The Linux Distro Thread (maybe)

Thought I'd start this one off, rather than continue on another thread.

As a quick catch up for others:

Have a look at Unetbootin, as a means to try out different versions of Linux, without producing numerous coasters (unwanted CDs).
I haven't tried the method of installing to hard drive, only the USB flash drive method (so far).



(c) E Jonsen
Just skimming the surface

Opinions/guidance expressed are intended to benefit the reader (mostly) but no responsibility should be assumed for the accuracy and no warranty is implied/expressed or given - so eBay may pull this post
Demised responsibility
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Re: The Linux Distro Thread (maybe)

OE, I have a box full of PCMCIA network cards, if you want to try a different brand PM me your address and I'll put a couple in the post.

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post 1,110


Got rid of the Unity thing, quite easy - When you know how - Type login in search and under Apps (Has a spanner) - at  the bottom you can select Classic as default Session.


Well if you do that, there is no option to go back to 'Unity' the next time you login.

I tried getting rid on this re-install and found a way to restore back to Unity.

From a terminal window type unity --reset

It does not finish cleanly, but if you logout and then back in, all is restored.

I am not gonna try it twice mind.  😄

Good grief, me cursor has gorrrrn in the eBay editor!!!

Oxie...

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Stet the above Post



Looking at Compiz - Will have a Play....



Oxie...

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Thanks very much for the kind offer, g-c. I'll hold off for a bit - I believe that closer watching of the start-up might yield clues.



The Xircom driver appears to be included in the Debian base install - the problem is more likely that it's simply not  detecting the necessary hardware. I briefly spotted some error message (fatal) about PCI - so I'll have another look when I'm feeling patient and a little clearer-headed. (Hangover. It takes so depressingly little to cause the *****rs now.)



A similar problem arose with TinyCore on an even older machine, a Toshiba 430 with 48MB RAM and a mighty 120MHz CPU. Using exactly the same card as worked with TinyCore on the Toshiba 320 - nothing.



It could also be CPU-related, perhaps - the dreaded CMOV error which afflicts modern kernels trying to run on old MMX processors (the 320) - not sure about the even older Pentium on the 430.



Slightly awestruck with oxie's progress - great work, that man.



I've not played much with Compiz. It really seems to need better graphic cards than my old heaps possess.



And indadvertently wobbling the windows is not a good idea if one has a self-inclicted headache. 'Tho it is childish fun grabbing a wobbly window by the corner and shaking it up and down.



After owning up a couple of  months ago to never using the multiple work spaces available in most distros, I decided to give it a try. Talk about addictive, 'tho again a reasonably powerful machine benefits more from being able to keep so much open.



I found a recent session on an XP machine downright irritating. Lots and lots of little labels on the task bar, and far too much like hard work finding exactly what I needed at any given moment.



So much easier to have a browser open in one space, a letter being written on a second, together with the directories from which I need to attach photos and things to the letter, and VirtualBox in a third space.



A boon for the naturally untidy - my personal filing-system would be referred to in non-bachelor households as "the floor" - and amazing that the world's most popular system lacks it. Perhaps it has it, and I just haven't found it.



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I was going to take my hangover to bed early.



I decided to just try a couple of things out first.



Silly me.



First thing was trying to add noatime to the EeePC's /etc/fstab.



Took me two and a half hours to get it bootable again. Must look at that more closely As usual, my incompetence with the command line and with editing system files let me down.



Instructions found on forums invariably assume a certain degree of knowledge. If I figure out just how I broke the system, I'll come back and tell.



What a mission just to get at fstab and delete my changes. Mutter, mutter.



More encouraging (so far) is a bit of an experiment on my main workhorse, an ancient Dell GX260.



No amount of fiddling with drivers and router settings has enabled web pages to load easily (wireless - not too bad with an ethernet cable,)



Wondering whether slow writing of temporary files to disk might have anything to do with it, I edited fstab (gulp - this was before the EeePC fiasco) - along the lines of tmpfs /tmp tmpfs defaults,relatime,mode=1777 0 0 (must look at that more closely - the clearest example I could find to copy actually had noatime for SSDs - relatime was a for-the-time-being guess - have an idea Ext4 defaults to it, anyway). Rebooted.



The idea is to shift the /tmp file into RAM. Since the machine rarely uses more than about 1.2GiB of 2.0GiB RAM, and usually less, it seems worth a try.



Then went into Firefox, did about:config. couldn't find the bit I'd read about, read again and found I had to right-click on empy space and create a new string value browser.cache.disk.parent_directory and set its value to /tmp.



The Cunning Plan is to make Firefox write its temporary files to RAM rather than disc. I think.



So far, pages seem to be loading faster. More significantly, pages like that wretched ebaystatic now seem to actually finish loading much of the time.



Coincidence? Could just be the router/Plusnet having a good day.



But if it's sorted out a major page-loading problem, I'll be most pleased.



Probably a good thing I clear cookies and cache and everything on shutdown anyway - guess it'll all evaporate now.



And bang goes another early night. Plaguey computers. Time to sleep til lunch, I think - then a siesta or bork the poor EeePC again try to get noatime working on the Eee. Or give oxie's ideas on the Rescue the Board thread (amazed you found it, oxie - I'm now "watching" it) due and fully awake attention, before stepping away from the computers in desperate quest of a life.

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Re: The Linux Distro Thread (maybe)

So far, so good.



There's been a significant improvement in the desktop's page loading as a result of shifting tmp files to RAM - at least I think the stuff described in my last post achieved this - and by telling Firefox to shift its cache into /tmp - ie, into RAM.



Subjectively, I believe that pages are loading faster. What is certain, so far, is that fewer are failing to load completely - something which drives me batty on sites like the BBC and, of course, this one. Not 100% cured, but much. much better.



As for the EeePC, I've only bricked the poor thing once so far today.



Forums all make editing fstab look so simple, but simply leaving out a space prevents the computer booting. However, I think it's now got noatime built into fstab.



Just in case anyone else ends up in a similar mess after editing fstab, this is what seemed to work for me (Xubuntu 10.04, but the most helpful instructions I found were on a Fedora forum - so probably fairly general.)



The initial symptom was a brief warning about a non-valid something or other (Unrecognised Mount Option? too fast for me to read,) followed by a black screen giving the option to press S to stop mounting, or M for a manual recovery.



Pressing M presents one with a minimal CLI, apparently already running as root. I could get at fstab:



sudo nano /etc/fstab



("nano" seems to be the editor used in the command line interface - I think). Trouble is, whilst it was easy to read fstab, it remained stubbornly read-only.



The solution involved a live flash drive. I'd rather naively thought that running a live session would allow me to get at system files and change them. Goodness, but I was wrong.



Trying three different distros, I was unable to mount the drive concerned (/dev/sda1, as it happens.)



What eventually worked was this - should anyone have the same problems getting into a bricked system.



Run a live CD/flash drive.



Open a terminal - if appropriate (PCLOS, I think), as root.



Then do:



sudo mkdir /mnt/temp The temp could be "temp" or "disk 1" or whatever you like - simply creating a mountpoint for the offending drive. Just use whatever name you used throughout the process.



sudo mount -t ext4 /dev/sda1 /mnt/temp It seems that it needs all this information - the file system type, the drive, the location and name of the mountpoint created in the first step.



sudo nano /mnt/temp/etc/fstab directed the live distro/terminal session, via the mountpoint created in the first step, to the required destination.



(I found I had to use sudo to make it work - that was using a Xubuntu live flash drive.)



fstab now opens, and can be edited. Amazing how fast memory fades - I think that when you finish editing, pressing ctrl-x to exit results in a yes/no query about keeping your changes, actioned by y or n, followed by pressing Enter to retain the changes.



The appropriate part of fstab (an uncommented-out line starting with the affected drive's UUID) was modified from the bit where it mentioned ext4



ext4 noatime,errors=remount-ro 0      1



(Flopped the first time when I left the space between ext4 and noatime out - fortunately it now took me a lot less time to fire up a live session and correct this. Experience is wonderful.)



Once it was working, I added a further line, copied unashamedly from the internet, at the end of fstab:



tmpfs /tmp tmpfs defaults,noatime,mode=1777 0 0



(K.Mandla says that noatime will make nodiratime happen too, and as I believe K.Mandla of the eponymous site to be Awfully Bright, I believe this.)



Following another reboot, and pleasantly surprised when it obediently started, I did the Firefox thing in about:config:



right-click in open space and choose a new string value -



browser.cache.disk.parent_directory and set the value to /tmp.



Seems to be working...



When I'm not actually killing it, I'm most impressed with Xubuntu 10.04. Even with /tmp moved into RAM, its currently using about 160MiB of RAM with Firefox and System Monitor open and idle; the CPU's ambling along at about 10%. That will rise sharply when anything is actually done, of course.



With OpenOffice installed and all updates completed, followed by apt-get clean - an instruction I suspect to be very familiar to EeePC fans - about 2.4GiB of hard drive space has been used. I seem to remember this is about what the default Xandros originally installed on the Eees used.



So - an infuriating evening (should never start a project an hour before bed time), followed by, touch wood, a so-far more relaxed afternoon messing about with Linux.



And two computers with faster- and more completely-loading internet pages to show for it.



What should I break try next, I wonder?


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Re: The Linux Distro Thread (maybe)

Oopsie.



The temp could be "temp" or "disk 1" or whatever you like



disk 1?  I meant disk1, of course. A lethal space.



Now you can see why I get into such trouble with Linux typos.



Off for a little walk. Probably not past the pub, which suffers very strong local gravity.

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OE



Bet neither of you deliberately planned to keep me up late...



Now would we do that!!



I am afraid you lost me on your last two posts - am only a numpty newby on these Distro's you know.



Guess what, I got another one of those Mags - has PCLinuxOS :_|



Well, GC uses it, so that is gonna be next before Mint - given the time - am getting restrictions from OH and another weeks Hol coming up shortly.



Oxie...

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I am afraid you lost me on your last two posts - apologies - I was merely sharing my own confusion.



I find the value of posts like that lies in dimly remembering at a later date that somebody had a similar problem to one currently being experienced, and resolved it - making it worth seeking a solution rather than just reinstalling.



Guess what, I got another one of those Mags - has PCLinuxOS - I'll bet you enjoy that - a nice distro.



These things are subjective. Mint remains my own favourite, but PCLOS definitely does some things better - driver support comes to mind.



Worth looking at the GNOME and KDE versions, too. The latter is generally preferred, I suspect, but I like both the relative familiarity of the GNOME version, and the fact that it seems a little lighter on my older equipment.



KDE seems better supported, though.



The LXDE "mini" version flies.



Have you tried Unetbootin for messing around with different distros? It's available in the Mint repos, so should be easy to add to Ubuntu. Can't remember offhand whether it's non-free - which might necessitate enabling the Medibuntu repository.



Save a few distros on your hard drive, plug in a flash drive, point Unetbootin to the desired distro and in a few minutes you have a bootable flash drive. Seems to run significantly faster than a live CD, among other advantages.



All great fun.


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Fun indeed - Untilll it don't work.



Will have to look seriously at VB - and I don't mean virtual*brunette - although ... Nah, better not.



Oxie...

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Sorry OE - missed the Unetbootin - Just googled - plus not enough time - the witching hour approaches.



Oxie - See Ya

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This may be worth a look OE, for the, er, technologically challenged laptops you specialise in. You may have already looked at it, but I don't fancy wading back.



http://www.bodhilinux.com/system.php



I'm just downloading it myself to try on an old laptop I found buried on a shelf. Will report back.



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Downloading as I write. Thanks for the suggestion -  I think it would be a great Toughbook (the old CF27) candidate. Just need to get a couple of other things out of the way first.



Still very difficult to find anything reasonably modern that will boot from the old Pentium MMX on the Toshiba 320 - usually terminates the boot, grumbling about CMOV.



I must find out how to remaster an iso - wonder whether it would be within my capabilities? If something like bodhilinux (sounds like some sort of a cricket bowler's distro) could be persuaded to function with an earlier kernel, it might also be possible to install it with even less RAM.



A project for another month, perhaps.



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Running it as a livecd at the moment. No problems with the hardware including the S3 graphics on the laptop. Was up very quickly in Laptop/Netbook mode with just a couple of config questions. Fired up Midori and was online immediately.



I may install it once I've had a further play.

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*Sigh*



This kernel requires the following features not present on the CPU: cmov


Unable to boot - please use a kernel appropriate for your CPU.



Time to dig out a more modern machine. Something with - oh - a Pentium III, perhaps.


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:^O

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Just an update on the laptop. I ditched Bodhi in the end, although it ran ok and looked rather pretty, there were a few things I didn't feel happy with. The clincher though was that I just couldn't get the wireless 3-Com PCMCIA card to work - tried everything without success.



I then thought let's go for consistency so tried the LXDE version of PCLinuxOS - had a load of problems even getting the live cd to work until I found the no acpi option. It then ran ok as a live cd and looked pretty good, but the install failed - can't remember why because I was raving and seeing red by then



There then followed a surreal episode which lasted most of yesterday. I don't know why, but I thought I'd try Gentoo. It looked real good the way it was explained on the website - you start with a 100Mb minimum install disk, get the internet working with that and then everything else you need is just downloaded and set up. No! They forgot to say you need to be a 5th level Linux guru and rocket scientist rolled into one. I got as far as the 3 hour kernel compile and quit for the day. I don't mind a bit of command line stuff, but this was extracting the urine.



I came to it fresh this morning, blew a raspberry at Gentoo and remembered that I'd already got an Antix disk somewhere. Half an hour later I'd got a nicely running laptop with a working 3-Com wireless card and it's just doing a load of updates as I write this.

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Trying Gentoo - I'm filled with admiration - I've not had the courage to try it yet. Thanks for the warning - I'd been tempted previously by the website, and was thinking about it...



The lightweight distros do seem more challenging. I guess that's how they remain lightweight - less automation.



AntiX remains a firm favourite of mine for old computers, I must say, and seems to be getting easier to use all the time.



It also offers a choice of kernels, and I found that using the i486 version allowed me to run it on a Toughbook with a 233 MHz MMX. Bizarrely, the Toshiba 320 with a 233MHz MMX still refused to run from it - whinged about the lack of CMOV instruction, again.



If your computer's really ancient, it'd be interesting to know whether the installation survives apt-get dist-upgrade, or suddenly turns into something too modern for the CPU.



Mind you - I somehow suspect I'm the only one here still trying out modern distros on a Toshiba 320.



Tinycore is quite fun, and installed to the antique a couple of weeks ago. I forget what went wrong then...



My current favourites for old and slow machines are AntiX (previously praised to the skies/severely cussed when I've got it wrong) and Xubuntu 10.04, although it seems as tricky as Ubuntu when it comes to trying to find stuff that's not absolutely non-free - even with medibuntu enabled. Never did get Totem to play a DVD - but VLC was easy to install and did the job, so I stopped trying.



My biggest disappointment among the lightweights was Mint Xfce. I suppose running atop Debian Testing makes it suitable for those more expert and patient than me - just could not get it to update. Very fast, though.



Most impressed that someone as sensible as g-c also ended up working himself into the RMOR trying to get a distro working - thought that was just a sign of OCD or something in my own tinkerings.

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Just of general interest, there is a useful laymans guide to Linux disks and partitions here -



http://www.linuxbsdos.com/2011/09/18/guide-to-disks-and-disk-partitions-in-linux/

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Interesting article here on EUFI Secure Booting which indicates that MS may stitch up OEMs to lock the motherboard firmware to their version of W8. Not only would this mean you couldn't run Linux on the PC, but you wouldn't be able to run other Windows versions. There will be workarounds, but they sure are naughty boys at MS.



http://mjg59.dreamwidth.org/#entry-5552

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