HMRC DONT BELIEVE WHAT THE MEDIA AND SOME PEOPLE ARE SAYING

[jackstackcornwall]

some media outlets and miss informed people are spreading the word that the Tax man is after you ,no they are not, scare mongering is doing the job it self ,its nothing to worry about , the tax people only know what you tell them and as long as you are an honest seller and do your tax return from the details on your ebay then you have nothing to worry about  the fear is far worse than the truth 

[*vyolla*]

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@greatgiftshampshire wrote:

What is the new computer system of HMRC?

Connect is a new social network analysis software data mining computer system developed by HMRC (UK) that cross-references business's and people's tax records with other databases to establish fraudulent or undisclosed (misdirected) activity. its run by AI and has a quick match method, conects up all Government dept such as, Land Registry, DVLA and so on, if you have an exspensive car and a nice house and your social media profile brags about wealth HMRC will know about it ........

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Connect isn't new, it's been around for a good while.

[litp*records]

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@jow1995 wrote:

jackstackcornwall appears to have closed his ebay account, " surprise surpise Cilla

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Just stupid.  All they had to do was have a business account on ebay + report annual income and expenses to HMRC.  It's not rocket science people!!  

To the ones who moan it's too difficult and complicated (and therefore "not fair"): it's a darn site easier doing a tax return than listing 1,000 items on Ebay, let me say that.

For the vast majority of sole traders, the answer to most of the questions asked on the self assessment form will be "No".  Unless you have some kind of property empire or offshore thing going on, in which case you can afford to hire someone else to do it all for you!

[markepsilon]

Headline in DM 

HMRC announces it will permanently close tax helplines for six months over the summer - and allow 100 customer service staff to work a three-day week

 Will they  have the time to send letters out to ebayers come jan 2025. or will they still be dealing with 2024's taxes

[*vyolla*]

Daily Mail on the ball as usual.

HMRC announced this a few days ago and then did an abrupt u-turn and announced that they wouldn't be closing the self assessment helpline and scaling back after all. 

[theelench]

Says someone who's had at least since 2018 to practice and get all their paper-work and record-keeping right, setting up Govt. Gateway (verification) etc., setting up a personal tax account (more verification) and that's before they even get to the Self-Assessment form.

And who also probably thought long and hard about setting themselves up as a sole trader, the risks v. rewards, before taking a longer look at the practicalities book-keeping, allowable expenses etc etc.  Not someone to whom this is likely to come as a big surprise, not being a regular board user.

Now put yourself in the shoes of a (for example) fifty-something manual worker, not very tech savvy, who can use a mobile and do an ebay listing in an hour or so using one finger and has never had any dealings with HMRC beyond the PAYE system.

You would NOT think it so very, very easy then.  In fact just as so many pensioners, claimants and so many other random people do, you'd probably get a £100 penalty for getting something wrong.  Particularly as most of those who will be involved in this will not have any records or past experience to draw on. 

[litp*records]

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@theelench wrote:

Says someone who's had at least since 2018 to practice and get all their paper-work and record-keeping right, setting up Govt. Gateway (verification) etc., setting up a personal tax account (more verification) and that's before they even get to the Self-Assessment form.

And who also probably thought long and hard about setting themselves up as a sole trader, the risks v. rewards, before taking a longer look at the practicalities book-keeping, allowable expenses etc etc.  Not someone to whom this is likely to come as a big surprise, not being a regular board user.

Now put yourself in the shoes of a (for example) fifty-something manual worker, not very tech savvy, who can use a mobile and do an ebay listing in an hour or so using one finger and has never had any dealings with HMRC beyond the PAYE system.

You would NOT think it so very, very easy then.  In fact just as so many pensioners, claimants and so many other random people do, you'd probably get a £100 penalty for getting something wrong.  Particularly as most of those who will be involved in this will not have any records or past experience to draw on. 

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I never said all that was easy.  What I said was if you are capable of listing 1000s of items on Ebay then you are more than capable of filing a self-assessment tax return.  Navigating Ebay is way more complicated by comparison!

[jackforst]

No issue with the money limit, but the 30 item limit is a joke. I'm currently on benfits due to ill health and was planning to get rid of a lot of my old stuff, while it  will be below the money cap, it will be above the 30 items

[papso22]

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@jackforst wrote:

No issue with the money limit, but the 30 item limit is a joke. I'm currently on benfits due to ill health and was planning to get rid of a lot of my old stuff, while it  will be below the money cap, it will be above the 30 items

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If you are clearly just getting rid of 'old stuff' then the reporting limits won't affect you.

[markepsilon]

Have feeling that these reporting limits will report you ..then you are guilty until proved innocent with the taxman.

Good look with that over the phone,  after waiting for 1 hour for an answer, as there are now no local tax office's.

The way eBay works, it will be immediate account suspension - followed by: prove your items are yours or receipts etc,  then prove your identity with birth certificates , picture ID..Sell your sole.

Some people will declare themselves, self employed , then realise they can’t fathom out how to do tax returns to their advantage, or get the late and inaccurate £100 fines, they employ accountant at £1500 a year, then after  paying eBay’s fees plus the new tax , realise they will have to make plus £40,000 a year to make it even viable.  All this just to get rid of some surplus stuff..

Just means that private sellers will be leaving in droves. 

The knock on effect of this will be more poverty..i would imagine   good percentage private sellers look to eBay as a ways and means of keeping themselves out of dept, paying the HP'S ..car loans ,  Mortgages.  Rents.

This is going to go deeper than you think; i forecast extreme trouble in 2025 for a lot of people.

[markepsilon]

This will also have an effect on the uk economy - peoples spendng power, with trades men and shops will deminish to nothing , jobs will go and there will be an ever decreaseing spiral downwards to nothingness.  this action will be the trigger.

[jckl1957]

An alternative view.

First of all, this is absolutely not a 'new tax'.

Business sellers and traders have always been liable to pay tax on their profits.

Private sellers, selling their own, unwanted personal items have not been taxed on their sales and this will not change.

Most members have already had to prove their identity to Ebay by uploading passport etc.

Ebay is legally obliged to report the sales figures of any seller who sells more than 30 items over the course of the year along with the gross amount of sales.  Small time sellers will, I think, find that they are not subsequently contacted by HMRC.

Over the past two weeks, Ebay have paid me £30.  I pay postage at the Post Office - that has been £11 over the two weeks.  Nett amount left over is £19.  Even if half of that was profit, at 20%, HMRC would be collecting about £1 a week from me.

If private sellers fear a tax bill, then they will still have unwanted personal items and other outlets to sell them.  Whatever your circumstances, a private seller should not be reliant on Ebay sales to make ends meet. 

In my view, nobody should be reliant on Ebay sales to pay their bills, it is not a reliable, sustainable income stream, tax or no tax.  The only members who should expect to make a living from Ebay are those buying items to sell at a profit and trading, in which case they should be declaring their income from selling already.

[markepsilon]

ah, but they have become relient ..that's the problem.

we will see where this leads, it's not going to be good for anyone.

Like i said, the knock on butterfly effect.

[smarterbuyers]

 HMRC's are also  cracking Down on Onlyfans, EStey, Vinted, YouTube Ad Money...

They're sifting through loads of data, but with limited resources, they're relying on software to do the grunt work.

So, expect a letter or text from them soon. They're mainly after the big earners, not bothered much about those making under £1800. If you're one of the small fish, you could argue your earnings are just from selling stuff you don't want anymore, and it's pretty tricky for HMRC to prove otherwise.

Their main aim is to bag as much cash as they can. They'll start with the whales and eventually get around to the rest of us.

But here's the kicker: this system's ripe for abuse. People can easily fake names and addresses to throw HMRC off the scent.

As for me, I've got a full-time gig and this side hustle thing going on but big enough that ive doing seld assesment already.  It's not that hard.  the bills not that big but put me off any more effort 

Loads of folks are thinking of packing it in this year because dealing with HMRC over pennies isn't worth the hassle. Seriously, when you factor in eBay fees and postage, it's hardly worth the effort.

Oh, and don't forget to cough up your taxes.

[*vyolla*]

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@smarterbuyers wrote:

But here's the kicker: this system's ripe for abuse. People can easily fake names and addresses to throw HMRC off the scent.

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I'm pretty sure that HMRC have that covered.

eBay and the other sites will be asking for national insurance numbers. That's something that 100% leads to an individual, no fakery there.

[markepsilon]

That's a worry .. the national inurance number being held by hackable ebay is a hackers dream, they then, once in,  have all they need to have your full ID ... the picture id, your address , your email , your name , bank acount sort code, account number.and passwords

and many are doing all this on an insecure android mobiles that shares data with every app you download.

yop "vyolla" is what they will shout out once in 

[*vyolla*]

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@markepsilon wrote:

the national inurance number being held by hackable ebay is a hackers dream

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Have you known anyone to hack eBay recently and steal users info ?

I'd be more worried about the users and the security of the device(s) they're using. 

[the_book_seekers]

So, expect a letter or text from them soon. 

ebay isn't going to be handing over the information until Jan 2025 and then HMRC will have to go through the data - so sellers have about 9 to 10 months to sort themselves out. The only thing that might happen in the near future is ebay asking for national insurance numbers. 

[markepsilon]

i mentioned devices ..and the last time ebay was hacked ..they didnt tell anyone until months later.

[*vyolla*]

No section of eBay featuring personal, confidential or sensitive information has ever been hacked.

Some Romanian dude got into part of the site way back in the mid 2000's and came onto eBay's forums (known fondly as  Q&A at the time) and pretended to be an eBay 'pink' (employee) for a while. I remember it well. 

[markepsilon]

Well i just asked google 

"when was ebay hacked"

and it's not good reading ..it contradicts what you are saying

all the best.mark