Who would you say this belongs to?

[cee-dee]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-24186099

I don't know if Irish conveyancing is any different to the English (I won't say "UK" because Scottish conveyancing is a bit of a mystery to me) but usually there's a clause in the conveyance when mentioning what's being included in the sale and it's often worded "All that is now there" meaning that anything left in the house, outbuildings and garden is included.

So, would the new owner of that house be able to claim it (if he so desired) or would the Mortgagees in possession have a legitimate claim to it if there were no exclusions in the conveyance when they sold it to the present owner?

[blackburn_stevie]

Never mind who is entitled to it. What kind of a pratt stood up and said, "Hey, look what I've found."

[spawnjohnuk]

a honest one

[lhasa.two]

I don't know how much Irish law would differ from England but I do know they have the law of subrogation, whereby property debts, including mortgages, service and/or management charges, remain with a property and are inherited by the buyer. This is an open invitation to dishonest sellers to ‘cut and run’ whereby they can increase their mortgage borrowings or borrow money against the property within a few days of completion and for it not to be detected by the solicitor. 

How strange that the bankrupt owner did not take the money with him when he left the property... In this case it seems cut and dried that the buyer of the property does not 'own' the money and it certainly would not have been included on any goods and chattels list prior to purchase!  The plumber did the right thing by handing it over to the Receivers but I suppose it will be up to Irish law if the new owner is allowed to keep it, should he decide to claim it... 

[cee-dee]

If, note IF the clause "all that is now there" was in the wording of the conveyance, surely that means everything remaining there notwithstanding anything listed as "fixtures & fittings" (Moveables in Scotland?)????

All that is now there surely means everything remaining whether it's known about or not?

[lhasa.two]

Suggest you check with the Irish Law Society because that's the only way you'll find a definitive answer. They may not have the phrase "all that is now there" on their docs.

Have to say I've never seen that phrase used on any of my docs when conveyancing so it may just be your own conveyancer who adds it. In my experience Solicitors use different formats for the goods and chattels lists.  

[cee-dee]

The very first house I bought had that phrase in the conveyance and all the property I've bought since then also had the phrase, even this one which was the only one which was "registered". The last owner left loads of stuff here.

Surely you can't convey a property and claim that things not specifically mentioned remain the property of the vendor?

[lhasa.two]

Well no you wouldn't usually but this is an 'unusual' situation isn't it, that's why the police and receivers haven't made a statement about what's going to happen to the found money. I imagine the Receivers are taking legal advice and possibly talking to the vendor.

No comment from the new owner which seems a bit strange. It's not known (in the article) if they are a local resident or someone from abroad. Seems odd that the plumber didn't consult with the new owner first (or maybe he did) before handing the money over. I wouldn't appreciate my plumber taking action on my behalf without first consulting me because I would see it as my job to contact my solicitor for advice on next steps. 

You hear of people here finding old paintings/artifacts in attics in England and selling them on for a small fortune. But as I said earlier the Irish Law Society will probably have the answer and it may well be different to our laws here. 

[cee-dee]

I'll throw another question open to all.

If that amount of money was found in a house you'd bought, irrespective of who the previous owner was, would you claim the money as yours?

[tommy.irene]

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@cee-dee wrote:

I'll throw another question open to all.

If that amount of money was found in a house you'd bought, irrespective of who the previous owner was, would you claim the money as yours?

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I wouldnt tell anyone i found it.. And would sell the house and move to Spain..