What if?

[cee-dee]

OK, so no-one wants to argue any more but what if.........................

A couple of years back referendum was called about either staying in or leaving the EU and the majority voted to leave. Since then arguments have raged back and forth and the remainers are agitating for another referendum.

What if they had another vote and this time the result was to remain BUT, then the leavers started agitating for another making claims for this, that or the other? Would the remainers claim "We had a democratic vote so that's that, we remain IN".

We had a democratic vote before though? The result of that was to LEAVE so if a second vote went the other way would any notice be taken of leavers wanting yet another?? If not, why not?

Shouldn't a vote on something be IT as regards any result not a cause for those who didn't like the result to agitate for another? Where does it end?

By that reckoning it could result in a parliamentry vote for a constituency which ended in a close vote for one person then having those opposed to then claim it was "close" so they demand another go? How many "go's" do you want?

[celticthebhoys585]

Enslaved

Aye right- they're all running around with a block and chain in Greece- where's that hammer on head emoji ?????

[algasmoon]

Sorry thought it was clear, greece...in eu  turkey...not in eu....have a border.

[baybizz]

So how on earth does Turkey trade with Greece if there is a border?...

[cee-dee]

Simple. The Eu insists on border controls with loads of paperwork and inspections.

[upthecreekyetagain]

Turkey has a partial agreement with the EU.  It is a member of the EU Customs Union for most goods excluding agriculture.

This means that for all goods covered it has to impose the same tariffs on imports from non-EU countries as the EU does - it cannot make individual trade deals with non-EU countries for these goods and has to apply EU regulations regarding safety standards etc.  

Very much the same as proposed in the “There’s May Deal”.

[upthecreekyetagain]

Looks like we are getting to the crunch point.

Assuming Theresa May loses the vote on her EU deal tonight then what comes next.

Jeremy Corbyn says they will call for a vote of no confidence but what chance has that of getting passed - do turkeys really vote for Christmas?  If the vote of no confidence succeeds and there is a General Election then nothing really changes no matter who wins.  The EU have formally said that the deal on the table is the only deal.

The EU says we can only get Article 50 delayed if, in simple terms, there are steps taken for a second referendum or there is a General Election.

There appears to be majority in Parliament against a ‘no deal’ exit.

Will Labour call for their ‘People’s Vote’?

The options if TM loses the vote then really there are only three outcomes:-

We leave with No Deal

We have a new referendum

We don’t leave

If the Vote of No Confidence succeeds then the above options remain just further down the line.

If it fails then nothing has been gained, (or lost).

If all ends up with a new referendum and the vote is still to leave then we will just be in the same position we are now.

The country is in a real mess.

[cee-dee]

Really, this has all been hyped up by the media and people who only have self interest at heart.

Speculation and scare stories have been rife from day one and fuelled by non-news.

Although the three main options are just that, the main options there is another and that's the one TM is most likely to try first and that is going back to the EU.

The EU slammed the door on the present "deal" by saying there was to be no new negotiation. However, that was when they thought TM would get that deal through parliament. The EU are scared stiff of no deal. They want a deal.

SOOOOOOO, wait and see now just how much the TM deal is defeated by, then see if I'm right?

[cee-dee]

So it's 432 to 202? See what happens next?

[upthecreekyetagain]

With a vote against the deal of that size I can’t see that there is anything the EU can offer that would overturn the vote.  Especially when you consider that the vote against came from polar opposites in terms of views on Brexit.

Improve the deal so that Brexiteers are more likely to vote for a deal and it becomes less attractive to Remainers - and vice versa. 

[upthecreekyetagain]

It really is coming down to a choice between leave with no deal and don’t leave at all. 

[cee-dee]

We'll have to see how JC gets on with his no confidence vote?

[upthecreekyetagain]

If he wins tHat vote then little will be gained other than a delay in the exit date - if he doesn’t win it then nothing will change.

[cee-dee]

They're going to debate that tomorrow.

Those political "analysts" along with the rude, pompous , ignorant and arrogant political reporters will be having a field day. The "News" will be full of it and hardly worth watching.

[fallen-archie]

How did we reach this point? I do not see any way out of this which I suspect is what the Eu planned all along. As the song says “you can check out but you can never leave” the only way to deal with this now is to seek the public’s opinion again, however it will be interesting to see what we are asked in the referendum, personally I think it should be leave on wto terms or stay that would appear to be the quickest and cleanest way of dealing with it. What do you think, let’s see if we can agree something on this mess😇

[cee-dee]

We reached this point because people put their self-interest first by conspiring to engineer a situation where other fools were convinced that backing them was the way forward.

What's the point of another referendum? After seeing the way the last one was dealt with, would people have any confidence in the result of another being implemented?

[fallen-archie]

I think that would depend upon the result, if it were inconclusive I agree however if there were a resounding answer to a direct question either way then we would have some closure, which is what I want. Let us get back to a position which enables our parliament to govern and within the constraints laid down by the electorate. I think we need to address our own problems which currently are being ignored due to the amount of time and trouble Brexit has caused!

[cee-dee]

You know very well that a simple question cannot be answered by a simple "yes" or "no", politicians just have to answer with a thousand words that have little or nothing to do with the question.

[fallen-archie]

Oh yes that is true, which is why we have to tell them what we want, not of course that we would agree either😳

[cee-dee]

Ah, but telling them one thing means something different to them. They could easily convince someone that if they said "no" they'd say that they really meant "yes".

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@fallen-archie wrote:
How did we reach this point? I do not see any way out of this which I suspect is what the Eu planned all along. As the song says “you can check out but you can never leave” the only way to deal with this now is to seek the public’s opinion again, however it will be interesting to see what we are asked in the referendum, personally I think it should be leave on wto terms or stay that would appear to be the quickest and cleanest way of dealing with it. What do you think, let’s see if we can agree something on this mess😇

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I don’t agree with the idea of an EU conspiracy, (they’d never have been that clever).

I do agree with your point on the referendum.  Following the vote last night there is no way ANY deal with the EU is possible.  That leaves just the one question to be answered - Should we leave the EU without a deal?