kind of seller they should be encouraging and supporting.

 

Go look at the description I created for the Datejust if you care to do so. It is like War and Peace compared to what other sellers write. Who knows how many 1000s (or even millions) of eBay listings we have all viewed over the years, but you will find few sellers who provide as much detail in the item description as me (.... and I am specifically talking about bespoke details, created from scratch, combining very transparent, honest personal thoughts and experiences of the product with generic information. This sort of listing takes considerably longer to produce for me than it would take another seller to cut and paste information from a 3rd party source in order to create their descriptions)

 

I have recently sold several items on here for only a few quid, yet I always use the exact same energy and write as much as I can to inform and educate the potential buyer so they can make an informed decision and there is no buyers remorse. Yet those efforts can just be ignored by the scammer under the protection of the MBG as evidenced in this situation. I always respond to pre sales enquires quickly and always leave detailed positive feed back.None of this "Good buyer, prompt payment, valued customer, highly recommended" stuff for me.

 

In summary I belioeve I am the kind of seller I would would want if I was eBay as the lengths I go to to create very detailed listings can only enhance the credibility of the platform, albeit in a very small and insignifcant way in the grand scheme of things.

 

I went to the trouble of doing the exact same thing with the item this scammer is complaining about, yet the MBG protects him and he is allowed to ignore everything I have gone to the trouble of writing (as well as the condition of the item that is clearly evident in the photos...) and gleefully carry on with his attempts to scam me, and eBays got his back at all times?

 

That is simply not right as far as I am concerned.

 


POINT NUMBER 3 -
In the interests of some kind of balance, I must point out that Tressygirl is outstanding and I hope she is well compensated for her quite rare skillset. She is very technically proficient as one might expect, but is also able to deliver her messages in a way that is empathetic, considered and most importantly appreciative of the situation the person asking the question finds themselves in.

 

Despite their technical competancy very few of her collegues can do that it seems, and in fact I feel that I am being being spoken down to and almost ridiculed much of the time. Tressygirl seems to inherently understand that great customer service and a satisfying customer experience goes way beyond simply providing accurate answers to questions.

 

Sadly many of her collegues dont get that and seem more motivated in covertly making me know what a fool I have been or how ignorant I am in not knowing the inner workings of the platform. We only ever come on to these pages to seek help so by definition there is obviouly a lack of some kind of specialost knowlege or we would not be here in the first place. Being made to feel like a fool all the time is disingenuos, ,unnecesary and should not be quite so obvious and prevelant. I am sure these eminet authorities would feel just as *bleep* off anout this if liasing with a technical partment far removed from their eBay comfort zone.

 

Public naming and shaming would not be appropriate but I suspect anyone I am referring to who has previously responded to my enquires knows who they are.

 

vyolia was also very good to be fair and so have you been red_magpie

 

Sermon over. I know it may not even be read in its entirity but at least I have tried to provide some feedback and have got some stuff off my chest which is somewhat cathartic

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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

I have not read all that last message you have written, but one thing puzzles me.

 

Buyers are only able to open one case, so I do not see how this person seems to be able to open more than one. If he is able to open it, then it should be closed automatically, and any money held, released.

 

While persistant buyers will open other accounts, you should place this person on your Blocked Bidders list, then he cannot bid on any items you list using that ID.

Message 9 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

It  is hard to even try and reply to all your points but really it is very simple.

You sold a watch the buyer is not happy with it ( even if he may have removed the strap) and if they open a Not as described dispute you send a pre paid label for the return and refund in full once you have it back. All done through the ebay dispute. That is ebay policy.

I understand you are not happy but this is something we all, as sellers. get a problem sometimes. As far as I can see the item was £20. It is not worth all this stress for you over an item of that price.

Put them on your blocked bidders list. see the link

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/selling/resolving-buyer-issues/blocking-buyer-ebay?id=4082

Then go back and Stop blocke bidders from contacting me.

 

Buyers can only open one dispute on ebay so dont see how it has happened more than once.

 

However, If they fail on ebay and paid by paypal then they can open a dispute there or even go to their card providers ( although I dont think they would do anything for £20)

You have an item for several thousands on sale. That is very risky as there are many scammers on ebay as you have found.

Referring to the dots. It is the feedback. Red is for negative comments and green for positive.

Sellers are not allowed to leave a negative comment for buyer so that is why there is no red dot there. To leave a negative comment on a positive ( green) dot for a seller is against ebay policy and if the buyer reports it it will be removed and you get a black mark on your account.

 

_____________________

We are just ordinary members trying to help.
Message 10 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

I needed to step away from this for a day or so for my own sanity, and am belatedly responding to your message.

 

Toconofirm, the scammer never raised multiple refund requests open at one time. 

 

- He raised the first one within an hour of reciving the item.

- He raised the second one on Saturday when I asked for the first one to be removed.

- He has raised a third one on Sunday following the removal of the second one, that I have just asked to be removed

 

I suspect he will continue to send the request right up until he is no longer to do so and his refund window closes

 

In each instance I will ask eBay to remove them. 

 

As I said in my latest thread, we can go backwards and forwards like this until the cows come home if thats the way that eBay insits this should be handled.

 

I would have thought it makes much more sense just ask the scammer to stop doing it, but thats your perogative.

 

Eventually his refund window will close and eventually I will get my payout 

 

Message 11 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

Thanks for your detailed response which is appreciated.

 

I do know that I write too much and that my volley of words can often be overwhelming.

 

I am almost 60 years old and understand such basic things about myself

 

I am going to try and adopt a more bullet point like approach to my messages going forward, which will hopefully help me get my points across more succinctly


poiint 1....

There was never more than one case open at any given time.

 

Let me clarify the sequence of events...

19/4-Scammer raises bogus case No 1.... 27/4 - I get it removed
27/4-Scammer raises bogus case No 2.... 28/4 - I get it removed
28/4-Scammer raises bogus case No 3.... 29/4 - I get it removed


Lol...."As we approach half time in this gripping contest,the the scores on the doors could not be clearer"

 

MBG/scammeer 3
Common sense 0 😊

 

I am know I am going to look back and laugh at all of this some day,but for now it just feels like more incompetent than funny

 

 

point 2...
I was pursuaded to process a refund on Saturday but when I went in to the order to do so it had already been removed due to my previous complaint, my corresponce with tressygirl, and her subsequent action.

 

Following his decision to raise the second case, to replace the deleted one, my stance has changed.

 

As far as I am now concerned he can raise as many bogus claims as he wants as for each instance , I will create a post in here and ask for it to be removed.

 

Presumably he will be able to continue raising them right up the time his 30 day return period expires.

 

I therefore suspect there will be much more wasted time for both of us incoming

 


point3....
I appreciate the clarification on the dots.

 

I have never received anything other than 100% feedback up to this point,but no doubt my beloved scammer will soon be changing that.

Message 12 of 13
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Scammer back for round 2. Please sort this out once and for all eBay!

There is only one instance where more than one case can be opened for the same item, that is not received, then item received broken for example when a not as described case can be opened, after not received case closed.

 

So once the first case was opened and closed, any further cases for the  same item would automatically be closed without any action by you.

Message 13 of 13
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