Chinese Sellers with UK addresses?

[richardsuperstar]

how come there is at present so many Chinese sellers on here who are allowed to put their despatch location as here in the UK?

I've found loads of items which are undercutting most UK sellers and they all show their location as in the UK but then have their registered company address details as in Hong Kong.

its pretty clear that these sellers dont have offices in the uk and are just putting this to stop them being filtered out when someone clicks on show uk only.

surely there should be some check done by ebay to ensure that if a company claims to be in a country the address needs to be verified..

[cbennissupplies]

rent an office address costs about £30 a month no one actually there and mail is sent on. register for VAT using said address.

you can state uk based but you ship from china due to shipping from address outside of Uk no VAT however any bills Ie ebay monthly invoice and any other expenses from anything in uk all that is addressed to the rent an office and you claim vat back, you end up claiming any VAT back but never pay any VAT.

method 2

rent an office address costs about £30 a month no one actually there and mail is sent on. register for VAT using said address.

orders sent from China to forwarding business in uk, being postal no import duty or vat paid on goods coming and shipped from outside Uk no VAT on goods, forwarder matches code on received packet to address given by shipper and posts via Uk royal mail or evri Etc, not going into detail but this is very cheap and the postal bill from Uk you claim the VAT back on as it is addressed to the Uk rent an office.

this is where those that show Uk vat number are extremely reluctant to give a vat invoice for purchase or give you one showing zero vat or better still will but don't care they are sat in china or wherever and outside of the reach of HMRC. no tax either as the sale is outside of UK

[sml192]

They can't get around VAT obligations in the way you are describing. 

If they are registered for UK VAT using a UK address then they are required to collect and remit Supply VAT on any item they sell in the UK and the sale price would, therefore, have to include VAT.

If they then chose to send the items direct from China the buyer would also end up being incorrectly charged Import VAT as well.

If they send items to a UK distribution company first then they would have to pay Import VAT at the point of importation.  They can only claim the Import VAT back if Supply VAT is collected and remitted on the item.

They also wouldn't be able to claim any VAT back against expenses if there is no Supply VAT being collected. 

[tyomin]

As a buyer I find this Chinese problem most irritating - If you tick UK it should mean goods AND seller are based in UK...if goods or seller are not this is fraud and ebay should take action.

[sml192]

The filter is specifically for item location only and nothing to do with seller location, so it's not fraud.

Ebay are never going to add a filter for seller location as they are a global selling platform and having such a filter would be seen as discrimination. 

[ojewellery]

Maybe we need another badge, I love a badge, a UK owned, operated and tax paying small business.

So stock in UK wouldn't be sufficient, nor would UK VAT registration.   The business would need to have a physical presence.  I guess it could be assessed by company wage slips or UK personal tax return.  It'd have a cost to implement, that would add to our fees, we don't enjoy those going up so it'd have to be something that enough people wanted and felt they'd gain from.

[cbennissupplies]

Uk based business I mean bricks and mortar sells item in Uk they have to charge vat .

Business in say China or anywhere else for that matter sells an item to someone in the uk they do not charge VAT they are outside of the UK , the item being low value and bellow import threshold passes through postal system and thus avoids import duty and VAT. got it ?

now this business has a rent an office in Uk which is registered for VAT this is there UK office and thus would need to charge vat if the sale passes through them but it dose not all the rent an office dose is received bills relevant to that business and being vat registered can claim back any VAT paid.

payment for sales all pass through a PSP that is most likely not in UK and the monies are paid by the PSP to the business bank in what ever country so no money actually passes through a British bank

the rent an office in Uk will have a Uk bank account, money would be transferred into it to cover bills all vat re claimed would be paid to this account it then can be transferred to a bank in the busineses home country a bit like a holding account

the irony is it is above board just a loop hole in the VAT system,

[uk-bornh]

The majority of these fraudulent chinese sellers do not have the item in the uk. 

Their ads state 2-3days delivery, item location uk.

By the time they have dispatched, it clearly reads coming from china guan dong, speedpak or similar. This is fraudulant, Why does ebay allow this and why cant we report it.

I make purchases based on delivery estimate. All of these fraudulent chinese sellers lie about this.

Im on the verge of ceasing purchases from ebay and moving to amazon.

[sml192]

---

@uk-bornh wrote:

The majority of these fraudulent chinese sellers do not have the item in the uk. 

Their ads state 2-3days delivery, item location uk.

By the time they have dispatched, it clearly reads coming from china guan dong, speedpak or similar. This is fraudulant, Why does ebay allow this and why cant we report it.

I make purchases based on delivery estimate. All of these fraudulent chinese sellers lie about this.

Im on the verge of ceasing purchases from ebay and moving to amazon.

---

You can report them for 'Item location misrepresentation' by using the report link on the listing.

As soon as you see that the item is coming from China you should open an 'Item not received' dispute.  The seller almost certainly won't be able to confirm delivery within the 3 business days provided so you will be able to get a full refund and then leave appropriate feedback. 

[sml192]

---

@cbennissupplies wrote:

Uk based business I mean bricks and mortar sells item in Uk they have to charge vat .

Business in say China or anywhere else for that matter sells an item to someone in the uk they do not charge VAT they are outside of the UK , the item being low value and bellow import threshold passes through postal system and thus avoids import duty and VAT. got it ?

now this business has a rent an office in Uk which is registered for VAT this is there UK office and thus would need to charge vat if the sale passes through them but it dose not all the rent an office dose is received bills relevant to that business and being vat registered can claim back any VAT paid.

payment for sales all pass through a PSP that is most likely not in UK and the monies are paid by the PSP to the business bank in what ever country so no money actually passes through a British bank

the rent an office in Uk will have a Uk bank account, money would be transferred into it to cover bills all vat re claimed would be paid to this account it then can be transferred to a bank in the busineses home country a bit like a holding account

the irony is it is above board just a loop hole in the VAT system,

---

One of the main reasons for the changes to the rules for the treatment of VAT on overseas sales, from January 2021, was to remove the loophole you have alluded to by transferring the responsibility for collecting VAT on marketplace sales from the overseas seller to the marketplace.

All goods coming in to the UK are subject to VAT, there is no threshold.  Consignments over £135 are also subject to Import Duty.

For items £135 and under, where the item is outside the UK at the point of sale, the marketplace is responsible for collecting Supply VAT at checkout.  If this doesn't happen then Import VAT should be collected from the buyer at the point of importation.

The marketplace is also responsible for collecting Supply VAT on items that are in the UK at the point of sale but sold by an overseas seller.   If the seller is registered for UK VAT then they are deemed in this instance to have made a zero rated supply to the marketplace, so no actual VAT to remit but must still be declared on their VAT return. 

[ukquad]

If I buy from Aliexpress I pay vat.

[sml192]

---

@ukquad wrote:
If I buy from Aliexpress I pay vat.

---

Yes, that's correct, Aliexpress are a marketplace so they are responsible for collecting VAT from buyers on overseas sales. 

[pillarboxred]

The only thing to do is give up. I find it strange that UK sellers offer goods made in China when the makers can undercut the UK retailers so easily. This also happens within UK manufacturing where makers sell to chain stores for so little that chain stores charge customers less than small retailers have to pay for stock. When the small retailers get wise, they cancel their orders and the manufacturers go bust as they can't make enough from the chains. Manufacturers go bust, small retailers can't get sellable stock and close down. Look around town, that is the future: Amazon selling Chinese goods.

[aspalten]

I'm now having the exact problems with three items. UK address. Now when I've tried to return the item because of a fault they're giving me a Chinese address which is too expensive to return the item. They're then offering between 11 and 30% discount and keep the item. 

eBay are at fault here and need to resolve this problem.

I will be closing my account unless they resolve these problems this is deceptive advertising I've been with eBay for 25 years this Chinese malaki has become extremely worried.

[ile136yz]

If within the eBay's 30 day Guarantee open 3  x eBay cases for 'not as described' as not working.

If out of time contact your Payment Provider to open cases with them.

[aspalten]

From here on all you need to do and all I will do is contact the seller and ask what their return address is you will then find out if they're from China or from the UK

[manicphonic4]

I've read in this thread somewhere about buyers being told their returns need to be returned to China at the buyers expense. I apologise if this has already been covered and discussed fully but I did look through a couple of pages from the 28 I found, didn't find this specific point.

I'm facing this right now and been told by the seller to accept a 50% refund and keep the item or return it at my expense. I don't want the item, it is not as described and this is covered by eBay's Buyer Protection Policy which ensures I will get FREE postage for the return. I will bet that they provide a UK address for their return label and THIS is what eBay needs to stamp down on as these sellers are using THEIR policies against us UK buyers to their gain.

[sml192]

If the item was listed with a UK location then that is where it should be returned to otherwise it should be returned to China.

Ignore any partial refund offers from the seller.  If they don't provide a prepaid return label within 3 business days then escalate to eBay. 

[aspalten]

I agree. I have contacted eBay and eBay have refunded my money without me
having to return it to China. The seller never provided a UK return
address.

If there is anything suspect regarding Chinese sales I will always send a
message to the seller asking them if the return address is in the UK and
ask them what the address is if they do not respond or provide a UK address
I will not buy the product everyone should do the same.

[divine0606]

To be honest if you messaged me for our return address i would most likely add you to my block list as thats a red flag for me a customer asking for a return address before even making a purchase. 

personaly i don't think thats the way forward. 

[aspalten]

Well you're completely mistaken it's called customer service. You don't
just block customers for asking questions to you. Well maybe you do.