Private Sellers continuing to operate as businesses

[reynardnoirrailwayana2015]

Hi all, 

I know there was another thread on this topic closed recently, but as a business seller doing things properly, I am increasingly being undercut by private sellers who are clearly businesses but have not registered as such. One seller I have seen in the same category we mostly operate in has had over 7,000 sales and has sold over 300 items in the last 12 months, and has over 400 items listed. This clearly is not someone who is operating as a business but is registered as a private seller. There are of course endless similar examples of this. 

eBay could easily police this but clearly opts not to, but should we as business sellers be able to report private accounts that are acting as businesses. Or are we all just hoping HMRC take action on these sellers (HMRC being efficient and fast moving seems unlikely).

What action should eBay be taking to protect and encourage business sellers, who seem to be at a massive disadvantage...

[bojangled]

@vintique*violet well you don’t have a shop, you don’t pay for one, no little blue door icon..?

Jo

[vintique*violet]

No I don't it just says shop  by the categories on my page,  - click it and it takes you to my listings...  I have never opened one..... I did not even notice it  was there until someone on here told me  on a thread, but I cannot recall which thread.  It is confusing all these changes. 

[the_book_seekers]

ebay has added to the confusion by basing the page you're talking about on a shop. As a business I have basically the same layout as a shop front with a few differences.  ebay obviously decided to leave the tab with 'shop' for private sellers rather than replace it with something else. They probably couldn't come up with anything suitable. 

[divinedressesdaily]

You don't have to offer all the delivery options on Vinted - you can choose which to offer and which to exclude- many sellers on Vinted don't have all the options located near to them so they only offer the ones that are convenient.

Your daughter can just toggle off the RM delivery option ? She just goes to the profile icon on bottom right of the screen on her Vinted app - click on that - scroll down to settings - click on that - click on Postage and toggle off the Royal Mail Tracked 48 option  

[555njp]

Hi, thanks for the info, yes, she’s just turned it off now.

She doesn’t sell much and probably because the buyer pays and the other options are cheaper, it rarely got selected. Just occasionally it did cause her a few issues.
Thanks again.

[pcmp_caravan_hire]

Ebay claim its to hard to search out sellers with just a private account ! I have been told i have to make this account a business account, as i have sold 1400 items in 10 years on it, the only reason is a have a business account with over 45000 feedbacks so they think this is as well, i have only listed family items etc on the private account, ebay can clearly see i use the business account and not trying to hide stuff away or cheat them out of fees, a simple search within 5 mins i found at least 10 private accounts with transaction ranging from 5000 to 44000 - mmmmmm private, i think i would rather have the fees from someone with that amount of action, rather than 140 items i might list a year! I am in amind to report them, as i am sure they would be affecting a few honest business sellers

[jacobseye]

The problem is how and who do you report them.

[pcmp_caravan_hire]

ive asked them on the chat and on the phone, they just tell me it takes time, they just going the easy route and suspened small private accounts like mine , as i have a business account

[5216elisabeth]

I have a business account and I just had to refund a Next Day postage upgrade on a buyer remorse return.  I didn't see anywhere to remove that bit anyway.  Perhaps I just missed it. I'm still trying to get to grips with a lot of these procedures.

[dan-myers]

You are doing as you told that doesnt necessarily mean you are doing things properly. It is not illegal to sell thing under a private seller account or unethical or whatever else you want to name it. Ebay has requirements before selling as a business seller. You need to sell X amount a month and even though you may be selling brand new items for sale as abusiness, you might not necessarily be selling noung to warrant the upgrade to business account. I dont blame any one for remaing a private seller. They should do what benefits them and from what ive seen its much more viable to sell as a private seller than as a business seller (at least until recntly).

Complaing about private sellers is like the classroom blaming the naughty kid because the whole class got detention when they should be blaming the teacher that decided to punish everyone. You should be directing your blame at ebay for their silly rules, constant detremental changes, and the fact the make it so unappealing to have a business account.

[therenewalworkshopltd]

You really don't have a clue do you about what the difference between a private and a business seller actually is.

It is nothing to do directly with Ebay requirements at all!

It however is everything to do with LEGAL requirements.

ie.  If you are trading and you are not following the relevant laws (such as providing business address etc), then you are trading illegally.  Irrespective of whether or not you pay your taxes.

The moment, you buy something to sell, you are a business.  Nothing to do with Ebay, but everything to do with HMRC  etc.

[555njp]

Not so. 

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@dan-myers wrote:

It is not illegal to sell thing under a private seller account or unethical or whatever else you want to name it.

If it’s in the course of trade (i.e. buying to sell, not selling your own personal belongings) then it is illegal in the UK and has been for a very long time.
You would be in breach of consumer law simply for not displaying name and address. You also have to accept change of mind returns etc. if trading and you buyer needs to know you are a business as their legal rights are stronger.

 Ebay has requirements before selling as a business seller. you need to sell X amount a month and even though you may be selling brand new items for sale as abusiness, you might not necessarily be selling noung to warrant the upgrade to business account.

Incorrect, you can open a business account with zero sales and only one listing. Quantity of sales and profitability are irrelevant in deciding if you are a business or private. It’s about conforming to consumer law if you are buying to sell.

Yes, once you factor in the full cost of trading legally, you may well find to do so does not make business sense. That shouldn’t mean breaking the law though to improve profitability.

 I dont blame any one for remaing a private seller. They should do what benefits them and from what ive seen its much more viable to sell as a private seller than as a business seller (at least until recntly).

…….even though that is against eBay’s policy, breaks the law and could see them banned?

Complaing about private sellers is like the classroom blaming the naughty kid because the whole class got detention when they should be blaming the teacher that decided to punish everyone. You should be directing your blame at ebay for their silly rules, constant detremental changes, and the fact the make it so unappealing to have a business account.

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I agree with your last point. EBay has created the problem and are not policing it properly. 
They should change the fee structure so that both private and business sellers pay roughly the same. This would hopefully then discourage so many from selling illegally.

[the_book_seekers]

Agree with everything you've said and would add for  the information of @dan-myers 

re It is not illegal to sell thing under a private seller account or unethical or whatever else you want to name it.  Businesses on private accounts selling into the EU would be in breach of GPSR. It doesn't apply to private sellers, but does for businesses. 

They should change the fee structure so that both private and business sellers pay roughly the same.

Ebay has lost the balance on the site. I would suggest there should be a slight tilt towards business sellers, not a massive one, but just enough to make business selling favourable and genuine private sellers happy.

[returns_andexdisplay]

I think one way ebay could do something like this is change the fee structure similar to the way tax works. All sellers have a £3000 zero fees limit, then maybe 5% up to a certain amount then after that amount pay the going rate for each category. Not going to happen after the recent changes but would require things like clamping down on multiple accounts. 

One of the biggest things that would help small business is a revamp of shop and listing fees structure as they are no where near competitive compared to the competition.