Swedish Customs Query

[aphystykqa]

Hi, I sold an item to a buyer in Sweden recently and posted it by Royal Mail International Tracked on the 5.1.24, and the item arrived at Swedish Customs on 11.1.24 - and (7 days later) - the parcel is still there today with a message on the postnord(dot)se website saying :- 'Waiting for payment of taxes and duties'.

Now, this is certainly not the first time that I have sent items and they've taken quite a while to clear through customs, but, in this instance, the buyer is an Ebay-newbie with only 2 feedbacks, so I would expect him to be a bit concerned as to why it is still not arrived at his address (13 days later) from when I first sent it.

When this Swedish customs is saying that it is waiting for payment of taxes and duties. Is it because Ebay is being a slow-coach 'as it were' and taking longer than expected to forward on the TAX/VAT which was taken from the buyer during checkout ? As what other reason would it take over 7 days to clear

When I post International parcels using the Royal Mail. I fill in the CN22 form, and I manually write out the IOSS number for Ebay, and also put one of those IOSS stickers on the parcel, and write Ebay on it. This is the way I have done it ever since this new system came along, and have had 100% success so far - even though Ebay would rather 100% of it's customers switch to the Global Shipping Programme (naturally) - but I'm afraid, there is still too many of us who are stickler for tradition, and prefer to just use Royal Mail and the Post Office..

[aphystykqa]

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@tommystrezures wrote:

To clear a couple of things up as I was in somewhat of a rush last night, when I originally posted. On the cash receipt it will have the value of the service eg £15 on one line then under neath it will have RM customs data 0.00. That zero refers to no charge for submitting the data. I attach a copy from our drop and go account to highlight it, but on the paper receipt it shows the same. So the question was does this show on the cash receipt? (which you should have in any event to make any claim against RM so you can prove postage costs)

You mention that the fee to pay is 389kr, which is about £30, eg25%  which would imply that the VAT submission they have missed or has not been correctly submitted this end, and that is why I wanted to know if its this end or their end.

There are odd occasions where a customs authority misses things, however the buyer should pay and this link for the buyer if submitted to ebay should see them reimbursed. 

https://ocswf.ebay.co.uk/mudcwf?deptName=CollectRemitRefund

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Hi, when I visit the post office, I would say that approximately 8-9 times out of 10, the Manager or other Staff member of the post office, just gives me the 'Certificate Of Posting' receipt, which has the Tracking Reference number on, but not the Post Office cash receipt. I always wondered why that was - to be honest ? But by looking through my collection of receipts/certificate of posting's that I have kept hold of, it seems that when it's a parcel sent to a UK address, then I don't get this extra receipt. Generally I just chuck those other receipts away, but I never do this straight away, and fortunately I have found that Post Office receipt which goes along with this particular item I have sold to Sweden, and on there it does say as follows :

(Z) Int Trk  -SP  £14.95
SUBTOTAL        £14.95

VAT SUMMARY 
Rate
(Z) 00.00%     £14.95    (NET) £14.95 (VAT) 0.00 (£14.95)
SUBTOTAL      £14.95    (NET) £14.95 (VAT) 0.00 (£14.95)
(S)= Standard Rate  (Z) = Zero Rate  (E) = Exempt
DG Screen Int1
1      @    0.00                                              0.00
Customs Data
1      @     0.00                                              0.00
TOTAL DUE TO POST OFFICE           £14.95
Cash                 FROM CUSTOMER    £14.95
BALANCE                                                   0.00


So, does this Help ?? Has this proven to yourself and others who've replied in this thread, that the Manager who served me at the Post Office did his job properly, or, is he in error, which has led to this problem in Sweden's customs ?

As for the IOSS number of  IOSS - IM2760000742 which I manually write on the CN22 form, and also write it on the IOSS small rectangular sticker along with the word EBAY. Well, the manager of the Post Office may have typed out that number incorrectly on his computer, which could be the reason for this problem, as like people have said in here, that it has to be done electronically (which I assume) shall be where the Manager does that on the computer he uses - as how else would he acheive that task ?

To be honest, you would think by now that postal and customs departments in other countries would have a Plan B system - if something like this happens. In fact, it shouldn't be difficult for them to know the IOSS - IM2760000742 number anyway. Ebay is hardly some obscure marketplace site, is it. They should know the number off-by-heart, considering how much business takes place between sellers on Ebay and buyers in Sweden

[aphystykqa]

Just to update - when I started this post, I had one extra Ebay feedback rating than I have today, as a certain 'grumpy' Swedish buyer with only 2 feedbacks thinks that I am somehow responsible for him having to now pay TAX/VAT 'twice' - because Postnord in Sweden is simply too incompetent of a company and can't even manage a plain and simple Ebay transaction which 'all' other Postal companies in the world 'Can' manage successfully. Yes, along comes a Negative Feedback for myself who writes :- "We have problem With Import VAT/taxes EBay and Postnord have no connection I have to pay twice for this item Bad for me Hood for WHO ?"

I guess Sweden the country and all it's 100% of buyers shall now be added to my Boycott list. As like they say, 'Fool me once, Shame on you, Fool me twice, Shame on me' - well I can see by 'certain' comments in this so-labelled Ebay Help Community are pretty much telling me that unless I use Royal Mail Click-And-Collect, or Global Shipping Programme, then what happened with this transaction, could happen again and again and again, as incomentancy shall naturally continue to run-rivers (at least in terms of transactions to Sweden). I could say that Ebay should 'Warn' sellers about this, but hey, I won't hold my breath..

One more thing to note, is, that not only did I handle the transaction properly throughout, but I kept the buyer informed through Ebay messenger, and was both helpful and pleasant as I could be, and I contacted Postnord, and got no reply from them whatsoever, even when I presented evidence. I guess they have 'Robots' or is it 'Artificial Intellegence' running things over there, who 'obviously' lack the human-touch

[tommystrezures · Accepted solution]

Its a pain when this happens we have had it before too (not with Sweden I may add). I never replied to your post 21, so my apologies, but the customs data is showing correctly on the receipt, which means it would have been submitted.

On an aside with the buyer should be able to prove to Postnord that they have already paid the VAT from the receipts from your goodself/ebay, which inturn should ultimately release the goods. (I don't know its a suggestion). If they do pay then there is recourse for them to get a refund, and whilst its a pain in the preverbial it is and can be done. 

There are a couple of further things, if the buyer does refuse to pay the vat then they will invalidate the ebay 30day MBG. and thus if they open a case for an item not received for example, you should win that. There is obviously a moral side that once the item is returned to you that you should refund.

Finally I think you may have grounds to have the feedback removed as it states ebay in the wording. This would be under the feedback misuse policy, and if you speak with CS then you need to remind them of this. DOn't do the automated route, its run by AI and its not intelligent enough to deal with this matter.

[aphystykqa]

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@tommystrezures wrote:

Its a pain when this happens we have had it before too (not with Sweden I may add). I never replied to your post 21, so my apologies, but the customs data is showing correctly on the receipt, which means it would have been submitted.

On an aside with the buyer should be able to prove to Postnord that they have already paid the VAT from the receipts from your goodself/ebay, which inturn should ultimately release the goods. (I don't know its a suggestion). If they do pay then there is recourse for them to get a refund, and whilst its a pain in the preverbial it is and can be done. 

There are a couple of further things, if the buyer does refuse to pay the vat then they will invalidate the ebay 30day MBG. and thus if they open a case for an item not received for example, you should win that. There is obviously a moral side that once the item is returned to you that you should refund.

Finally I think you may have grounds to have the feedback removed as it states ebay in the wording. This would be under the feedback misuse policy, and if you speak with CS then you need to remind them of this. DOn't do the automated route, its run by AI and its not intelligent enough to deal with this matter.

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Thanks for your message and all assistance you have offered, it's appreciated 🙂

Of course I am very upset, but moreso from the 2-feedback buyer, who should NEVER had given me a Negative, when this extra-Tax/VAT he has incurred and chosen to pay - is of no fault to myself (as we 'both' agree upon) - this incompentence is all down to Postnord. For all we know, there could be some form of 'corruption' taking place between one-or-more staff members working at Postnord who is 'stealing' additional VAT/TAX monies in some Scam operation. It's not that difficult to send 'separate' e-mails to people awaiting parcels, and give them some bogus account to send monies to, which don't end up in the HMRC's pockets, but instead end up in 'their-own' pockets - as after all, once they have the parcels in their possession, they can easily hold them back and do as they please. Even the buyer himself could be involved in this Scam. But anyway, whether it is 'genuine' or a 'scam', I am very annoyed.

The thing is, that I typed in the tracking number of the parcel into both The Royal Mail and Postnord, and it's still showing up that it has not yet arrived at his address ?? Of course, they only released the parcel from customs on the 19th January 2024, so there was that 'dreaded-weekend' approaching, so I expected it would take 1 or 2 extra days to arrive (perhaps longer) - but the 2-feedback buyer couldn't even wait, and just dived straight in with the NEGATIVE, and had his rant. To be honest, he could have just done nothing, and refused to pay. So after all, it was HIS choice to pay again. Even his feedback comments he gave sounded like he had paid 'Double' for the price of the item and the tax/vat, which is untrue.

Yes, I shall take your advice and try and get the Negative removed, as it was totally unjustified! But, will this happen again and again with parcels sent abroad ?? Has something changed within the International Postage system whereby the 'only' system left, is using the Electronic Alternatives of Royal Mail Click and Collect and Global Shipping Programme ? Are they phasing out manual-system Royal Mail, and simply not told us all. As let's face it, if this happened to Me, then there could be hundreds, thousands of others also in the same situation, and no-doubt quite a few shall be coming here into Ebay Community with their Rants about it. This really is no good. Even Postnord never even replied to my e-mail, which was another Red-Flag in my view, which is why I smelt a possible Scam was at play

[vabn2012]

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@aphystykqa wrote:
this incompentence is all down to Postnord. For all we know, there could be some form of 'corruption' taking place between one-or-more staff members working at Postnord who is 'stealing' additional VAT/TAX monies in some Scam operation.

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I can tell you this much: it's not a scam on Postnord's part. They simply need electronic proof that VAT has already been paid, and for some reason physical evidence (i.e. shipping label) is not sufficient for them. Unfortunately this seems to be a common issue. As a Swedish buyer who hasn't used ebay.co.uk since before Brexit and has now spent days googling the IOSS issue before placing an order to ensure everything goes smoothly, this situation is incredibly frustrating. 

Imo the fault lies with ebay, who it seems haven't 1: informed sellers about the new system, and 2: provided sellers with an easy way to comply with the regulations.  Since I'm not a seller I don't know how ebay handles buying postage and printing labels - it seems it might be different depending on which mail carrier you use, or as in your case when the seller isn't the one inputting the electronic information? I don't understand how ebay expects sellers to be able to get it right, and as a buyer there's very little I can do to help them.

According to other buyers with the same problem, ebay will refund the extra VAT (although not Postnord's service fee) if you contact ebay with proof you've paid twice (a receipt or similar), so that's what your buyer should do.

[aphystykqa]

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@vabn2012 wrote:

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@aphystykqa wrote:
this incompentence is all down to Postnord. For all we know, there could be some form of 'corruption' taking place between one-or-more staff members working at Postnord who is 'stealing' additional VAT/TAX monies in some Scam operation.

---

I can tell you this much: it's not a scam on Postnord's part. They simply need electronic proof that VAT has already been paid, and for some reason physical evidence (i.e. shipping label) is not sufficient for them. Unfortunately this seems to be a common issue. As a Swedish buyer who hasn't used ebay.co.uk since before Brexit and has now spent days googling the IOSS issue before placing an order to ensure everything goes smoothly, this situation is incredibly frustrating. 

Imo the fault lies with ebay, who it seems haven't 1: informed sellers about the new system, and 2: provided sellers with an easy way to comply with the regulations.  Since I'm not a seller I don't know how ebay handles buying postage and printing labels - it seems it might be different depending on which mail carrier you use, or as in your case when the seller isn't the one inputting the electronic information? I don't understand how ebay expects sellers to be able to get it right, and as a buyer there's very little I can do to help them.

According to other buyers with the same problem, ebay will refund the extra VAT (although not Postnord's service fee) if you contact ebay with proof you've paid twice (a receipt or similar), so that's what your buyer should do.

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When Ebay suddenly took the decision several years ago to set GSP as a default system for sellers to use, and we the sellers had to make a speedy decision to choose to opt out of it, and there was only a certain timeframe for us to do this, and fortunately I was one of those who chose to opt out, as I just simply like using the Post Office in the regular way. But, there was quite a 'heated' debate about here in the Ebay Community forum concerning this issue, and I was one of 'many' in here having my general rant about it. Of course, there was different sides being taken in the debate, over the Pro's and the Con's, and quite a few trying to convince sellers to choose GSP (Global Shipping Programme) simply because it is an electronic system, which guarantees that issues like I have experience simply can't happen.

But, I can wholeheartedly say, that I have 'Never' had any issues with sticking with The Royal Mail at the Post Office before, so this is the very first time I have had this issue. Who's fault it is really doesn't matter to me - between Ebay and Postnord. The fact remains that the buyer is unhappy, I am unhappy, and I got some unjustifed Negative feedback given to me, for something which is completely out of my control. So, where at the end - you say about what the buyer should do. Well, in light of the Negative, I really don't care what he does. 

I'm going to block 100% of all Swedish buyers from buying any of my items, and just carry on with the regular Royal Mail Post Office system, and see how it goes. If this is repeated by 'Other' Postal companies, then obviously there has been some recent change, and like you say, 'incompetancies' within Ebay itself must surely be the explanation for things suddenly going wrong. Of course, if this incompentancy is the case. Then they'll be Hundreds of Thousands (possibly) MILLIONS of complaints from both buyers and sellers worldwide. Well, that is something Ebay shall have to deal with. If it is 'Them' who created this 'recent' problem in the first place.

I have read in the newspapers today, an article which says - Online services at some Swedish government agencies and shops have been disrupted in a ransomware attack believed to have been carried out by a Russian hacker group - not sure if 'that' could have a part to play in what happened with Postnord ?

[bzmotman]

I had a number of regular Swedish & Danish buyers until PostNord took over the services for both countries. What you have described happened on numerous occasions to me, I use a RM Business account linked to Ebay & post via Click & Drop so IOSS details automatically in the system.

I tried everything including attaching copies of Ebay invoices in a CN23 plastic envelope proving the tax had been paid but no joy. One Danish lawyer customer refused to pay the extra tax & even contacted the CEO but just got the brush off.  I'm not one who regularly stands up for Ebay but this time based on my own experiences the problem lies with PostNord. As I say they also run the Danish postal system so you might consider blocking Danish addresses as well.

[aphystykqa]

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@bzmotman wrote:

I had a number of regular Swedish & Danish buyers until PostNord took over the services for both countries. What you have described happened on numerous occasions to me, I use a RM Business account linked to Ebay & post via Click & Drop so IOSS details automatically in the system.

I tried everything including attaching copies of Ebay invoices in a CN23 plastic envelope proving the tax had been paid but no joy. One Danish lawyer customer refused to pay the extra tax & even contacted the CEO but just got the brush off.  I'm not one who regularly stands up for Ebay but this time based on my own experiences the problem lies with PostNord. As I say they also run the Danish postal system so you might consider blocking Danish addresses as well.

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Thankyou for that information. It looks like the international-walls are surely closing in. It was difficult enough when the introduction of adding 20% VAT at Ebay checkout came along, which really was the-curse-of-death to drastically put off customers doing International business with each other, as it just all got too expensive, and my sales have drastically dropped for foreign sellers, just like myself buying items from foreign sellers as dropped, as 20% (or more) is an immediate put-off. So now to just make matters even worse. More and more foreign buyers shall have to pay Double-VAT, simply because certain foreign postal companies are simply too incompetent - or is it just because they are 'Lazy' ? Oh well, their Governments shall hardly complain, when they get two-lots of VAT instead of just the one.

I guess Ebay complaints department is going to suddenly get a whole lot busier. Maybe it's time to make a huge announcement about this, as no doubt, it shall end up being put out in the Newspapers, and Ebay and Postal Companies names being plastered all over it. I guess it shall get even bigger than that, as perhaps other Market Places shall have the same problem, as surely can't just be Ebay sellers and buyers this is going to effect. No surprises that these countries companies just happen to be part of the European Union. If 'anyone' can mess things up, then the EU has to be Top of the list in that department. Perhaps they are finding another way of punishing the UK for leaving the EU with Brexit, and this shall certainly be one idea

[vabn2012]

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@aphystykqa wrote:

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@vabn2012 wrote:

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@aphystykqa wrote:
this incompentence is all down to Postnord. For all we know, there could be some form of 'corruption' taking place between one-or-more staff members working at Postnord who is 'stealing' additional VAT/TAX monies in some Scam operation.

---

I can tell you this much: it's not a scam on Postnord's part. They simply need electronic proof that VAT has already been paid, and for some reason physical evidence (i.e. shipping label) is not sufficient for them. Unfortunately this seems to be a common issue. As a Swedish buyer who hasn't used ebay.co.uk since before Brexit and has now spent days googling the IOSS issue before placing an order to ensure everything goes smoothly, this situation is incredibly frustrating. 

Imo the fault lies with ebay, who it seems haven't 1: informed sellers about the new system, and 2: provided sellers with an easy way to comply with the regulations.  Since I'm not a seller I don't know how ebay handles buying postage and printing labels - it seems it might be different depending on which mail carrier you use, or as in your case when the seller isn't the one inputting the electronic information? I don't understand how ebay expects sellers to be able to get it right, and as a buyer there's very little I can do to help them.

According to other buyers with the same problem, ebay will refund the extra VAT (although not Postnord's service fee) if you contact ebay with proof you've paid twice (a receipt or similar), so that's what your buyer should do.

---

When Ebay suddenly took the decision several years ago to set GSP as a default system for sellers to use, and we the sellers had to make a speedy decision to choose to opt out of it, and there was only a certain timeframe for us to do this, and fortunately I was one of those who chose to opt out, as I just simply like using the Post Office in the regular way. But, there was quite a 'heated' debate about here in the Ebay Community forum concerning this issue, and I was one of 'many' in here having my general rant about it. Of course, there was different sides being taken in the debate, over the Pro's and the Con's, and quite a few trying to convince sellers to choose GSP (Global Shipping Programme) simply because it is an electronic system, which guarantees that issues like I have experience simply can't happen.

But, I can wholeheartedly say, that I have 'Never' had any issues with sticking with The Royal Mail at the Post Office before, so this is the very first time I have had this issue. Who's fault it is really doesn't matter to me - between Ebay and Postnord. The fact remains that the buyer is unhappy, I am unhappy, and I got some unjustifed Negative feedback given to me, for something which is completely out of my control. So, where at the end - you say about what the buyer should do. Well, in light of the Negative, I really don't care what he does. 

I'm going to block 100% of all Swedish buyers from buying any of my items, and just carry on with the regular Royal Mail Post Office system, and see how it goes. If this is repeated by 'Other' Postal companies, then obviously there has been some recent change, and like you say, 'incompetancies' within Ebay itself must surely be the explanation for things suddenly going wrong. Of course, if this incompentancy is the case. Then they'll be Hundreds of Thousands (possibly) MILLIONS of complaints from both buyers and sellers worldwide. Well, that is something Ebay shall have to deal with. If it is 'Them' who created this 'recent' problem in the first place.

I have read in the newspapers today, an article which says - Online services at some Swedish government agencies and shops have been disrupted in a ransomware attack believed to have been carried out by a Russian hacker group - not sure if 'that' could have a part to play in what happened with Postnord ?

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You are of course free to not offer shipping to Sweden - I can understand not wanting the hassle - but chances are until ebay sorts this out, you will run into the issue again if you sell to the EU. From what I've gathered while trying to makes sense of this mess, this is not unique to Postnord, or even Sweden. If you go to reddit you'll find people on Reddit from various EU countries asking what on Earth this IOSS number is and where it goes, or why their customs are demanding VAT again.  I can't speak for other countries' postal services, but while Postnord are terrible in many ways and have been for years (all without help from the Russians), they're not likely to be deliberately scamming anyone.

What you could do is ask your post office how they handle inputting IOSS numbers into their system, since it seems like something they should be able to do.

[vabn2012]

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@bzmotman wrote:

I had a number of regular Swedish & Danish buyers until PostNord took over the services for both countries. What you have described happened on numerous occasions to me, I use a RM Business account linked to Ebay & post via Click & Drop so IOSS details automatically in the system.

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That sounds worrying. I was hoping to be able to tell my seller that as long as they use Click & Drop things should be fine. Is it possible to check manually that the IOSS has been submitted correctly?

[aphystykqa]

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@vabn2012 wrote:

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@aphystykqa wrote:

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@vabn2012 wrote:

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@aphystykqa wrote:
this incompentence is all down to Postnord. For all we know, there could be some form of 'corruption' taking place between one-or-more staff members working at Postnord who is 'stealing' additional VAT/TAX monies in some Scam operation.

---

I can tell you this much: it's not a scam on Postnord's part. They simply need electronic proof that VAT has already been paid, and for some reason physical evidence (i.e. shipping label) is not sufficient for them. Unfortunately this seems to be a common issue. As a Swedish buyer who hasn't used ebay.co.uk since before Brexit and has now spent days googling the IOSS issue before placing an order to ensure everything goes smoothly, this situation is incredibly frustrating. 

Imo the fault lies with ebay, who it seems haven't 1: informed sellers about the new system, and 2: provided sellers with an easy way to comply with the regulations.  Since I'm not a seller I don't know how ebay handles buying postage and printing labels - it seems it might be different depending on which mail carrier you use, or as in your case when the seller isn't the one inputting the electronic information? I don't understand how ebay expects sellers to be able to get it right, and as a buyer there's very little I can do to help them.

According to other buyers with the same problem, ebay will refund the extra VAT (although not Postnord's service fee) if you contact ebay with proof you've paid twice (a receipt or similar), so that's what your buyer should do.

---

When Ebay suddenly took the decision several years ago to set GSP as a default system for sellers to use, and we the sellers had to make a speedy decision to choose to opt out of it, and there was only a certain timeframe for us to do this, and fortunately I was one of those who chose to opt out, as I just simply like using the Post Office in the regular way. But, there was quite a 'heated' debate about here in the Ebay Community forum concerning this issue, and I was one of 'many' in here having my general rant about it. Of course, there was different sides being taken in the debate, over the Pro's and the Con's, and quite a few trying to convince sellers to choose GSP (Global Shipping Programme) simply because it is an electronic system, which guarantees that issues like I have experience simply can't happen.

But, I can wholeheartedly say, that I have 'Never' had any issues with sticking with The Royal Mail at the Post Office before, so this is the very first time I have had this issue. Who's fault it is really doesn't matter to me - between Ebay and Postnord. The fact remains that the buyer is unhappy, I am unhappy, and I got some unjustifed Negative feedback given to me, for something which is completely out of my control. So, where at the end - you say about what the buyer should do. Well, in light of the Negative, I really don't care what he does. 

I'm going to block 100% of all Swedish buyers from buying any of my items, and just carry on with the regular Royal Mail Post Office system, and see how it goes. If this is repeated by 'Other' Postal companies, then obviously there has been some recent change, and like you say, 'incompetancies' within Ebay itself must surely be the explanation for things suddenly going wrong. Of course, if this incompentancy is the case. Then they'll be Hundreds of Thousands (possibly) MILLIONS of complaints from both buyers and sellers worldwide. Well, that is something Ebay shall have to deal with. If it is 'Them' who created this 'recent' problem in the first place.

I have read in the newspapers today, an article which says - Online services at some Swedish government agencies and shops have been disrupted in a ransomware attack believed to have been carried out by a Russian hacker group - not sure if 'that' could have a part to play in what happened with Postnord ?

---

You are of course free to not offer shipping to Sweden - I can understand not wanting the hassle - but chances are until ebay sorts this out, you will run into the issue again if you sell to the EU. From what I've gathered while trying to makes sense of this mess, this is not unique to Postnord, or even Sweden. If you go to reddit you'll find people on Reddit from various EU countries asking what on Earth this IOSS number is and where it goes, or why their customs are demanding VAT again.  I can't speak for other countries' postal services, but while Postnord are terrible in many ways and have been for years (all without help from the Russians), they're not likely to be deliberately scamming anyone.

What you could do is ask your post office how they handle inputting IOSS numbers into their system, since it seems like something they should be able to do.

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All I can say is, that whatever has gone wrong, is a 'recent' event. I can say this for sure, as I have sent plenty of items by Royal Mail International Tracked to countries within the European Union and Outside of it and 100% of them have arrived without any issue. Of course, unless Ebay make an announcement, then how are 'Us' the sellers or the buyers meant to understand what has gone wrong.

I would say that this problem is deadly serious, and it needs to be addressed.

The fact is, that Ebay took VAT from the buyer who bought my item, and then once it arrived in Swedish customs, they gave the buyer (no choice) but to pay again, and as Sweden's VAT rate is at 25% and not 20%, then he actually not only had to pay 'Twice', but also had to pay 5% extra. This is Fraud in my books, and actually a Criminal matter where the Police should be very involved.

What you are saying (and 'others' agree with you) - that this is very widespread and growing exponentially. The scale of the problem is without a doubt Ebay's responsability. It is their marketplace after all, and buyers and sellers need to know that doing business has to work. Transactions have to be successful.

As for my suggested input, that it is myself 'the seller' who is now expected to visit the Post Office and I am meant to ask how they sort the IOSS details out. Well, Post office staff and manager is meant to be profficient at what they do. If they fail in that department, then the accountability falls on their heads. I shouldn't have to do anything. It is like myself going to the doctors, and then questioning their abilities of being a doctor.

[tommystrezures]

If you are using click and drop and printing your labels towards the bottom of the label there will be an iOSs symbol. That confirms rm have the data.

[tommystrezures]

I am going to play devil's advocate here! 

this is not eBay's problem per se. Amazon, Etsy, not on the high street have all taken measures that when at post office their companies appear on our screens for iOSs submissions. 

In my view (and it is just that) the problem lies with the beaurocrats within the EU for implementing such a draconian system. There are many othe countries worldwide that charge a tax seen usually as gst on eBay invoices Singapore, Australia, USA plus more spring to mind. The key issue here is that the submission at point of dispatch do not need the electronic submission. As long as the package say for Australia has the abn number that's it.... it sails through the system.

the other issue thereafter lies with incompetent customs authorities who don't know their own rules. When the eu implemented this nearly three years ago we had mail going all over the place being returned for no reason etc. the worst then we're Germany Ireland and Italy. Thankfully they are largely fine now altho it cost the Italian authorities a lot of money when their system completely failed a year or two ago to get a system fit for purpose.

unfortunately it is one of the pitfalls of export, ultimately we are all human we do and can make mistakes it's just so frustrating when people don't learn from their mistakes and I mean customs authorities! 

[aphystykqa]

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@tommystrezures wrote:

I am going to play devil's advocate here! 

this is not eBay's problem per se. Amazon, Etsy, not on the high street have all taken measures that when at post office their companies appear on our screens for iOSs submissions. 

In my view (and it is just that) the problem lies with the beaurocrats within the EU for implementing such a draconian system. There are many othe countries worldwide that charge a tax seen usually as gst on eBay invoices Singapore, Australia, USA plus more spring to mind. The key issue here is that the submission at point of dispatch do not need the electronic submission. As long as the package say for Australia has the abn number that's it.... it sails through the system.

the other issue thereafter lies with incompetent customs authorities who don't know their own rules. When the eu implemented this nearly three years ago we had mail going all over the place being returned for no reason etc. the worst then we're Germany Ireland and Italy. Thankfully they are largely fine now altho it cost the Italian authorities a lot of money when their system completely failed a year or two ago to get a system fit for purpose.

unfortunately it is one of the pitfalls of export, ultimately we are all human we do and can make mistakes it's just so frustrating when people don't learn from their mistakes and I mean customs authorities! 

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There are a few possibilities, but as a 'seller' - my only priority is for this isolated incident to be the very last incident of all. Whether there are recent changes or incometencies that you and others have highlighted - the fact remains the same. It must not happen again. If it does happen again, then the options I'd take is to only sell to UK buyers on online market platforms such as Ebay, and sell to International sellers through 'other' online platforms which leave myself totally in the driving-seat, such as FB, WIX, Etc... Or, the second option is to change to Royal Mail Click and Collect system, or another system which handles International Parcels with IOSS numbers by electronic means. 

But, from Ebay's perspective, it becomes a much Bigger problem. As it's expected that this problem shall rise exponentially, and those complaints such as I am making shall also grow exponentially from both the Buyers and the Sellers. This is only going to create extra hassle they could really do without, and naturally, they'll be a lot seeking to get the Police authorities involved, as it is Fraud - at the end of the day, when Millions of buyers suddenly end up having to pay VAT twice, when the law says the opposite.

I shall say again, that this problem is possibly the single-biggest problem that Ebay has right now, as this is only going to get worse and worse, and it's actually in Governments / European Union Lot's best-interests. A nice easy way to scam as much additional Tax Revenue out of people. Why settle for just one tax payment, when you can get it doubled to two tax payments. They can earn Billions of Euros out of this, and get away with it to, as Ebay seems very disinterested in resolving this matter, as after all, they can simply pass the blame onto them, whilst their hands stay clean. Sadly, it won't do their reputation much good

[myriad*seller]

The buyer has to claim back the VAT they have paid the second time by sending Swedish Customs the ebay sales details showing they paid at point of sale

They will be refunded by Swedish customs for the overpayment that was taken in error