Search - is anyone else finding it as useless as me?

[ian_w42]

In the past few months I have found the search function to become nearly useless.

I often search for specific computer hardware components, I usually use the exact model number, brand name, memory size etc in the search. An example would be "NVIDIA RTX 3060 12GB " but applies to every search I make.

Nearly all of the results will be irrelevant and not related to the search terms at all. Different brands, different models etc. Most of the results will not contain any of the keywords I searched for.

You can of course refine results using the filter checkboxes but it's annoying and doesn't even cover every thing you might be searching for, the options are quite out of date.

I know ebay is "streamlining" search results but this is beyond that, it also does not seem to listen to quotes to force inclusion of certain keywords.

[moonlight-rhapsody]

[The CEO] is aware that not every member knows the ins and out of the current search method and how to find what they want, and he seems to think AI holds the answers. 

Considering how the broken search function must have been impacting ebay's profits for months/years, you'd think the CEO would have done something about it before now.  He didn't have to wait for AI, he could have got his tech team to improve the existing model.  If I was a shareholder/investor, I'd be viewing it as a dereliction of duty.

It will be interesting to see whether AI proves to be the golden bullet, or whether it will be yet another of ebay's "improvements" that turn out to be worse than before.

[the_book_seekers]

It will be interesting to see whether AI proves to be the golden bullet, or whether it will be yet another of ebay's "improvements" that turn out to be worse than before.

I don't hold out much hope. AI is only as good as the data it learns from and I doubt the quality of information ebay has. Also AI will have to fit in with their promoted listings systems, I don't see ebay dropping a big revenue stream. It will be montized in that respect so I can still see buyers being shown stuff they don't want and have no interest in.

[inpoughkeepsie]

Bypass the gobbledegook search results by using Google. This usually finds the exact item you are looking for even amongst the ebay listings!!

[smarts-gaming]

Hello. It took a while as I havent been looking on ebay much lately. But I do have a good example from this evening. 

If you search NES Console, and then sort by lowest, you get the "we've streamlined your search results". It then shows thousands of unrelated results that include the word "nes", despite none of them being an nes console... it brings up display stands, wires, games, manuals, etc etc. I just want to find the lowest priced nes console, but "streamline" feature makes that impossible without trawling through multiple pages and 100s of listings. 

Do you have a solution for this, other than "dont search by lowest price"?

[eburtonlab]

@smarts-gaming 

If you search NES Console, and then sort by lowest, you get the "we've streamlined your search results". It then shows thousands of unrelated results that include the word "nes", despite none of them being an nes console

If sellers are including the keywords NES and listing in the Console category, then the search is basically returning the results you are asking for as far as the search can do so, even if some of the results are for parts for consoles rather than consoles themselves.

One of the problems with using the "lowest price" sort order is that the things that turn up first in the list tend to be parts and accessories for what you are looking for, or broken units rather than just complete working units.

You can try various things to get around this.

You can ignore the "see more results" link and stick with the streamlined results, which should remove many of the accessories or parts units.

You can use the "see more results" link, but set a price floor to filter out anything less than the lowest priced console currently available -- though if you rely on that search again, you may miss newer listings below that cutoff price.

You can try searching using grouped keywords such as nes-console to ensure that those keywords appear in order in any results -- though you may miss listings that don't use that exact phrase in the title or item-specifics:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=NES-Console&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_sop=15&_oaa=1&_dcat=1399...

You can also try using some category-specific filter options:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=NES+Console&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_udlo=18&_sop=15&_blrs=re...

That will work, but not every seller uses the correct model item-specific, and you may miss some results searching that way. And some parts sellers may include model numbers if the parts are specific enough.

If there are no "new" units being listed or you know you are looking for an inexpensive used item, you may be able to limit your results to "used" to filter out many of the parts and manuals, and you can try limiting your results to fixed price listings:

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=NES-Console&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_sop=15&_oaa=1&_dcat=1399...

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=NES+Console&_sacat=0&LH_TitleDesc=0&_sop=15&_blrs=recall_filt...

At some point you may have to decide which is more important to you: seeing every possible NES console listing, or avoiding the false-positive results that contain your keywords but are not consoles. If you want to see every possible result, you may need to scroll past some listings that meet your search criteria that are not consoles. 

My strategy for this sort of search is to rely on a search that finds new consoles listed in the last day or so, then quickly scan the list to see if there are any great deals that I would want to take advantage of quickly. This search would be targeted to have the fewest possible number of false-positives, and would be something I could check daily. If the results are few enough and far between, I might even set up a saved search to alert me when new items are listed, either through eBay or through a third party automated search if I want alerts quicker than within 24 hours of an item being listed.

Then I might also have a much more general search that I might check once per week or so to see if there are any results worth looking at that my first search missed. This search would be a much wider search, and might contain many false positives that would need to be scrolled past to get to the good results.

[mere-828448]

When I tried that, Sort by Lowest on 'NES Console' did produce all-NEW console results, but it found only 563 of them.

Sort by Highest on 'NES Console' also produced all-NEW console results, but this time, 563 of them.

My only clue is the Search seemed to have taken it up on itself to apply two filters of its own: Nintendo and Home Console… each shown with 747 hits.

Removing Home Console also cleared the Nintendo filter - I guess Nintendo makes nothing else -  with 706 hits

Removing Nintendo also cleared left 616 hits hits for.

Removing both gave 614 hits, each containing either Home Console or Nintendo or both.

Keeping Nintendo without Home Console as a filter gives 616 results, but records 826 against the filter.

Using Nintendo as the sole search term both clears the Nintendo filter and ups the item count to 180,000+

When I tried that, Sort by Lowest on 'NES Console' did produce all-NES &  Console results, but it found only 563 of them.

NB: 563 came from Pasting the term 'NES Console' from smarts-gaming's Post above.

Typing the same term usually gave the same 563 results,  though once that returned 479, and the found counts against the filters also fluctuated for no apparent reason.

Clearly, items might have been added or sold while I was playing, but the main count remained at 563, which never showed any apparent relationship to either fluctuating filter.

[eburtonlab]

@mere-828448 

The "lowest first" link I provided used the "recall-filtering" option to avoid losing any results to the "streamlining", which is why you got the same number of results in the "highest first" sort.

Removing the filter options finds more results, but many of those are parts listed in the console category, not actual consoles, which is what the search was intended to find. In other words, using no category-specific filter options shows some additional console results, at a cost of providing many more less-relevant non-console results.

Changing the keywords resets the search to "all categories", which is why that turned up 180,000+ results.

If you create a new search, the "lowest first" sort by default will again provide fewer "streamlined" results if there are enough results (above fifty or so, I think).

[mere-828448]

Thanks and I don't understand why you're saying that at all, let alone to me.

I saw no link from you, smarts-gaming or anyone; only the wording in smarts…' Post. Can you work with that?

In all my years of using eBay, I've neither met nor heard of any 'recall-filtering' option and I have no reason to believe it was invoked here… the more since as I said, cancelling any filter in sight automatically cancelled the other.

Since sorting the same results by 'lowest…' or 'highest first…' should produce the same  numbers, I don't understand why you said anything about getting the same number of results, far less how 'streamlining…' might come into that? Will you fill me in? 

Removing the filter options clearly finds different results but FYI in the cases I cited, I was happily surprised to notice no parts listed in the console category; only actual consoles.

Will you try the same Searches that Smarts… and I actually used, rather than any theory? Will you try that even though my results were very clearly different from Smarts…'

I don't think it's clear what you believe the search was intended to find.

I think Smarts' made it clear, the intention was to find 'NES consoles' and nothing else.… however naive 'nothing else…' might have been.

I myself was first and foremost interested in what Smarts…' 'NEC Console' might find, whether Pasted or typed directly.

I don't believe your view that using no category-specific filter options shows some additional console results, at a cost of providing many more less-relevant non-console results, was borne out by what eBay showed me.

I don't understand your view that changing the keywords resets the search to 'all categories…', let alone that that's why 180,000+ results turned up.

A minute ago I again tried Pasting 'NEC Console' into a new, blank eBay Search frame. Does that not count as 'changing the keywords…'?

Either way that produced not umpty thousand, but a little over '300 results for NEC Console' though here yes, some were indeed mere parts.

That the number of results varied every time I tried that might be due to some Items being bought and others newly Listed; to a glitch in the Search routines or to what else, I don't know. Do you?

Did my changing the keywords reset the search as you expected; did I do something wrong or what, please?

Switching to 'highest…' did boost the results from 321 up to 350. 'Best Match…' gave 368 while 'Ending Soonest…' went back to 350, as did both 'Nearest First…' and 'Newly Listed…'.

Will you say what but a glitch could account for different Sort criteria changing the results at all, let alone by nearly 10%?

[eburtonlab]

@mere-828448 

I saw no link from you, smarts-gaming or anyone; only the wording in smarts…' Post. Can you work with that?

I thought you may have been using one of the links I provided to smarts-gaming as a starting point, but if that is not what you were doing I was mistaken about that.

In all my years of using eBay, I've neither met nor heard of any 'recall-filtering' option and I have no reason to believe it was invoked here… the more since as I said, cancelling any filter in sight automatically cancelled the other.

If you have ever performed a search and sorted by "Lowest first: P&P" and seen the line at the top of the search results that says "We’ve streamlined your search results to show you the best listings. See more results", and then you used the "See more results" link to... see more results, then you have invoked the "recall-filtering" option, even if you did not recognize it as such.

Since sorting the same results by 'lowest…' or 'highest first…' should produce the same numbers, I don't understand why you said anything about getting the same number of results, far less how 'streamlining…' might come into that? Will you fill me in?

eBay apparently disagrees with you about how sorting should affect the search, otherwise that "We’ve streamlined your search results to show you the best listings. See more results" line would not have been programmed to specifically appear in that sort, and the numbers of results would not change when changing the sort order.

Removing the filter options clearly finds different results but FYI in the cases I cited, I was happily surprised to notice no parts listed in the console category; only actual consoles.

Your search may have been a better search than the search I was using; I saw many non-console results that happened to be listed in the Console category.

Will you try the same Searches that Smarts… and I actually used, rather than any theory? Will you try that even though my results were very clearly different from Smarts…'

I don't think it's clear what you believe the search was intended to find.

I think Smarts' made it clear, the intention was to find 'NES consoles' and nothing else.… however naive 'nothing else…' might have been.

I myself was first and foremost interested in what Smarts…' 'NEC Console' might find, whether Pasted or typed directly.

If I enter nes console into a general ebay.co.uk search, change the sort to "lowest first" and do not use the "See more results" link, I currently see 546 results that ship to the UK postal code I have chosen (your results may vary somewhat due to time or location):

https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_nkw=nes+console&_sacat=0&_sop=15

I see additional results if I use the "See more results" link (643), and even more if I use the "Newly listed" sort (916). For some reason, changing the sort order also changes the Brand and Type filter options; I notice that when I start searching using a different sort order, those filters are not checked; it is only when I change to "lowest first" that those filter options get checked. I had not noticed that before.

I don't believe your view that using no category-specific filter options shows some additional console results, at a cost of providing many more less-relevant non-console results, was borne out by what eBay showed me.

I was referring to a different starting search (and possibly different options as well) when I said that removing category-specific filter options showed me additional results, including some consoles where the sellers did not use those item-specifics, but also some other non-console results as well. Using the search you or smarts-gaming specified, I see another 140 or so results not included in the original search if I uncheck those two options, not all of those additional results appear to be consoles.

I don't understand your view that changing the keywords resets the search to 'all categories…', let alone that that's why 180,000+ results turned up.

I do not recall exactly what steps I took to get 180,000 results; I think I may have inadvertently changed over to searching ebay.com at some point. A search of nes in the video game category on ebay.com turns up about 200,000 results.

But in general, when searching a specific category with a limited number of results, if changing the keywords suddenly results in a drastic increase in the number of results by orders of magnitude, often the issue is that the change in keywords can result in the search being widened to "all categories". It may not happen with every search or every combination of keywords, but it can happen, particularly when using keyword exclusions. And when smarts-gaming referred to seeing "thousands of unrelated results" I suspect that may have been what happened.

A minute ago I again tried Pasting 'NEC Console' into a new, blank eBay Search frame. Does that not count as 'changing the keywords…'?

That may depend on what page you started from, actually. If you start from the main eBay page that should give you what I consider a clean "default" search. If you start from the search results page, some of the settings of the previous search may carry over in the page URL, even if it is not apparent on the left side of the page.

Either way that produced not umpty thousand, but a little over '300 results for NEC Console' though here yes, some were indeed mere parts.

That sounds like a good search; far more consoles than non-console results.

That the number of results varied every time I tried that might be due to some Items being bought and others newly Listed; to a glitch in the Search routines or to what else, I don't know. Do you?

Did my changing the keywords reset the search as you expected; did I do something wrong or what, please?

Results can vary for all those reasons and others; I certainly cannot claim to understand or explain everything that happens even when eBay's search seems to be working as intended.

Switching to 'highest…' did boost the results from 321 up to 350. 'Best Match…' gave 368 while 'Ending Soonest…' went back to 350, as did both 'Nearest First…' and 'Newly Listed…'.

Will you say what but a glitch could account for different Sort criteria changing the results at all, let alone by nearly 10%?

In most cases I have found that searching "lowest first" produces "streamlined" or filtered results -- fewer than other sorts except "Best Match", which lately produces more results.

A glitch would signify a temporary or transient issue. Once an issue has gone on for five years, and has specific notices coded ("We’ve streamlined your search results...") that indicates a certain amount of intention, rather than a glitch. 

What is likely not intentional is the excessive amount of "streamlining" that takes place in certain searches, where tens of thousands of results (or more) are cut down to only enough to fill a single page.

[catbatfink]

Yes the search algorithm now makes searching for stuff a mine field.