Buyer claims camera wasn't sent (it was) and wants a return & refund

[temjinmkii]

Hello.

This feels like a scam, and I'm not sure what to do.

Sold an expensive £400 camera on EBAY and sent it to the buyer. Buyer has just received the package and claims there was only a charging cable in the box, took a photo of said cable and opened a return / refund request claiming that no camera was included.

Don't know what else to say other than the camera was in the box and sent.

I have three days to respond to the return request. What should I do?

[tressygirl]

Appeal the decision for the refund.

Contact eBay Customer Services, explain all items were in the box, buyer is abusing eBay's 30 day MBG, Money back Guarantee policy to gain a refund,  and keep that expensive camera,  you never know they may have tried / done this before.

Now , there's no guarantee how this will end , hopefully in your favour, as eBay do not see what was sent or what was received, but it's in their hands to decide on the outcome.

Should the decision go against you, you may need to take legal advice  later, as it is an expensive item, a small court claim perhaps,  to see if money can be retrieved that way.  Fingers crossed eBay will find in your favour.

You may also wish to wait for tomorrow morning , if you're defintiely still within that 3 day period,  and contact Customer Services when the lines first open at 8 a.m. as there's more chance of Dublin answering.

The easiest and quickest way to contact Customer Services is through this link, for a Call Back .

https://www.ebay.co.uk/help/eua?id=5275&mkevt=1&mkpid

On weekdays lines open between 8 a.m. and 10 p.m. - 6 p.m.

Weekends lines open between 9 a.m. to 6p.m.

Good Luck !

@temjinmkii 

[temjinmkii]

Thank you. That advice is appreciated.

[myriad*seller]

To add to this, you will need to make a report to Action Fraud as well, and they will provide you with a crime number to add to the case. 

Your chances of success via eBay are not good, I'm afraid

I would mention to the buyer that you are making an Action Fraud report to the Police, and that the courier will be conducting a fraud investigation to find out what happene to the camera, and that the weight of the parcel proves the camera was in it when posted. Tell them the police or the courier may wish to take a statement from them about the missing camera. Give the buyer the Crime reference number too. Then ask them to go and check inside the packaging again in case they "missed the camera" when looking in the parcel... (gives them an out, "oh yes I have just found it") 

You might find the buyer closes the case.....

[temjinmkii]

Thank you. I'm making a report to Action Fraud now.

[ile136yz]

This is from an experience I had.  

As the Buyer had opened an eBay case for 'Item not as described' as parts were missing from the package, I refunded the Buyer  in Full within the 3 days period.

I put a claim into the Royal Mail & they came back to me saying that the person at the address the item was delivered to had made many claims themselves for non-delivery and items missing from parcels in the  previous two years.

The RM refunded me in full & said they would be taken the Legal Route to stop this problem occurring again at the address.

I Blocked the eBayer & moved on.

[4_bathrooms]

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@temjinmkii wrote:

I have three days to respond to the return request. What should I do?

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You don't really have any choice but to send a return label; if you do anything else the buyer can escalate on the third day and will receive a full refund and will be told they don't need to return anything. Here's what you need to do in order:

1. Send a suitable return label via the case if eBay hasn't done so already
2. When you receive the return delivery check the contents of the package. If you receive anything other than what you sent proceed to #3. If you happen to receive back exactly what you sent simply refund.
3. File a report with Action Fraud providing as much information as you can such as the item's serial number, the buyer's details, the carrier's tracking number etc.
4. At the bottom of the case there will be a link that states "Report a problem". Click on that link and select "Returned a different item" or whatever option matches the situation best.
5. In this report you must provide the reference number from Action Fraud and a copy of their report if they gave you one in #3. 

Which carrier (i.e. Royal Mail, Evri, Yodel etc.) did you use? And was the value under £450?

[lens-sage]

As others have said, definitely report to action fraud and get a crime reference number, in my experience, this will greatly increase your chances of winning an appeal.

Grant the return, but feel free to mention you are reporting it to action fraud, as long as you don't word it in a malicious way. This is sometimes enough to make them think twice.

[temjinmkii]

Royal Mail. The value of the auction was £470.00.

The item was sent via Special Delivery Guaranteed by 1pm on the understanding the compensation cover was up to £750.

[temjinmkii]

Thank you to everyone who has replied.

So far I have:

- Spoken directly to EBAY customer services, and they said they'll be investigating the buyer

- Obtained a crime reference number from Action Fraud

The only thing I don't know is what to do in the three-day period. Ebay suggested doing nothing, but obviously replies here have said grant the return.

[m25jet]

If you have already reported the buyer to Action Fraud give the number to eBay if you haven't done so already so that they can check it out.  Personally I wouldn't advise refunding the buyer, as that's basically like saying that you're the one in the wrong, even though you know that the buyer is trying to scam you.

If eBay do decide to force a refund and they close the case in the buyer's favour make damn sure that you appeal the decision, ensuring that you've given them the Action Fraud number so that eBay are aware that the buyer has been abusing the eBay Money Back Guarantee.  (If appealing the decision give eBay the Action Fraud number again, even if you've already done so - they sometimes need to be reminded.)  Should eBay then decide to overturn the original decision your money will be refunded from eBay's own coffers, so you won't lose out financially in the event that you win the appeal against the automatic refund given to the scammer.

Finally, if you have not already done so by the time you read this response, add the scammer's User ID to your Blocked Bidders List so that he/she cannot purchase anything else from you in the future and cause you any further problems.

[4_bathrooms]

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@temjinmkii wrote:

- Spoken directly to EBAY customer services, and they said they'll be investigating the buyer...

...The only thing I don't know is what to do in the three-day period. Ebay suggested doing nothing

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Sellers should never believe anything an eBay customer service representative tells them.

eBay's return process is automated; the "Report a problem" link is key in cases like this. You can't use that link and select the correct reason until the return tracking shows the item has been delivered back to you. Sending the return label prevents the buyer winning the case by default and provides an easier route to preventing a loss than trying to appeal an eBay decision does.

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[temjinmkii]

Hello. Just an update, I took the advice of contacting eBay at 8am and managed to get someone in Ireland. The agent was really polite and helpful. She confirmed the best course of action was to initate the return (as others have said here) and then when the box turns up, without a camera, then to esscalate and report the issue.

I don't think I'll be selling on eBay again. I've had my account for 15 years, and although I've never sold much, I just didn't realise how dangerous and prone to scams it has become (you folks have been wonderful though!).

[rare_treat]

Did they weigh it at the post office? If so, before you open the return item, take a photo of it on a scale. (If you can be bothered, back to the same post office). That should show a weight discrepancy, and add proof to your claim that you actually sent the camera.

[4_bathrooms]

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@temjinmkii wrote:

She confirmed the best course of action was to initate the return (as others have said here) and then when the box turns up, without a camera, then to esscalate and report the issue.

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That isn't quite correct. The case will have a link that states "Ask us to step in" (or something similar). Do not click that link - all it does is effectively accelerate the automated returns process. In your case as the return tracking will show you have received the returned package it will almost certainly result in a refund being issued to the buyer and a dreaded "Case closed without seller resolution" defect being recorded against your account.

Upon receipt of the return package you must click the "Report a problem" link. This stops the automated process by opening a new case; provision of an Action Fraud reference number in the report should mean that eBay won't hold you liable for refunding the buyer.

[temjinmkii]

Thank you. Understood.

[4_bathrooms]

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@rare_treat wrote:

Did they weigh it at the post office? If so, before you open the return item, take a photo of it on a scale. (If you can be bothered, back to the same post office). That should show a weight discrepancy, and add proof to your claim that you actually sent the camera.

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It would only prove the weight of the package that was sent which can be confirmed with the "Certificate of Postage" received from the PO counter. However, it doesn't prove the weight of the package received by the buyer as posties don't weigh items before delivering them.

eBay has obligations to protect it's users against fraud as they are registered with the Financial Conduct Authority. Provision of an Action Fraud reference number is proof the user is at risk of becoming (or has been) a victim of fraud which is why I believe an AF reference number is always key in cases like this.

[kath3735_wxmjn]

Have you still got the reciept from the PO which shows the weight?  As they have claimed that there was only a charger then the weight of the box posted should help your case against either the buyer or RM.   Must admit after the past few years of reading these columns i would never sell a high price item via e bay (or buy one for that matter).  If one of my items goes missing in the post i just suck it up to experience but i would be crying in my wine if it happened for a lot of money

[rare_treat]

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@4_bathrooms wrote:

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It would only prove the weight of the package that was sent which can be confirmed with the "Certificate of Postage" received from the PO counter. However, it doesn't prove the weight of the package received by the buyer as posties don't weigh items before delivering them.

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That’s why I said about them (the seller) taking a photo showing the weight of the return item, before it is opened. It isn’t hard proof, but it’s something extra. Then, either the buyer is lying, or RM somehow let the camera be removed before it got to the buyer. Those are the only real explanations left after. (The buyer could later claim they received a block of wood in the parcel, for example, and that makes up the weight. But then it would look strange that they never mentioned that oddity originally.) Either way, not the seller’s fault.

[4_bathrooms]

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@rare_treat wrote:

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Either way, not the seller’s fault.

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The point is none of it will make any difference to eBay. Supplying videos of packages being opened, sealed or weighed or a Certificate of Postage showing the weight will not stop eBay ultimately holding the seller responsible and refunding the buyer from the seller's funds under the Money Back Guarantee protection the buyer is afforded. The only proven way to stop eBay punishing the seller and holding them financially responsible for refunding the buyer in cases like these is the provision of an Action Fraud reference number. That way it doesn't matter whether it is theft by the buyer or Royal Mail - the seller doesn't lose the item and their money nor do they receive a damaging defect recorded against their account.