This is going to mean the end for many small private sellers. "Buyer Protection Fee"

[vinylscot]

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/buying/paying-items/buyer-protection?id=5594

75p plus 4% buyers fee, so something which was priced at £5 will be £5.95 in February.

[date80211]

If there's a conspiracy here, could any of you say what it is?

Could any of you say anything else about it, as who or why?

[lucy_farmer]

'If not, why are you wasting your own time, and taking mine?'

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OK mate.

Whatever.

Have a lovely evening.

[dch2112011]

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@date80211 wrote:

If there's a conspiracy here, could any of you say what it is?

Could any of you say anything else about it, as who or why?

I don't think there is a conspiracy - a poster was offering a hypothetical reason as to why promoting listings wasn't working - the theory was to suggest that ebay was conspiring to not promote listings when a percentage lower than the recommended was used 

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[theelench]

I don't think it's a conspiracy, just simple mathematics.  Ebay wants sellers to promote their listings so it makes more money.

Logic dictates that as the higher percentage used makes ebay more money it will determine visibility on a sliding scale.

Last year ebay 'recommended' I sponsor by somewhere around 12-13% to get 'extra' visibility.  Possibly if I'd chosen (say) 10% I might have been allowed un-restricted visibility, but no 'extra'.

I didn't sponsor at all, so my visibility slid off the bottom of the scale, but a few buyers found my items by luck.  Perhaps the result of 'fat finger syndrome' and typing page 23 instead of page 2 and bought my item hidden down in the depths.

Luckily for me it happened all of 4 times last year  😮

[dch2112011]

Yes that's not good - promotions really were good when only a few used them when they were first introduced but now too many are using them hence the massive number of adverts which just swamp most listings  except the priveleged brands who have no advertising on their listings.

I am still convinced that private sellers should have a different set up within the platform with maybe their own categories and no paid promoting - How this could work I really have no idea but it would have to exclude businesses.

The visability of genuine private sellers will have absolutely no affect on businesses the two are like chalk and cheese.

It is difficult to understand that the efforts ebay are putting into attracting private sellers will only produce short term results unless visability is increased to produce regular sales - private sellers in general are not operating in terms of costs in anything remotely the same way as a business.

They have to be treated differently - surely ?

[theelench]

Which is precisely why I won't sponsor.

It might be necessary if I was selling something like new T Shirts where there is cut-throat competition.

But not in vintage glass where, if there is competition it will raise prices because of rarity or item condition.

Last year I listed a rare "Brandenburg" bowl made by Walther & Sohne (a very collectable glass maker), in as near pristine condition as you're likely to find and reasonably priced at £15.  A few good photos and it should have sold first time it was listed.  (Try finding one for sale on ebay or any other selling site, if you can.)

If it didn't find a buyer it should at least have had plenty of views from enthusiasts just looking at something they would likely only see on an I.D site, often with only 1 photo.  But without being promoted it got a handful of views and no bids.  It finally sold as BIN a couple of months later.

Until ebay swept them all away it would have been listed in Date Lined Glass> 1910-1939 > Art Deco with around 10K listings.  After ebay "improved" the search by coming up with a new category of (something like) Glass > Decorative Cookware & Tableware > Bowls with about 100K ads., mostly new items, it was buried.  Just to make it even more difficult to find, at the time there was no IS for the colour "Amber".  No IS date period for Art Deco, only decades and no IS under Brand for "Walther", although they did have US glass makers.

Sabotage or what?  Not surprising that I sold 4 items on ebay in a year, 28 on ebid in the same year and came to see ebay as now almost useless for selling collectables.  Ebay doesn't need to do anything other than re-instate the old categories to revive sales by private sellers of collectables.  But I suspect that although they sell continuously they often sell too slowly so ebay is now intent on becoming the worlds biggest second-hand clothes market.

But as you say, the rag trade won't stick around for long when they see the reality of ebay.   It's NOT Free to Sell, it's still Free to List but now if you don't sponsor your cast-offs you won't sell anything.

Just one of the reasons I don't sell on ebay now.

[jokers_toybox]

As a business seller I just wont pay twice to get my listings seen

[dch2112011]

It seems fundamentally wrong, businesses and private sellers are different entities or should be - the philosophy of running business and private sales together under one set of rules and one umbrella seems to be becoming counter productive.

I still feel that better vetting and a whole new set of private seller rules geared entirely for the genuine private sellers and collectors with categories that only private sellers can acccess for sales would be a step towards seperating the two types of entity.

I want private sellers to be successful purely from the selfish viewpoint that they breed customers for business.

Selling 4 items a year from the desirable collectables you sell is not a good advert 

It would be an advantage to everybody if ebay took a cross section of genuine private sellers and listened to their ideas for making this happen - not the whingeing and whining but genuine concerns and ideas for making private sellers feel as though they were a seperate identity that wanted to make ebay private sales the place to be !

I find it overwhelming when looking at a listing and constantly being directed to other sellers and listings before even being able to read the description - it's a browsing nightmare - with a specific item that you want from a business it does not matter so much you are focused on a specific item and look for certain criteria to be met and not always price - in fact hardly ever just price !

[jokers_toybox]

Honestly for me it just needs to be an even keel in regards to fees, then no one would need to masquerade as a private seller when they are a business. 

If you go to an auction house, the selling fees are the same, if you're a dealer or just selling unwanted stuff it doesn't matter, it shouldn't here either.

Sellers should be responsible for their own taxes too, much like in the high street, you get people who pay and people who dodge, all eBay need to do is report it and let HMRC deal with it.

Most of this mess is just a knee jerk response to Vinted, that was badly implemented.

Whatever system is in place, people will try and dodge fees/responsibilities somewhere.

[dch2112011]

Sadly it is true - but fee dodgers/tax dodgers need to be discouraged - if only to stop their gains being passed on  as costs to those who are honest by way of increased fees or taxes.

[jokers_toybox]

I have previously covered how simple and cost effective it would be to implement a "report seller as a business" button 

That alone would put many off, disgruntled businesses would do most of ebay's work and the conversion rate to business account fees would pay for staff to look at it until they were no longer needed. 

[lucy_farmer]

'It seems fundamentally wrong, businesses and private sellers are different entities or should be...'

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I agree with you very much on this, but we are just Brits!  I know ebay uk has a fair amount of autonomy, but the parent of all is American.

And in the good' ol U S of A there's apparently very little difference between business and private accounts (apart from simply having a business name on the returns address..?)

So possibly the idea of 2 very different types of seller is just a bit alien to the mothership.

I seem to remember ebay UK trying out an ebay business only section, ages ago ?  and it sinking without trace ages ago....

[dch2112011]

Yes a report button is a good idea - it would also be a good idea if ebay  actioned their own policies rather than hiding behind the official line of

' all policies are subject to ebay's interpretation ',

[annemann-2009]

How would you mitigate malicious reporting? As well as time/costs for eBay to deal with it all?

[dch2112011]

Ah the million dollar question - maybe in the same way they are supposed to with any current report function - poorly !

Currently part of the specific report function is a numbers game - x number of reports per individual seller offence triggers a response - otherwise logged and discarded

Better vetting from conception of a private account could be automated ?  I don't know but a thought 

[lucy_farmer]

'Sellers should be responsible for their own taxes too, much like in the high street, you get people who pay and people who dodge, all eBay need to do is report it and let HMRC deal with it.'

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Unfortunately it's not just about dodging taxes, and ebay are starting to 'report' it now anyway (all accounts business or private, will have their financial info sent to HMRC  as part of the international Money Laundering regulations. Unless you are a seriously tiny seller!)

It's about UK consumer law and trading standards for distance and online selling. (A bricks and mortar auction house is not at a 'distance', even if you're bidding over the phone)

[gccomics22]

Over and out 20 years buying selling ,biggest ball drop since Ratners *bleep* statement .I hope they realise one day what they have done ,I will never buy nothing from here ever ,at least all the gurus and mentors with the lovely negative responses wont have anything to have a go at anymore as much use as a chocolate fireguard most of them not all ,see how much money they make out of the cheap Chinese fake *bleep* that`s flooded the site ,nobody wants it ! Bye it`s been an experience .

[gccomics22]

It`s bad now but soon they will reinvent the wheel again and finish anyone left unless you live in China and don`t pay shipping etc ,never seen such stupidity in my life .

[gccomics22]

Wonderful delusion ,buyers won`t buy anymore all you moaning business sellers need Private sellers you just don`t see it ,everything I sold I used to buy ,not any more I won`t ,good luck fighting the Chinese invasion of cheap fake *bleep*.

[moldosgifts]

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@annemann-2009 wrote:

How would you mitigate malicious reporting? As well as time/costs for eBay to deal with it all?

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By getting a human being to look at them and their trading history it really isn't rocker science it is common sense.

Genuine private seller are very clearly that, business seller are by the same rules clearly a business.

I'm not trained and I can spot them, I have a list with over 4000 account names on it i monitor 10 at a time after ive reported about a third get changed or close their account safter reporting, that still leave 2 thirds that AI misses. And these are very obvious businesses on a private account.

I can even spot professional car boot  and antique trader sellers they don't tend to go on my list.