Ebay buyer protection fee? Genius move or own goal?

[darktints]

I've got a lot to unpack about ebays recent performance so please scroll on if long stories bore you.

So I've seen a couple of threads on here about the new buyer protection fees but other than a couple of tiffs between the "die hards" and the "have nots", no one seems to be making much about ebay's strategy in all of this.

Although ebay has a good market share, increased competition from freebie platforms such at Facebook MP, Vinted and other apps clearly had them spooked and coupled by the drop in active users they have expeienced since their peak in 2018, has led to ebay making some radical changes.

So back in October 24, ebay removed selling fees for private sellers which personally I thought was a genius move. Take a short term hit in cash flow to rejuvinate the active user base thus bringing more people back to the platform. After all, the more active users you have, the more opportunity you have to sell them stuff, right?

Now they have just announced the new buyer protection fee system, which I do understand why its here. Afterall, supporting customers who used your service for free is a hard pill to swallow, especially for the finance department who care little about customer base and repeat sales and are more focussed on "did we cover our bills this month"?

Where I come stuck with this new direction is that if you are trying to attract more active users to your platform, adding a surcharge to any purchases they make not from a business account will surely keep these kinds of users on the freebie platforms, thus completely undoing all of ebays good work back in October.

Like it or not, the second hand goods market is highly price motivated and only works when costs are minimal. I believe in the long run, this "robbing Peter to pay Paul" approach will not lead to increased user activity and ebay will become bogged down in the same (albeit very slow) death loop of hemeraging active users.

This obviously has no effect on businesses who sell on ebay (well not in the short or medium term at least) which is where ebay no doubt makes the majority of its money. But buyers who are minded to haggle over a £1 difference on a £3 item will not want to be paying 75p + 4% on top of second hand goods.

With platforms like Amazon offering a more streamlined shopping experience for buyers of new goods, and Facebook and others offering essentially a free shopping platform for used goods, ebay seems to be working its way into an uncomfortable middle ground being the jack of all trades and master of none.

If you got this far, thanks for your time. This is not a rant or a leaving announcment, just my observations.

[dch2112011]

I get where you are coming from but maybe with the fees being hidden in the sellers listing price the impact on buyers will be negligible if any - they see the price they buy ! The seller will pay no fees but may be disgruntled with their price being inflated but then it has always included sellers fees of some sort or other except for the few weeks between canning fees and introducing fees !

As for simple delivery - no fees on the charges and purely designed for an army of private sellers selling odd unwanted items with out the need for scales or measures  in dare I say it a very easy and simple way.

It is upsetting the stalwart of volume  even over time sellers who although private sellers have morphed into an inbetween land between business full on and a guy wanting to sell an unwanted, gathering dust fishing reel who is only selling it because it is easy on ebay and otherwise would leave it in the shed for another 20 years or so !

[magpiecorner1]

I'm wondering myself.

Three months, and over Christmas, is a very very short period to assess the consequences of removing private seller fees.  In fact it was less than two months before the first shot across the bows re buyer protection fees. 

Madness, you'd think?

We, they do have more than 18 months of information re free private fees on eBay.de, including that there was a influx of new sellers, and that buyers who also were private sellers bought significantly more the buyers who did not sell in the platform.

I wonder if the plan is to emulate the .de site further by announcing private sellers will get another 2500 auction listings a month, for items starting at 99p?

I'm not seeing any statements that .de will be introducing a buyer protection charge for buyers, so perhaps the UK site is the test tube baby this time.

Makes sense, in a very odd weird way, a return to the old days when auctions were fun, pushing everyone to tracked postage - the final price is still completely in the hands of the buyer.  Tracked postage would be an income (delivery price determined by eBay) and presumably eBay can very quickly side with the buyer if goods go missing as sellers can chase couriers.  Income from buyer fees, which probably amount to the same fees as before, more if more items are sold.  

And most importantly, lots of new buyers to the site, who - eBay hopes - will hang around and buy from business sellers.

Well, if that's not their genius plan,  it should be!

[manyjamjar]

Ebay became bogged down when they broke the search function.

[darktints]

I'm not so sure.

There is indeed people that sell the odd thing here or there but really only sell once in a blue moon. Since ebay removed the selling fees though, I made quite the little hobby selling various objects that the family don't need anymore such as old tech and clothes and some old stuff I used to collect but am now moving on. I wouldn't describe my sales as business as its all my own junk that I'm flogging on here (I'm not a flipper bro raiding charity shops at every opportunity) and ebay has allowed me to sell on a fair few items that would have sat on FB market place for a few months before shifting.

These items are mostly low value and I reguarly get people haggling with me to lower prices on items that are already selling very low. the past few months have even allowed me to send on items for just the cost of shipping to avoid them ending up in landfill (environment win).

Sales such as these will undoubtably take a hit as private sellers will see listings taking much longer to convert into sales. Ebay saying they are going to make postage simpler (not like its difficult at the moment) is just them trying to muscle in on Pack-link type businesses but low value items won't sell if they have premium tracking services attached to them.

Anyway this is all conjecture at the moment and without knowing how the market reacts, we will just have keep an eye on the active user base to see if exsisting trends continue.

[darktints]

What you descibe is probably mostly what they are going for. But being a market that is led by consumer demand (as all markets are), private sellers flogging off their old stuff that now has a buyers premium attached to it and potentially premium postage too will turn off these buyers.

Sales of second hand stuff are entirely price led and taxing the very users you were trying to encourage back to or on to your platform seems like a dicey gamble to me.

[a45heaven]

A curious question - do you want the Buyer  Protection Fee to succeed ?

Last year the covert Regulatory Fee was introduced to cover exactly what?  No answer to that question from ebay.

If the Buyer Protection fee has a positive impact i would be greatly surprised to say the least.

From a Buyer simply having a vague knowledge about customer buying rights, to having to pay for the pleasure- do you not think it will open a flood gate of claims on all sellers by buyers?

Remember apart from delivery (although maybe the question of confirming dispatch only should have been more strongly fought by sellers in the past), the protection is against ebay's established rules imposed on sellers.

But if it goes unquestioned, what comes next on ebays greed trail?

[1956glyn]

The way its going i think that private sellers will just be better off selling rare or collectible items and not cheaper products.      I know bargains are already rare on the site but i honestly believe they will disappear totally.  I can see the general household and clothing categories being hit the hardest.

[darktints]

My personal feeling is that the buyer protection fees are not a good idea. Business sellers will be patting eachother on the back that they will now feel they can compete with private sellers now but I think it is very short sighted view. The aim is to increase active user base (ebay plainly stated this in their October 24 announcment) which in turn would benefit business accounts. 

Ebay needs to get better at managing who is a business and who is a pivate seller but that is seperate conversation.

[1956glyn]

Well we still have a mountain of inherited items we could list.....but at the minute i am just sitting on the fence to see what exactly is going to happen on the site in the near future.    

[a45heaven]

I know one business seller who thinks its a terrible idea - this is going to impact negatively on business and private sellers, not to the same degree maybe, The true private sellers can just give their stuff to charity shops, rather than all the effort involved in jumping thru ebay hoops, only not get get paid out fully or in a timely manner.

How is the buyer protection going to work on items bought from China i wonder?

[1956glyn]

We have given a lot to charity shops but i do have a huge issue a lot of the time about how they are run.

We have loads of really expensive items........none of which will be given to any charity shop.

[a45heaven]

Sorry , my comments were directed at the 'newly lured flock' of private sellers which ebay targeted, with much despair from these boards, last October  as ebay lowered their competition from the 'River' to the Charity shops.

I understand what you mean on the structure of some of the Charities , i echo that too.

@1956glyn 

[lucy_farmer]

'They do have more than 18 months of information re free private fees on eBay.de, including that there was a influx of new sellers, and that buyers who also were private sellers bought significantly more the buyers who did not sell in the platform.'

Ah.... this might help explain my main puzzlement with the whole 'new rules' stuff coming up.

Way back in one of these huge threads a very 'business-speak literate' poster had been through loads of biz bullsh**  and discovered that 'private sellers who also buy' were among ebay's most valued customers.

This was a bit odd when the 'new rules and Simple Delivery' seem to be pushing lots of private sellers away.

Why scare off your 'valuable' customers?

Perhaps ebay are hoping to attract way more *new* private-selling customers (who won't know how ebay *used* to be run, so won't miss it..) than those who can't deal with the changes and will leave?

(seems a bit of a risky strategy with so many other platforms to choose from nowadays, but I 'spose ebay have to try something.)

'I wonder if the plan is to emulate the .de site further by announcing private sellers will get another 2500 auction listings a month, for items starting at 99p?'

2500 listings? per month??

  I think that's pushing the boundaries of being a 'private seller'. I know some people have enormous collections of coins/stamps /records etc but good collectable things are usually worth more than 99p. (auctions really don't tend to go above the starting price these days).

If you've got 2500 things that you're happy to put the effort into selling at 99p a go, in one month, you'd need to put in 'business-level 'of work time to get it done...

[dch2112011]

I suppose it depends on whether the 2500 figure covers relisting and at what interval -  most auctions appear not to sell and are constantly being listed - Members regularly using auctions  would be able to offer a better insight into that statement.

Maybe ebay should limit the number of new listings and a relisting limit ?  This is pretty much what they are doing with the supposed 300 limit ?

[lucy_farmer]

edited because I totally messed that up....😒

(twit, engage brain before operating keyboard..)

[moldosgifts]

So i am a business and i see some merit in your auctions point/

So i get 600 included (NOT FREE) auction with my business per month, that 4 cycles of 150

99% don't sell so go into the next cycle so you are somewhat correct

[1956glyn]

Awww i get brain fog often lol

At the minute i really do not know what to do......list on 5 day auctions now before the new rules come in or do nothing and wait and see how this all pans out over the coming weeks?     As said i have a mountain of items i could list.  its all over the house 😞

[lucy_farmer]

'......or do nothing and wait and see how this all pans out over the coming weeks?    '

I'm voting for 'wait and see'.

I know that's a little un-gallant to wait for the problems to arrive at this board and see how they pan out before jumping in or out, but  I'm definitely a bit of a coward  😨  😁

[1956glyn]

ok......... could well be Plan B then try and help hubby redecorate a couple of rooms 🙂