The national Living Wage.

[fallen-archie]

As today sees the start of the National Minimum wage for over 25s I was interested to hear a debate this morning in which many bosses and small businesses said that the cost could see many more people on the dole and price increases. There are definately some areas particularly small businesses, some retail and the care sector which may struggle and yet one very interesting statistic showed that if every person earning £100,000 per year reduced their pay by £1.30 per day that would cover the entire increase. Why is it that the gap between the lowest and highest paid in the UK is so wide, much wider than many European countries and it's not just wages, pensions too seem to be at risk with the masses yet the higher paid have more lucrative schemes. My question is are Bosses bigging themselves and their value up unreasonably in order to gain substantial salaries and benefits.

[fallen-archie]

But there are those who think that works! Are they wise sages or tight fisted self indulgent wannabees.

[bankhaunter]

Both had paid for their houses, both had large sums in the bank and building society.

But housing costs today are about four times what they were in 1971, that makes a big difference.

!971.  Average wage £2,000. Average house £5,632

Today.  Average wage £26,000. Average house £247,000.

[bankhaunter]

Apparently it's far worse than the average American realises and nothing like they think it should be.

[astrologica]

We have a Fiat economy, and historically...all Fiat economies fail. All this printing of money...Britain and the EU...not a good thing!🙁

[023mjc]

The trouble is that most people who get this wage increase will be no better off at all. Those on minimum wage are usually claiming some sort of benefits too - rent or council tax, tax credits and so on.  The minute their wages go up, the benefits will go down accordingly.  So the government are not giving anybody anything. All they are doing is making the employers pay it instead of the tax payer, with no gain whatsoever to those who need it.

[cee-dee]

OK, so we're in 2016 now but people still manage to buy a house if they really want to put the effort in to it. If you're "just starting out", you don't try to buy the "most ideal home" on the market, you cut your suit according to your cloth.

I sometimes chat to a bloke out walking his dog, he's a shift worker and nowhere near retirement. His house is paid for, he's a fork-lift truck driver! His son is 22 and is buying his own house. I can't remember what he does but works in the same factory as his dad.

Another bloke I sometimes meet has retired now but he was "an ordinary working bloke" in another factory. His house is paid for (of course) and he owns several other houses (all paid for) which he rents out. He's a millionaire..... All by his own efforts and careful money management.

I really get sick to death (!!) of hearing people moaning about their lot when I can see them frittering their money away and making jealous remarks about others who've now "got a bob or two".

[bankhaunter]

In London, in 1995 a house was 4.4 times median income, they are now 12.2 times median income.

Try finding any housing on minimum wage.

[cee-dee]

I suppose if you're trying to buy a manor house in Clarach you might be right but if you're just starting out on the property ladder, a terraced in Llandysul might suit you?

[fallen-archie]

I hardly think that chatting to the odd dog walker constitutes a scientific survey worthy of forming an opinion. My remarks are not borne out of jealousy, I simply do not agree with property in the form of housing being used like a roulette table. Inflation within the property market is unsustainable indeed to keep it going there needs to be demand and demand is created by growing the population we lose more and more countryside each day to keep the house builders and our economy afloat. Buy to let is another issue, it seems everyone wants a property portfolio because they see property as a kind of Yukon, can't lose money guaranteed. It's just wrong to structure an economy this way using something that is a basic requirement for all. And as you mention frittering money away, what about those who rent from buy to let landlords paying double what they would for a mortgage because they do not have sufficient income to qualify for a mortgage. There is a real world out there and it spreads far beyond the Dog walking community.

[cee-dee]

I've not tried to put over my comments as a "survey" in any way, shape or form I was merely showing that some, note some, "ordinary working men" have organised their lives better than those others who've frittered their money away.

As to those not able to afford a mortgage but can afford an inflated rent, how is it that some of their peers are able to get a better paid job and afford to buy? Did the lower paid unfortunates fritter away their learning years?

[joe_bloggs*]

-Around three quarters of young Britons believe they are unlikely to ever own their own property and will instead rent for the rest of their lives, according to a new poll.-

https://www.lettingagenttoday.co.uk/breaking-news/2016/3/three-quarters-of-young-british-adults-reco...

The research, conducted amongst 1,906 people aged 25 to 34, shows a large majority wanting to live in a home for the long-term, but recognising that is unlikely as they are renting.

A report from economists at accountancy firm PwC suggests the number of new homebuyers is set to fall over the next 10 years, as the high cost of raising a deposit locks large segments of society out of the housing market.

http://www.theguardian.com/money/2015/jul/22/pwc-report-generation-rent-to-grow-over-next-decade

[bankhaunter]

In Aberystwyth a capenter's hourly rate is £11.50. According to Tescobank mortage calculator they could get a mortage of £101,000.

All that would get them is a one bedroomed flat if they were lucky.

 If I happened to work in Aberystwyth, a terraced house in Llandysul wouldn't be of much use. The daily round trip of 70 miles would eat in to one's income.

[cee-dee]

You've not checked out all the cheaper property in your area then?

[0125arwen]

Zero hour contracts need scrapping that would help far more than this minor rise in minimum wage,

I would also like to see more action taken concerning agency/temporary work.

[artful_dodgings]

Why do you assume that some people have 'frittered their money away' ? By what criterior do you base that sweeping assumption pray tell ? People you have met on your dog walking expeditions ? Just because certain members of the population do not own their own house and are renting, either in private or in council properties, doesn't follow that they are (or have been) living the life of riley.

[fallen-archie]

One in 10 people, or 5 million British adults, have less than £10 a month left over once they have paid their essential bills.

With many households struggling to make ends meet, the findings reveal some worryingly small amounts of money people have. Technically known as discretionary income (rather than the day to day use of disposable income), the amounts were calculated after rent or mortgage payments, bills and food and travel costs were paid.

At the other end of the scale, of the 2,000 people polled, 14% said they had £500 or more of disposable income at the end of the month.

Across the UK, the average monthly disposable income was £187, down by £38 from 2013.

So can someone tell me how you fritter away a tenner a month?

[cee-dee]

Why are a some on here obsessed with mentioning "dog walking expeditions"? I don't go out on such expeditions.

Another thing, I've not attempted to show that anything I've mentioned is in any way, shape or form "a survey".

What I do know (!!) based on my own observations is that some people working in the same jobs have vastly different lifestyles after years in their respective jobs. Why the difference?

As to the "fritttering away" of money, again based on my own observations, I see people in their fifties continuing the lifestyles they've pursued during their working lives which has involved (and still does) having a new car every year, (on the drip of course) several expensive holidays, continual purchases of "stuff" for their homes, smoking & drinking (just look at the recycling bin stuffed with cans and bottles on bin day) not to mention a regular (never ending?) supply of different clothes. Mentioning the bin, just look, every bin day theirs is stuffed to the brim, lid up, with at least two Black bags alongside too. If there's any "new in thing", they've got it! New smart phone? Gotta have it. Latest games/console, gotta have it. A 60 inch Plasma screen? Ah, already got it but they're having a 102 inch next week. After all that, they moan about how hard it is to make ends meet and how much the rent is......

If that's what you want, fine, no problem............... but don't start moaning about not being able to afford to buy a house.

[bankhaunter]

---

@cee-dee wrote:

You've not checked out all the cheaper property in your area then?

---

Yes.

Unfortunately the cheaper properrty tends to be out of the area and travel costs remove most of any savings.

[artful_dodgings]

Everyone can't be an entrepreneur, and not everyone has the mental capacity or the natural where-with-all to accrue shed loads of money during their lifetime. I know an old gent in his early seventies. Started work at fifteen working down the pits until they closed down, and then went to work in an engineering factory, initially as a labourer, and then as a crane driver. His wife never worked, but between them they brought up three offspring. They have never been abroad, and took all their holidays in this country. Neither he nor his wife smokes, but they do frequent the Bingo once a week, and on Saturday nights have a drink in the local club. No plasma TV filling one wall, and I think his car must be at least 10 yrs old. Shame on him, because he still lives in a council owned property. (Now a bungalow).

I don't know where these people are to whom you refer as wasters, but then I do not have the time or the inclination to either observe folk at close quarters, or go rooting through their dustbins. As to the 'walking the dog' part of this thread, it's you who keep mentioning about things you have seen, or locals you have met while out walking your dog on here, and on other threads.

[cee-dee]

I don't go out walking my dog, I don't have a dog.

If you don't get to talk to people, you should get out more.