Increased penalties for using a mobile phone whilst driving

[jd.linklater]

The government plans to increase penalty fines for driving while using a mobile phone from £100 to £150 and to increase the number of penalty points from three to four. Does anyone think this will make any difference to the number of offending drivers? The Department of Transport found that when the penalty was doubled from £50 to £100 in 2013 it made 'no discernable difference' to the number of offenders so why would a similar increase have any effect now?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-35141387

Personally my idea of a crackdown would be an immediate 12 month ban and £1000 fine for a first offence. What do others think?

[suzieseaside]

That's true! The only way would be to make passengers wear duct tape across their mouths when getting into a vehicle.

[evoman3957]

As they love their Phones so much, I'd Super Glue them to their Ears.............I bet they wouldn't be so in love with them after a couple of weeks.

[bankhaunter]

Hands free is just that, the phone can be answered without requiring one hand to hold the phone though it's true that even talking to a passenger can be distracting.

But it's not a matter of just speaking or listening, it's also drivers that send and read texts.

[cee-dee]

Research eh?

Now how were the conclusions arrived at?

Did they follow/watch the same drivers using a phone as when they were talking to a passenger about the same sort of subject as in a "distracting" phone conversation? OR when the same drivers were keenly listening to something on the radio? OR when the same drivers were having a heated discussion with a passenger? OR when the same drivers were trying to follow confusing directions. OR when the same drivers were late for a meeting/appointment? & etc, etc.

If they didn't (as I suspect) I think, like a lot of these "researchers" they were looking for confirmation of what they believed and were not "researching" with an open mind. They were looking for what they wanted and sure enough, they found it.

[upthecreekyetagain]

Some of the researchers created some or all of the scenarios you suggested and they did show that in some, conversations with passengers and listening to the radio could be as distracting as using a mobile phone.

The same research also demonstrated that distraction levels were almost identical when using a hand held or hands free mobile.

What appears to be beyond dispute is that a driver is significantly less likely to have an accident and to drive more safely when not using a mobile.

There is very little that can be done to stop the distraction caused by passengers but that doesn't mean that we shouldn't take measures to reduce the use of mobiles that can be enforced as well as detecting their use should an accident occur or another driving offence be committed.

The assertion in an earlier post, "If it's the conversation that distracts then you'd have to ban talking to passengers as well?" is spurious.

[cee-dee]

If you have such faith in biased "research", other research has showed that on many roads the vehicles were mostly carrying only the driver. Therefore it's probable that there are many, many more drivers using a phone than chatting to a passenger?

On that point, did this "research" note the percentage of drivers using a phone whilst driving? If there's more drivers doing that whist driving alone, it's logical that more of those drivers would be distracted?

Just to be clear..... although I used a phone in the early days of the mobile phone and before that used a hand-held microphone (for radio), today there are far more cars on the road and also far too many of those hunched-up cars where the driver has poor situational awareness and drives two ot even three feet from the side of the road (which is another story) so I keep both hands on the steering wheel these days......

So, if a ban on using a hands free phone is to be promoted, chatting to passengers should also face a ban. Next thing it'll be proposed that the driver should be in a separate compartment of his own so he can't interact with any passengers?

You can't legislate for every eventuality so some sense needs to be applied and drivers lacking in sense should face a lengthy ban.

[upthecreekyetagain]

You can call the research biased if you wish but have you found ANY that demonstrates that using a mobile phone whilst driving does NOT impair a drivers concentration?

If the research was showing that mobile phone usage didn't affect a driver's ability then there could possibly be a case for bias if the research were funded for instance by phone providers but what possible incentive is there to show that their use is dangerous whilst driving?

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@cee-dee wrote:

So, if a ban on using a hands free phone is to be promoted, chatting to passengers should also face a ban. Next thing it'll be proposed that the driver should be in a separate compartment of his own so he can't interact with any passengers?

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One ban doesn't necessitate the other - that's using the argument that A is dangerous, B is dangerous, if I stop A I MUST also stop B - no you don't have to, it might be advisable to but they are separate 'dangers' that can be dealt with separately.

If that argument were to be used in all walks of life then nothing would ever get done!

I am of the generation that remembers the time when drinking and driving was socially acceptable - well using the inverse of your argument, if we don't ban the use of mobile phones then we shouldn't ban drinking and driving.

[cee-dee]

Doing anything except taking care with your driving impairs your concentation.

As the research was conducted by those with a vested interest in the prevention of accidents, they would be more interested in backing up their opposition to the use of mobile phones.

I think any "research" conducted by mobile phone makers/providers would be counter productive and likely to be greeted with howls of protest along with accusations of bias.

To be clear, I think those using a hand-held phone should be prosecuted and if it's subsequently found (after examination of the phone) that they made calls or texts while driving, they should face a lengthy ban.

[evoman3957]

Unfortunately the World is full of people who think that just because they can't do the right thing ALL of the time, there's no point in doing the right thing ANY of the time.

[upthecreekyetagain]

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@cee-dee wrote:

As the research was conducted by those with a vested interest in the prevention of accidents . . . . .

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I thought we all have a vested interest in that!

You might find this interesting

http://www.mthr.org.uk/research_projects/documents/Rum5FinalReport.pdf

[jd.linklater]

An interesting report on the findings of a very involved set of tests. I have to say though that I find some of the test scenarios a little unrealistic (Conditions and Tasks in Table 1). 

For example who is ever going to be expected to do verbal puzzles involving numerical reasoning over the phone while driving or recall a sentence word for word? If I received a call while driving it would never be about anything so involved. Similarly I could never envisage a time when I would want or need to manually tune a radio while driving. Every car radio has presets these days, there is just no need. Any of the other control features used in the test are everyday movements that we do automatically on a day to day basis, I never have to take my eyes off the road to turn on the heater or alter the fan speed or change the volume on the radio.

I think the road layouts were a little too simple to represent everyday conditions too. You never know what position you might be in or what conditions you might have to deal with when you receive a call but there were no junctions, roundabouts or traffic signals to contend with in the tests. Nor any adverse weather conditions.  

The question and answer session  was enlightening (Section 4.2.3). Unbelievable that some people admit to having business conversations while driving and some admit to their calls lasting for 20 minutes.