eBay now asking for NI numbers

[btr.style]

I set up a new private account not long back for selling off genuinely unwanted goods (as I said before, better off selling them on a private account than paying full fees or watering down the clothing business selling nans old china stuff). 

30 sales made and it came up saying I have to update my account and provide NI number. Fine, I've nothing to hide so I did. 

So it seems the rollout has started. Probably just new accounts when they hit 30 sales and won't be for established accounts for some time maybe. 

It first popped up on the app and that page was where I got to. I also had an email about it. 

So it seems now, anyone wanting to open a private account to sell stuff as a side hustle had best be prepared to have to give their NI numbers once they reach 30 sales. 

Probably will be for all sellers to have to provide it soon surely?

[a45heaven]

From the HMRC web Site

Keeping your National Insurance number safe

To prevent identity fraud, do not share your National Insurance number with anyone who does not need it.

These organisations may need to know what your number is:

• HM Revenue and Customs (HMRC)
• your employer
• the Department for Work and Pensions (which includes Jobcentre Plus and the Pension, Disability and Carers Service), if you claim state benefits, or in Northern Ireland the Department for Social Development
• your local council, if you claim Housing Benefit, or the Northern Ireland Housing Executive
• Electoral Registration Officers (to check your identity when you register to vote)
• the Student Loans Company, if you apply for a student loan
• your pension provider if you have a personal or stakeholder pension
• your Individual Savings Account (ISA) provider, if you open an ISA
• authorised financial service providers who help you buy and sell investments like shares, bonds and derivatives - you can check if your provider is authorised
• Veterans UK

[papso22]

That list needs to be updated as it is now a legal requirement for online platforms to provide the NINO together with the sales data for certain members.  As the only way Ebay can comply with its legal requirements is to get the NINO from members, then it is clear ebay needs it and members can provide it to them.

I also don't think that list was ever meant to be one that listed the only people you should give your NINO to.

[equinox-electronics]

So I wonder when they will finally ask for N.I numbers? Surely they should be asking established accounts sooner rather than later.

[a45heaven]

The list is in black and white - now who is to more trusted HMRC ( who kinda own the NINO) and have published the list or ebay ? Surely its down to ebay to communicate with HMRC to resolve this.

There are quite a few indiscretions which ebay have posted  lately which are questionable (EU Related issues comes to mind) .

Along with the  covert 'Regulatory ' issues which we have been charged for , but  other platforms are not following, seems a concern. Partial sales performances are meaningless, apart from breaching a threshold, which is favoured pastime these days.

[papso22]

If you want confirmation from HMRC, see this link:

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/selling-goods-or-services-on-a-digital-platform

Specifically this bit:

Information you must give

Digital platform operators will ask you for certain details.

If you’re an individual seller, they’ll ask for your:

• full name
• address where you normally live
• date of birth
• tax identification number (National Insurance number if you live in the UK)

[4_bathrooms]

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@a45heaven wrote:

The list is in black and white - now who is to more trusted HMRC ( who kinda own the NINO) and have published the list or ebay ?

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From HMRC:

eBay are therefore requesting the information HMRC has told them to request.

It should also be noted that eBay are an authorised financial service provider that is regulated by the FCA; you can see their entry in the FCA register here. It seems HMRC still hasn't updated the 9th entry in their list to reflect the reporting rules for digital platforms. However, the link in that entry takes you to the search page of the FCA's register.   

[exponential_developments]

Is Jan 31, 2025 when ebay will ask for the NINO numbers, i tried asking on the weekly chat, but didn't recieve an answer.

[*vyolla*]

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@exponential_developments wrote:

Is Jan 31, 2025 when ebay will ask for the NINO numbers, i tried asking on the weekly chat, but didn't recieve an answer.

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They've started already with new accounts and some sellers who've reached the reporting criteria. Some of the other sites (such as Vinted) have done the same, so I'm not sure if there'll be a fixed in stone date for the rest.

[ett1954]

From the Government's website:  Selling online and paying taxes - information sheet - GOV.UK

"From 1 January 2024, digital platforms are required to collect and report seller information and income to HMRC.  These digital platforms must report sellers’ income by January 2025."  It has previously been stated that January 31st is the deadline date.

This would suggest that they require the NINO before this date.  Expect an explosion of contributions to the boards when all online platforms suddenly ask for this information.  All digital platforms have kept this 'low key' (probably the worry of sellers deserting the platform) but time is running out.

Leaving it last minute does ensure that most seller affected by 2004 data release will have little or no opportunity to stay below any threshold for reporting unless they have already been on top of the situation.  I expect, to preserve sales, they are willing to throw non-compliant sellers to the wolves - but then warnings had previously been given.

I did read somewhere, and I can't remember where now, that if a tax identification number is not presented with the sales record then HMRC can still identify the seller by other means but the process is slower and they would hold the relevant platform accountable for not providing the full information.

[exponential_developments]

As i've stated before, UTR no problem, NINO, no chance.

[theelench]

I expect ebay will try its usual trick when demanding new information or even re-verifying already held info. from private sellers.  

Wait until they sell something then withhold their money until they hand it over.

Knowing that the NINO question is coming ever closer I'm now restricting my live listings and will only be selling one item at a time.  This will at least mean ebay only has one lot of sale proceeds to hold hostage.

If they do try it, I'll imediately close any other llistings to prevent further sales and hostage taking and close my account.

I might have to wait 180 days to finally get my money, but better that than giving my NINO to ebay.

(I see the spell-check is still broken, apologies for any typos.)

[myriad*seller]

Who says they will release your money after 180 days?

They may be entitled to hold the funds permanently from Jan 2025

Otherwise, business sellers masquerading as private sellers will all just follow your example, knowing they would be paid out in 6 months....

[exponential_developments]

Because that's theft.

[myriad*seller]

Not if the reasons they are holding it is because they believe the funds are obtained unlawfully? 

So funds obtained by money laundering should be given to the sellers? 

OR a business seller selling on a private account refuses to give out their NI number? 

You honestly think eBay will just give them their money even though they refused to give legally required information? 

This isn't just eBay rules we are dealing with here now, the law requires the seller to give eBay their NI number. I don's see how giving it to them after 6 months makes their refusal "legal"...

[myriad*seller]

eBay have the right to hold your funds permanently if required by law 

It's in the T&Cs 

Unless otherwise required by law, we will settle any unused retained amounts to your Linked Financial Account within 180 days of your eBay account closure.

and 

We take into consideration relevant factors when assessing the risks including selling history, seller performance, returns and cancellations, chargebacks, riskiness of the listing category, transaction value, the ability to make direct debits from your Linked Financial Account, and the filing of eBay Buyer Protection Program claims. We also may cancel or freeze the settlement of your proceeds as necessary to comply with our legal obligations in connection with fraud prevention, risk management, or regulatory compliance, or, upon lawful request by our Affiliates, to enable them to comply with legal obligations applicable to them (such as compliance with tax-related obligations from EU DAC7 legislation). Any hold placed on your funds will be lifted when the issue is resolved.

Therefore eBay have the right to hold ALL funds permanently, until a seller provides them with their NI number and any other information that eBay (or their Affilates such as HMRC) require. 

Waiting 180 days will not free up your funds, the only way to free up funds is to supply the legally-required NI number. 

[exponential_developments]

You believe what you want.

[ett1954]

If HMRC deem you owe tax they can take money direct from your bank or building society.  I don't know whether this would include eBay but that's irrelevant as eBay would alternatively be paying any money into your bank.  This is known as Direct Recovery of Debts.  They may also charge you costs for doing so in some circumstances.

[myriad*seller]

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@exponential_developments wrote:

You believe what you want.

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I've literally copied and pasted from eBay terms and conditions!! 

That shows what they are legally allowed to do, and by using eBay you agreed to this contract. 

[exponential_developments]

Please refer to message 76.

[myriad*seller]

I presume you understand the concept of a legally binding contract?