Reselling of items that eBay GSP has failed to deliver

[james_cumbria]

I've often wondered what happens to items that eBay's Global Shipping Programme fails to deliver, and now I know! It seems that the GSP flogs them off to a business seller who then relists them on their private seller account!

Last year I sold a rare and quite expensive (£2,500) antique magic lantern to a buyer in the USA. After spending weeks in transit the item was deemed to have been lost and the buyer was refunded. It's now back up on eBay (item number 276322692825). I've dropped a line to the seller, who informs me that their business model is based on buying up items from the GSP and then reselling them on eBay. They do this on their private eBay account, thereby benefitting from the many offers extended to private sellers including free listings and reduced final value fees. They currently have around 300 items for sale, including many high value items. They don't accept returns and they don't display their business information. The issue of business sellers hiding behind private selling accounts often crops up on these discussion boards, and it is well known that eBay turns a blind eye to this kind of thing - but I am astonished that eBay is apparently complicit in this practice by supplying such sellers with stock!

This aside, if anyone does know how to purchase items that the Global Shipping Programme has not been able to deliver (e.g. for customs difficulties), I would love to know.   Most of the items I sell are rare and hard - if not impossible - to replace.  On the rare occasion that something does goes missing, I'd love the chance to get it back.  

[plpmr]

if the seller is clearly a business operating on a private account you can report them to -

eBay.

HMRC.

Trading Standards.

[cobwebcottage]

And it has sold. Not a bad return for a 'private' seller!

[james_cumbria]

Yes, and when I originally sold it my final value fees on this item alone were £372.54.  I wonder if this 'private seller' managed to sell it under one of the reduced FVF offers that eBay sends out to private sellers!  

[bennotbill]

Isn't there a good chance that they have some connection to eBay, or perhaps work for them in some capacity.

[vintagewatchpart]

This is disgusting, looking at his listings he is making a fortune, it would be nice for someone from Ebay to comment on this given how it really is a reputation destroyer of the whole GSP programme.

I recently had a watch go missing, buyer wasn't in to receive it so it was returned to sender - sender being GSP. They refunded him, all he wanted was the watch.

What is also disgusting is this seller is copying item titles, pictures and descriptions from the original sellers of the items:

He has this up for sale, I know the original seller of this, its just the same item title, so he gets to buy a "lost" item and sell it at a cheaper price undercutting the original seller of the piece who has potentially lost a part of their reputation, maybe had negative feedback.

Also, a lot of what he has sold is unique collectables - if the original buyer who had the item go "missing" and refunded suddenly sees the same item come back up for sale with a private seller what are they going to think? Seller being dodgy and had the item sent back then resold on a different account perhaps?

The more you think about it, the more this is really bad.

[cobwebcottage]

Your example is listed twice. Different sellers, different prices, same photo's and descriptions (which you can see have been cut and pasted. Plus one sold with the same spec.

It takes around 1 -2 weeks for updates from GSP to say they have the item. If this doesn't happen and the seller contacts them and they say it's lost, that would take around another week. Then, as we are told, the found (and confiscated ) items go to auction so add another week. Winning bidder collects items, takes them home and lists them on Ebay by searching for the original items??  So, at least a month has gone by and they find the original sellers listing, use the same photo's and descriptions. Something isn't adding up.

[james_cumbria]

Yes, the reseller used the exact same title as my original listing, though thankfully not my images or description.  She tells me she buys from eBay GSP.   I would love to know how!  I do wish eBay would clamp down on business sellers using private accounts.  It seems so unfair on those of us who pay our fees.  

[pg_kicks]

Going off the wide range of items they either have great knowledge about an extremely wide range of products or eBay tell them the old item number so they can copy and paste the the title and item description as they are all different formats in the item description like multiple people have wrote them.

[the-nutwood-collection]

If the packing slip is in the box, the buyer has the item ID and the title.

[vintagewatchpart]

And the personal, private and confidential details of the original buyer and seller.

I want to hear from Ebay as to what actually happens to these items, I sometimes wrap my packing slip in bubble wrap with the item itself so it would have to be fully unpacked to remove the slip.

 dave@ebay Marco@ebay please can you find out and provide clarification and reassurance for those sellers who use GSP and have items go missing as to what happens?

Hopefully there will be some form of reply about this, ignoring the discussion would come across as pretty shady and dodgy from a business perspective. I am sure that leaving packing slips in with the undelivered product being resold would constitue a data protection act breach.

[cobwebcottage]

So surely, a parcel which has a packaging slip inside would not be 'lost' as if the item was bought at an auction, it would need to be unpacked at some stage. 

Same scenario if it has a return address on it.

[vintagewatchpart]

On another note, the fact they are a private seller is beyond a joke.

The value of the sold items just in the past 3 months exceeds £40,000. So won't be long before the VAT threshold is hit given the value of listed goods is roughly the same and who knows what was sold in the previous 9 months. 

They are selling items as a private individual and are undercutting genuine business sellers on the Ebay platform who sold an item only for it to have "gone missing" - the business seller has to pay additional fees, VAT, corporation tax - they pay nothing. 

How can anyone allow this to continue?

[james_cumbria]

This is absolutely the point I was trying to make. I have had an exchange of emails with the reseller of my item and have no reason to doubt that they are declaring their earnings to HMRC.  What irks me is that they are able to sell the exact same item as me, at exactly the same price, but for a fraction of the fees.  The fact that it is eBay GSP that is supplying them with stock, presumably with no checks to verify that they are operating correctly as a business seller, just rubs salt into the wounds...

[vintagewatchpart]

Bumping this topic for assistance from eBay. Please provide clarity on the process when lost gsp items are resold by other sellers.

I've seen lost items of mine available by another seller and there is no way they could have found my listing that was sold without the invoice present within the box.

How are you protecting customer data and seller data in this practice?

[btr.style]

A lot of lost postal items are auctioned off. I've seen Evri auctions taking place of lost items where boxes of these unopened items are auctioned off (some of the packages have things like "Invalid" and "Not delivered" written on them). Either the auction house does it on their behalf and they get the money from it (minus fees) or they sell it to an auction house for a set price to sell. 

It's highly likely this is what happens with GSP items too. Someone said the seller claims they buy them from eBay GSP.... They would say that. Reason being is if they said where they got them from, more people would go and bid for them and they would have to pay more for them. If  it's not from some auction online, it's probably an auction house near where they live. 

[the_book_seekers]

Pitney Bowes runs GSP in the UK for ebay. Perhaps the company should be removing anything that identifies buyers or sellers on these packages before sending them off for auction. Personal data needs protection.

[rigged_out]

eBay give those rights to Pitney Bowes. Part of the GSP terms that you agree to say

You agree that Pitney Bowes shall have the right to decide if the GSP Item is eligible for the Programme. You agree that in respect of any items found to be ineligible, Pitney Bowes may (at its discretion) dispose of or liquidate GSP Items in any manner that they prefer, including without limitation, (a) returning the item to you at your costs, (b) handing over the item to the authorities or (c) destroying the item without notice.

As for the data contained within like your invoice I imagine they destroy it. The items usually end up back on ebay for sale. eBay will direct you to Pitney Bowes privacy statement which deals with users data:

https://www.pitneybowes.com/uk/privacy-statement.html

Btw, I doubt it was ever 'Lost' unless it was by someone like Evri and they auctioned it off as the other person said.

[vintagewatchpart]

I have no problem with the terms, I have problems with the personal data in the package.

There is no way, I mean no way at all that the item I have seen of mine put back up for sale could have been found as a sold item to copy the title and pictures over without seeing the original title or item details, needle in a haystack stuff. 

[m25jet]

Before you posted the item to the buyer did you make sure to write an "If undelivered please return to..." message on the back of the parcel, stating your name and full postal address quite clearly?  If you did and the GSP failed to return the item to you having deemed that the item could not be delivered then it could be argued that they have, in effect, stolen the item and sold it on for their own financial gain.  Whether you had already refunded the buyer at that point is another matter - if the buyer had not yet been refunded then the item was the property of the buyer, whereas if the buyer had been refunded in full then it once again became your own property again.

In view of the above, should the GSP ever do this again and you see the item you sold being relisted for sale on eBay by somebody other than the person who bought the item from you then report the listing in question to eBay, stating that the item has been stolen.  When eBay enquire further about the matter explain that the GSP failed to deliver the item, yet instead of returning it to you they retained the item and sold it on.  Although eBay are very much a law unto themselves it may be worth a shot, if only to see whether you can get the item back again.

With regards to what to do in the future, I would suggest that you opt out of the GSP and send any further sold items directly to your buyers, rather than via the GSP hub, whether you are selling to a nationally or internationally based buyer.  If you are not actively using the GSP then you won't be putting yourself in a position whereby you could potentially end up being screwed over by its dodgy practices of selling on undelivered items for their own financial gain rather than returning them to the seller as they ought to do.