Listing Removed Due to "Counterfeit" Product & Insane Chat Session

[the_impact_group]

I have restarted selling on eBay after many years' break. One of my items, a cheap brand article of clothing, was removed for being "counterfeit." I eventually got through to someone on 'chat' after jumping through hoops with their automated suggested information pages, only to have a bizarre conversation about how to remedy the situation.

It is a brand used in the imprint industry for embroidering or printing school, company or sports logos. I told the bloke that nobody would make counterfeits of this brand, but he insisted that I put up more than one photo, even though there are other listings of the same brand with only one photo - as if multiple pictures proves it's not a fake anyway. 

And could I upload pictures of tags, etc. I could hardly believe the stupidity. A lot of these cheap imprint brands don't have tage, or even individual bags. It made me want to scrub the rest of my listings, but I might need eBay to get rid of a load of excess stock.

I was told that if I wait 24 - 48 hours then I would get a reply from the counterfeit department, but needless to say, no email or phone call has been received. I just find it incredulous that they could employ people so inexperienced.

Excuse any typos, but this platform doesn't even appear to have a spelling checker. 

[cke786]

eBay's counterfeit team couldn't tell the real deal from a fake, even if the manufacturer gave them their own verdict, hence why so many fakes are up on eBay.

It does have a spelling checker, but you have to manually ask it to check your spelling!

[the_impact_group]

This doesn't surprise me. It's the lack of common sense that is startling, even for eBay. One of the reasons I gave up on eBay about 12 years ago was due to frustration over one thing or another.

Six days after listing a few items after all that time and I'm flagged up. I assume that I was classed as a new 'member' and scrutinised by those counterfeit 'experts'. Perhaps there aren't enough real fakes! to justify their jobs, or like you say, they probably can't tell the difference anyway, so they just pluck listings out of a hat.

I am also listing an Adidas top, which would make more sense to flag, as there was only one photo (I added another, but only as I came across an official one).

I have now received an email about the 'counterfeit' item, which was really condescending,

"Because you may not have been aware of this policy, we're sending this notice to educate you about it."

I wonder what eBay University would be like. And the fees!

Anyway, I clicked on the 'appeal' link and gave them what for about the insanity of this. I was expected to give proof of some kind. I wrote, "I could take a photo of the invoice from my supplier, but, frankly, I just cannot be bothered."

I'm sure I can survive another 12 years without selling on eBay. They probably think that we need them more than v/v.

[4_bathrooms · Accepted solution]

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@the_impact_group wrote:

One of my items, a cheap brand article of clothing, was removed for being "counterfeit." 

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Did the message mention VeRO?

[the_impact_group]

Sorry. I didn't mean to press that the solution was accepted.

There was no mention of VeRO.

[4_bathrooms]

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@the_impact_group wrote:

There was no mention of VeRO.

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As far as I am aware eBay does not police listings for authenticity unless:

1. The listing is subject to one of eBay's authenticity guarantee programmes
2. The brand/rights owner has reported the listing via a VeRO takedown request
3. A regulator removed the listing for being dangerous
4. A buyer opened a return with "Doesn't seem authentic" as the reason
5. The brand owner is registered as a VeRO participant and only allows authorised sellers to sell their merchandise

#1, #2, #3 and #4 seem very unlikely as you would have been told if one of these had happened. In fact, so does #5 as that is usually the preserve of luxury brands - smaller brands are expected to do all the policing themselves. If you check the "VeRO participant profiles" (third tab under "More information") on this page is the company that owns the rights to the brand listed? Note the company name might be different to the brand name - you should be able to find this information out via Google. 

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@the_impact_group wrote:

It is a brand used in the imprint industry for embroidering or printing school, company or sports logos.

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The only other thing I can think of is did you use or mention any other registered brand name or logo anywhere in the listing?

If none of the above apply it would be very unusual for eBay to take any sort of action against a listing so I'm not sure why you would be singled out the way you appear to have been. You mentioned there are other listings of the same brand - are these other sellers registered business sellers (i.e. not private sellers) like yourself selling brand new items? 

[the_impact_group]

It wasn't any of those categories and it hadn't sold, so no report by a customer.

Other business sellers are using just one picture.

I told eBay that their decision was "INSANE", etc. with no evidence and my appeal has been approved. So, I was right! 

I can happily list other items now. Non-clothing, so hopefully no more ridiculous claims.

[pedero_delmonte]

Just had a similar thing myself with a metallica picture vinyl that I listed and did not sell. I reduced the price and then it was identified at counterfeit and removed. I appealed for more information and was told it did not meet counterfeit poliy, it is a genuine vinyl!

After 20 mins on the AI bot I finally got through to a human who phoned me and on further investigation I was told it had been identified as counterfeit because the price was too low compared to similar items on eBay. I reduced the cost as it didn't sell!

You would think with the sophisiticated AI now availbale eBay would have a system in place that identifies counterfeit goods based on more than the price being below the market average!

Ridiculous

[volksbloke]

It really is broken now.
I've had items removed as "counterfeit" and received the patronising emails from ebay.
I've been buying and selling on ebay for 25yrs... since 1999.
Recently I've had items removed because they mention the word "Volkswagen", "Renault" and "Vauxhall" claiming counterfeit.
They aren't counterfeit they are simply items for those vehicles.

I could understand if these were VeRO reports, but they aren't. I've had VeRO reports in the past and at least then you are told who to contact (not that they ever reply).
They are either something in the ebay system ticking a box and deciding youre items are "fake" possibly so they can claim they are doing their bit to remove fake items - "yeah but look, we removed all these counterfeit items last month.... we doing good!"
Utterly pointless and does nothing to address the real problem.
Or... other sellers reporting, in which case all they are doing is breaking a broken system further as at some point they will be the ones reported.
When you contact the advisors they have absolutely no clue how their system works or any understanding of the issue.
When I finally got through to a seemingly real person (they still wont tell me what prompted the removal, whether it was reported by another seller or some automated system), their advise was that if i wanted to sell items for Volkswagens, not to use the word "volkswagen" in the title or description as then it couldnt be seen as not authentic.
So its not an authenticity issue then, its seemingly an IP infringement issue, but they arent distinguishing between sellers listing items for those vehicles and those actually infringing IP but manufacturing and selling items with names and logos (see "Land Rover").
When I pointed out that people searching for parts for a volkswagen would be searching using that term and if it wasn't there they wouldnt find it...i got nothing.
So... I get another removal. This time I go and find a simlilar item that I know isnt "authentic" its a custom printed item with the VW brand and logo printed on it. And I submit a report... no surprise, ebay dont find anything wrong with it.
I then reported some "Nike" stickers which are printed by the seller with the Nike logo and name. And an "authenticity disclaimer" stating they are not endorsed by Nike. No problem... printing items with a Nike logo is fine, but putting Vauxhall in the title to sell an item to Vauxhall owners isn't
I swear there is some kind of legal case for discrimination or something. Of course it's unlikely to get that far as no individual would want to risk the costs of fighting the mighty ebay. Simpler for the little guys to just move on to a more reasonable platform, which is I suspect exactly what ebay wants.
At one point I took up the shop subscription so I could list in my own categories. I listed items in seperate categories for different vehicles... Sales literally stopped overnight.

I actually thought they had realised how ebay works (or doesn't)... as they seem to have twigged that the little guys who sell stuff on ebay are also ebay buyers. Or were.
Not any more.