Should Faith/Religion Have Such a High Value In Our Society?

[lambsy_uk]

I'm not here to trample all over people's faith/beliefs but to ask if/why such beliefs should hold such high value in our society?

So where am I comming from? Well we can freely question almost anything in our society/lives; morals, political beliefs, actions and reactions, motivations, interactions, foreign policy, education, welfare, how we raise our children, law and order and so on..........

However we are positively discouraged from questioning people's faith/beliefs/religion! We are also actively encouraged to accommodate and allow for people's religious beliefs, and this is the bit that really irks me! Why is it that if something is done in the name of a religious belief/practice then we are expected to accept it with little fuss where if any other excuse were used we'd be up in arms?

We endure arguments of whether animal rights should take precedence over religion, whether saving the life of a child should take precedence over their parent's beliefs, should freedom of expression take precedence over religious sensitivities?

For me you may as well base stuff on the football team you support;

"I can't comply with the company dress code because I'm a United fan and therefore I must be allowed to wear a United shirt at work."

As far as I'm concerned this is no more ridiculous than anything done/not done in the name of religious beliefs!

So why do religious beliefs hold such high status and is it right that they do?

[saasher2012]

Yes dear xxxxx



Rather a condescending & patronising reply, but I suppose I expected as much, the truth of the matter is this you cannot give any answer because you have none, & when given the evidence to dispute your unfounded claims, you have to resort to those replies, all we are trying to do & ask for is proof, which you cannot give, I'm afraid it will happen time & time again as you always manage to bring any debate around to the JW teachings, we are not picking on them alone,you are the one who brings them to the forefront of debates at every opportunity, which is fine, but in doing so you must by default expect questions , if they are not answered then in fairness you can't expect people to come round to your way of thinking, I believe that's called freedom of choice!

[bankhaunter]

I will quite happilly respect your choice that you make, choosing not to accept any proofs or facts put in front of you. Of course you will continue to say they are not facts or proofs.

But proofs or facts are never put in front of me, thats the problem.

Words taken from old writings do not in any way, constitute evidence, impossible fairy tales prove nothing and not much can be learned from supposed historical events we know didn't happen.

And how about those neanderthals?

I am sorry Bank but no child abuser is protected, you only have the reports from outside to go on there

They've been given before but here they are again, I think such reports can be said to be reliable, I haven't bothered with those that happened in the US.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/jehovahs-witness-abuse-victims-quizzed-by-their-attacker-...

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/jehovahs-witness-elders-were-spiritually-7258297

[tommy.irene]

You know Banks that people wont believe you ..because JWs can do no harm..

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/jehovahs-witness-leader-mark-sewell-7336623

[**bustysinclaire**]

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@saasher2012 wrote:
Yes dear xxxxx



Rather a condescending & patronising reply

---

And your amusement making and jokes, rebukes and sarcastic comments aren't then.

lol, saasher how ever many times I answer your questions you will always come back the same, and yes it is freedom of choice because that is what we all have been given. We all have a conscience too, I say given to us by God, you say we attained it by us evolving into knowing right from wrong.  Well so be it your choice my choice. 

The reason why so many comments are directed in the way you describe is because almost all subject matter has life with God at the for as part of it. I merely state my opinion.  You pass a comment on the state of the world I will give my opinion why it is like it, you state the presence of a coccyx as part of the skeleton, I will state, God made us that way.  and so on and so on. If there is a thread where I don't think a comment about such things is relevant then I will comment with my opinion in some other way. That is freedom of choice and that is what anyone of is doing. Engaging in conversation.

And I do agree, in all fairness, about my way of thinking that I cannot make you agree if you don't wish to do so. I do answer your questions, and how you take them is your choice. As I have said before, how you interpret whatever is put before you is up to you, but you are closed to the very idea (i would put fact but you won't accept that word) of a God, you do not wish to accept there is a greater being with the Authority to determine the rules we live by and the purposes for mankind as a whole, so you will do your utmost to come up with ways to disprove, but  what you come up with is only anothers interpretation and thoughts.  As you have pointed out, you say the same I say the same, it gets a bit monotonous after a while, but if you don't want to believe it you won't. There will come a time when we won't have any choice, we will have to believe it because it will be put right in front of us that God is who he says he is and what he promises he will do. There will be no getting away from it.

[tommy.irene]

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@**bustysinclaire** wrote:

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@saasher2012 wrote:
Yes dear xxxxx



Rather a condescending & patronising reply

---

And your amusement making and jokes, rebukes and sarcastic comments aren't then.

lol, saasher how ever many times I answer your questions you will always come back the same, and yes it is freedom of choice because that is what we all have been given. We all have a conscience too, I say given to us by God, you say we attained it by us evolving into knowing right from wrong.  Well so be it your choice my choice. 

The reason why so many comments are directed in the way you describe is because almost all subject matter has life with God at the for as part of it. I merely state my opinion.  You pass a comment on the state of the world I will give my opinion why it is like it, you state the presence of a coccyx as part of the skeleton, I will state, God made us that way.  and so on and so on. If there is a thread where I don't think a comment about such things is relevant then I will comment with my opinion in some other way. That is freedom of choice and that is what anyone of is doing. Engaging in conversation.

And I do agree, in all fairness, about my way of thinking that I cannot make you agree if you don't wish to do so. I do answer your questions, and how you take them is your choice. As I have said before, how you interpret whatever is put before you is up to you, but you are closed to the very idea (i would put fact but you won't accept that word) of a God, you do not wish to accept there is a greater being with the Authority to determine the rules we live by and the purposes for mankind as a whole, so you will do your utmost to come up with ways to disprove, but  what you come up with is only anothers interpretation and thoughts.  As you have pointed out, you say the same I say the same, it gets a bit monotonous after a while, but if you don't want to believe it you won't. There will come a time when we won't have any choice, we will have to believe it because it will be put right in front of us that God is who he says he is and what he promises he will do. There will be no getting away from it.

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O no here we go again.. Im trying to get all this into a file to send to London JWs Head Office.. An ex JW told me to do this as they dont like anything said against them on chat fourms.

[**bustysinclaire**]

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@bankhaunter wrote:

I will quite happilly respect your choice that you make, choosing not to accept any proofs or facts put in front of you. Of course you will continue to say they are not facts or proofs.

But proofs or facts are never put in front of me, thats the problem.

Words taken from old writings do not in any way, constitute evidence, impossible fairy tales prove nothing and not much can be learned from supposed historical events we know didn't happen.

And how about those neanderthals?

I am sorry Bank but no child abuser is protected, you only have the reports from outside to go on there

They've been given before but here they are again, I think such reports can be said to be reliable, I haven't bothered with those that happened in the US.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/crime/jehovahs-witness-abuse-victims-quizzed-by-their-attacker-...

http://www.walesonline.co.uk/news/wales-news/jehovahs-witness-elders-were-spiritually-7258297

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How  do you know they didn't happen?

Again, any organisation, individual or reporting body in opossition to God's will bend the truth, will omit or manipulate what is being reported in the attempt to mislead.  Just because you feel a wrong doing hasn't been dealt with in the way YOU think it should deosn't mean it is wrong, God is a God of justice and righteousness and will deal with anywrong doing in a just way.

[saasher2012]

Basically no they are not!
& yes it is boring having to repeat that you don't give any evidence & that you are only quoting from others none of which are your own words & still you don't give an answer to direct questions !.so in fact you do not & have not answered any of my questions or any of the other posters as far as I can see, they will correct me if I'm wrong!.

[cee-dee]

What a load of evasive nonsense.

Where is the evidence that god said anything?

The bible in all its forms is a collection of well edited versions of things written long ago by MAN. The editing removed and added all sorts of stuff when it suited. The Old Testament contains the Pentateuch and forty one other "books" so who wrote what is anyones guess. The only certain fact is that it was written down by MAN.

[bankhaunter]

Just because you feel a wrong doing hasn't been dealt with in the way YOU think it should deosn't mean it is wrong,

Somehow I think I might have more people agreeing with me than not.

Victims of a sexual predator who preyed on fellow Jehovah’s Witnesses had to face their alleged abuser in hearings organised by their church.

God is a God of justice and righteousness and will deal with anywrong doing in a just way.

Never seen it happen and nor have I ever heard of anyone who has, your god is conspicuous by their absence.

Does it work by God watching something bad happening and thinking I'll punish you later when you've finished?

[Anonymous]

So what have we learned after this 20 page debate............

Has it changed anything for anyone? Have any of you been able to convince the other? Does it feel good to have had your say? Has it achieved anything at all? Have you changed your mind at all? Was it informative for anyone? Does anyone now feel better than someone else, more superior maybe, more knowledgeable? Has it gained any respect for eachother? Or did you just have a good laugh out of it? Did it make you feel happy? Did it frustrate you? Did it make you angry, upset or sad?

It just makes me wonder..........

There is obviously something worthwhile that you all get out of it otherwise it seems pretty pointless to me to continue the same arguments over and over.

Anyway, for me religion or science is like a pair of shoes.....Find one that fits for you, but don't make me wear your shoes.

[saasher2012]

No.
No.
Yes.
No.
No
No.
No.
No.
No.
No.
Yes& no
No.
Yes
None of these!
No comment!!.
.

[Anonymous]

[saasher2012]

LOL.!!.

[bankhaunter]

Anyway, for me religion or science is like a pair of shoes.....Find one that fits for you, but don't make me wear your shoes.

Apparently that's why you don't get many atheists who were Hindus, don't like one god, you just pick another.

Perhaps Hell might not be quite as expected for the wicked.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gc7WnDgt0yY

[saasher2012]

Very good! lol.

[tommy.irene]

http://www.irishcentral.com/news/politics/Former-Vatican-ambassador-slams-murder-of-Christians-in-Ir...

..In a column for the Boston Herald on Saturday, Raymond Flynn, former US ambassador to the Vatican, harshly criticized the complacency of Americans in the reported murder of Christians by radical Islamic terrorists in Iraq. “Where is the moral outrage in America?” he asks. “Have we given up?” The former mayor of Boston wrote, “Politicians are only concerned about raising money from powerful special interest groups to win the next election, while Hollywood and the media focus on appealing to a changing secular culture and not for standing up for what’s right.” “The worst example of this betrayal is the reported slaughter of Christians in Iraq by radical Islamic terrorists, who are determined to kill all Christians and Jews in the world. I have been talking about this crisis since I returned home from the Vatican and the Middle East and Africa. But because I no longer hold public office, the media can ignore what I have to say. Contacts in the Catholic Church in the Middle East continue to inform me about what’s taking place, as do Vatican and U.S. State Department officials, intelligence officers and the CIA.”

[tommy.irene]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2760048/I-question-God-exists-Archbishop-Canterbury-admits-m... ... Good for him..

I sometimes question if God exists: Archbishop of Canterbury admits he sometimes has moments of doubt Archbishop Justin Welby said sometimes he questions if God exists He said it is hard for Christians to accept that God allows suffering He said he regularly prays while on his morning jog near his London home Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2760048/I-question-God-exists-Archbishop-Canterbury-admits-m... 

[tommy.irene]

http://www.themirrorpost.com/2014/07/1500-year-old-bible-claims-jesus-christ.html

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/weird-ne ... ce-4330083

[tommy.irene]

http://www.irishmirror.ie/news/weird-news/jesus-christ-makes-immaculate-appearance-4330083

[bankhaunter]

So Jesus appears on a toilet floor, how appropriate.

Never underestimated the credulity of a lot of people, gullible or what.