Your funds will be available for payout once we receive delivery confirmation

[silverfoxx68]

Hi I've just received this message contacted ebay and is being sent to everyone 

That's me I'm done no more ebay for me bye bye

We are making changes to the way we process payments on eBay. Going forward, we’ll make your funds available for payout within 48 hours after we’ve confirmed delivery of the item. Until then, you’ll see a “hold” on your funds. This process helps keep our marketplace safe.

[vintique*violet]

At the very least sellers should be made aware of that risk, however remote, and that in the event of such a catastrophe it now seems that it's not just scammers that can leave a seller without their item or the money but the shareholders can take the interest as dividends and just say "hard luck" to sellers if it all goes wrong.

@theelench 

Only those who are " investing" are made aware of any risks  - Our funds are /will be under " ownership" of eBay who quite clearly have stated they garner interest and invest ... We are not privy to that "investment" and any profits are for the stakeholders, investors and eBay... eBays  terms and conditions show that seller/buyer  are " removed" from making any claim to the "funds." 

So if/when such a catastrophe, sellers/buyers will be hung out to dry basically. 

[23sandlane]

I'm surprised that none of the non-eBay selected carriers haven't taken
legal action based on it being anti-competitive!

[theelench]

What a tangled web they weave.....

So now ebay controls the listing process, although the seller is still solely responsible for those listings, the advertising of the products entirely at their discretion and the size of the bribe from the seller, the timescale and delivery options on offer to buyer and seller, payment processing and the disbursement of the seller's funds.  Now they have "taken ownership"  of those funds rather than just processing and distributing them.

And all this as "just a platform" bringing bringing sellers and buyers together but taking no responsibility for anything.

Perhaps in reality I'm senile and have forgotten that all those old vases I sold were actually ebay's and they only paid me for my time listing, packing, posting etc as one of their employees 🤣

[lucy_farmer]

'So now ebay controls the listing process, although the seller is still solely responsible for those listings, the advertising of the products entirely at their discretion and the size of the bribe from the seller, the timescale and delivery options on offer to buyer and seller, payment processing and the disbursement of the seller's funds.  Now they have "taken ownership"  of those funds rather than just processing and distributing them.'

And all this as "just a platform".      

I think this is turning into one of those 'boiled frog' situations!

Lots of small changes one after another (water heating up....)  frog just sits there. Until the final change (probably SD) that means the water is boiling and the frog finally has to jump out!   🐸

yours. kermit.   😁

[parsley2003]

This frog is already looking for a new pond

[eastern-lights]

---

@lucy_farmer wrote:

I think this is turning into one of those 'boiled frog' situations!

---

Isn't the point about the boiled frog that he never does leap out; just gets boiled alive?

[lucy_farmer]

'Isn't the point about the boiled frog that he never does leap out; just gets boiled alive?'

He was supposed to; I was being optimistic! 😄

I think the whole boiled frog theory got dispproved a couple of years ago.... (still a good thought experiment though....and a good way to demonstrate the process of getting used to things you would instantly refuse if they all happened at once)

[andha-21]

I'm honestly not sure we are the frog in this instance. I think it may turn out being the people responsible for some of these new updates. 

The market I follow (Warhammer models) is very stable and has been ever since I started collecting. Auction wise, anomalies tend to only creep up through listing errors. Not describing what they are selling correctly or listing them so they finish at a ridiculous hour in the night. So seller fault. 

But over the last few days the market is showing serious signs of change. What I'm waiting to see is if hits the mega traders in similar ways. There are 3 huge ones that all do auctions and if the market has dipped here through no fault of their own I doubt they are going to be happy. & they all sell elsewhere already. 

[littlethingsuneed]

never heard of the boiled frog 

but i remember joe cartoons frog in a blender lol

think i might move my stock overseas again and use a platform offshore 

not the first time ive moved stock

shut down a perfectly good warehouse in norwich 

because the uk government decided to put a heavy levvy on everything chipped in from outside the eu

i just moved the stock to hamburg

and dhl got the contract and royal mail lost the contract

probably build my own platform to sell from 

whos coming over?

[sunshinedior67]

I think eBay are on dangerous ground holding funds & making interest from
sellers/buyers. My view is the buyer is buying from eBay plc rather than
the seller but eBay doesn't & never will own the item so why are they
holding the money & profiteering from it. If the buyer is paying eBay then
eBay takes full responsibility & liability. The seller hasn't received
payment so hasn't sold to anyone. It's not sold until the buyer receives
goods & seller the payment. This is a grey area 😧

[tressygirl]

---

@sunshinedior67 wrote:
I think eBay are on dangerous ground holding funds & making interest from
sellers/buyers. My view is the buyer is buying from eBay plc rather than
the seller but eBay doesn't & never will own the item so why are they
holding the money & profiteering from it. If the buyer is paying eBay then
eBay takes full responsibility & liability. The seller hasn't received
payment so hasn't sold to anyone. It's not sold until the buyer receives
goods & seller the payment. This is a grey area 😧

---

I think the ' dangerous ground,  and grey area'  has been Very carefully looked at,  with eBay's deep pockets finding the ' best lawyers' in town.

It might not be liked by many,  but it will be legal.

[andha-21]

Sorry, I don't agree with the bit where you say "it will be legal".

Corporations all over the world make money out of consumer ignorance. It's basically a business method in itself.

Dixons group selling extended warranties on products, making the buyer pay for the first year and a bit that was already included by law. Eventually they were caught, sued and lost. That's one example in what probably runs into millions.

So people saying things like you said there aren't remotely helpful in any way. You might hope they are abiding by the law, maybe because if they are, they aren't screwing anyone over and that includes you. But you don't know and it would take a small army of lawyers and related professionals to prove any different.

[valueaddedresource]

---

@sunshinedior67 wrote:
I think eBay are on dangerous ground holding funds & making interest from
sellers/buyers. My view is the buyer is buying from eBay plc rather than
the seller but eBay doesn't & never will own the item so why are they
holding the money & profiteering from it. If the buyer is paying eBay then
eBay takes full responsibility & liability. The seller hasn't received
payment so hasn't sold to anyone. It's not sold until the buyer receives
goods & seller the payment. This is a grey area 😧

---

@sunshinedior67  to be clear - the part about them collecting interest has been explicitly stated in their ToU since October 2023 and may possibly have been happening before that but just not explicitly stated (sellers have speculated about it for years).

Regardless, we can definitively say it's been true since at least 2023 and there have yet to be any successful or even publicly known legal or regulatory actions to change it.

eBay already has high priced lawyers covering them on this subject...they're the ones who wrote that 2023 policy update. 😉

That's not to say something couldn't change in the future but at the present any way, it would appear eBay is very comfortable in their belief that there do not face significant legal or regulatory risks with this move to hold funds longer.

[littlethingsuneed]

on every note in the uk it very clearly states 

i promise to pay the barer of 

which means without any hinderance 

im ery sure it is illegal what they are doing 

ok the bac system you get used to 

it takes around 3-4 days 

but what if its a one time user that buys something on the off chance

this means you have to wait for the customer to confirm its delivery mmmm

this is not going to work

i sell hedge trimmer carb kits 

do you think the customer is going to find time to go login just to leave me feedback

noooo his going to be out there sorti out 

[papso22]

---

@littlethingsuneed wrote:

on every note in the uk it very clearly states 

i promise to pay the barer of 

which means without any hinderance 

im ery sure it is illegal what they are doing 

ok the bac system you get used to 

it takes around 3-4 days 

but what if its a one time user that buys something on the off chance

this means you have to wait for the customer to confirm its delivery mmmm

this is not going to work

i sell hedge trimmer carb kits 

do you think the customer is going to find time to go login just to leave me feedback

noooo his going to be out there sorti out 

---

You have a business account, the changes don't impact you.

[theelench]

As I said in post #764 the UK utilities companies are doing the same thing (or worse), ebay is only delaying payment to get control of seller's money, the utilities are taking payments in advance.   The common element is a plausible reason for doing so.

The utilities claim  that doing so helps protect consumers from getting into debt.  Ebay claims that holding funds helps protect buyers.  I wonder if the legality rests on it being pretty much impossible for anyone to prove that the claim of protecting consumers isn't necessary or isn't actually happening? 

In both situations the corporate lawyers have been careful not to mention that whether or not the protection is necessary, the biggest beneficiary is the company, not the the consumers.

[sheffieldsvintage]

What's feedback got to do with the price of fish..... lol

[andha-21]

There are certain sale conditions that won't receive their funds before 14 days unless feedback is left. 

That's what I read last time anyway. 

[theelench]

I believe I'm right in saying that this came up during discussions when Managed Payments was rolled out in the UK.  To begin with there were payment delays which were reduced as the new system bedded-in.

The question of ebay accruing interest during the delays was raised and I'm sure that at some point some ebay exec. did specifically say that ebay did earn interest in the US but did not in the UK.

Just my guess but that would be quite likely at the time.  If ebay knew that the length of delays would be quickly reduced from days to hours, would it have been cost effective to set up the mechanisms to earn interest that would soon become too little to bother with?

The payment holds now are envisaged as being permanent, so there's far more benefit to ebay by changing the UK T&Cs (ToU) to include the new situation?

[haynesexplains]

I urge all Ebayers to stop listing whilst this crazy policy is in place , basically everything needs to be sent recorded tracked which as you all know costs more so prices will increase and buyers will go elsewhere . It’s only by not listing eBay will change as they are going to lose sales , I fir one have not listed anything since this started and will not until resolved