Business sellers v Private sellers - A simple solution

[howmuchtobid]

Ebay is clearly struggling to deal with this and I'm not sure they ever will.

A simple and easy to understand solution would be:

Brand new items - all sellers pay a final value fee regardless of whether you are a business seller or on a private account.

Used items - all sellers pay no final value fees regardless of whether you are a business seller or on a private account.

You cannot please everybody however I think this would be a better solution than the mess we currently have.

Business sellers just want a fair, level playing field, what we currently have is nowhere near that.

Ebay bangs on about recycling and reusing items when it suits them, well this is a solution that puts some real meat on the bone.

[themidnightcaller]

Ebay has adverts around the Christmas season for private sellers to sell their unwanted

gifts, which are probably new items..

[therenewalworkshopltd]

No, they aren't new items.

They are second hand, even if they haven't been opened.

They are "like new", but not "new".

Items are only really new, if bought through the supply chain.

Which doesn't mean from your local tesco etc!

This particularly true, when item should have a warranty on it.

[themidnightcaller]

I thought sealed items were sold as new unused..

[4_bathrooms]

---

@themidnightcaller wrote:

I thought sealed items were sold as new unused..

---

Not according to eBay. If you look at their item conditions nearly every "new" condition that doesn't fall under "New other" states the item must be "brand new". For example; Clothes, Shoes & Accessories -> Clothing:

"New with tags: This item is brand new and has never been worn. It still has the original tags and/or original packaging"

The problem is that gets translated to "Brand new" on listings despite the fact it isn't possible for a private seller to be selling a "brand new" item. The item was brand new when the seller originally purchased it but it becomes second-hand (or "pre-loved", "pre-owned" or whatever fluffy marketing term for second-hand eBay chooses) when the seller lists it for sale.

[therenewalworkshopltd]

That is exactly the problem a lot of the time.

Items are sold in that way, but they shouldn't be.

Don't need to say any more as @4_bathrooms has said it.  🙂

[bravergrace]

---

@therenewalworkshopltd wrote:

No, they aren't new items.

They are second hand, even if they haven't been opened.

They are "like new", but not "new".

Items are only really new, if bought through the supply chain.

Which doesn't mean from your local tesco etc!

I don't know where this eBay-myth came from.  

It's really nonsense, and smacks of snobbery.

Leaving warranties aside, it's just not true.  

Suppose I buy something where warranty isn't an issue - say, a pair of Xmas socks.  Brand new half price, and sealed in a nice clean box, straight from my local menswear shop.

Then I toddle up the road to my local discount shop, and buy an identical pair.

Then I toddle round the corner and buy another identical pair, this time from a charity shop (donated to them by the menswear shop as surplus stock).

Would you say that all these 3 shops were not entitled to count the socks as new?  Would it depend on whether the shops bought their stock from the manufacturer at full list price?  What about if the manufacturer or retailer donated it, or sold it at auction - or (God forbid!) on eBay?  Or sold it in their factory shop?

Should I argue with my charity shop manager and insist that she re-label them as "USED SOCKS" on the basis that they ceased to be new at the time they were donated and "left the official supply chain"?

Sorry, but I don't propose to start labelling my 1950s stockings as "used", when they're still sealed in their original packet.  It's not true and it's not decent.

[therenewalworkshopltd]

That is a matter of opinion and has been argued many times.

So pointless doing it again.

And just for the record, warranty is a very important part of that argument, you cannot just discard it, as it covers an awful lot of goods.

[moldosgifts]

This will require a site wide redo.

Private cannot sell new full stop if you wish to apply consumer laws.

Private can sell like new instead, pre loved or preowned and all that malarky.

Business can sell any whatever they want (as long as legal)

But as I've agued this before I'm just repeating myself.

Doesn't need an argument it is just my opinion no repones needed, just look up my last post on this.

[therenewalworkshopltd]

Not entirely sure why your responding to me with what I already said?

[theelench]

Same with my Azzaro EDT, won in a Christmas raffle.  Still un-opened, in its box and cellophane.  Even has a plastic bar code stuck on the side.  It's no different from when it came out of the factory.

[lucy_farmer]

'....won in a Christmas raffle.  Still un-opened, in its box and cellophane.'

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I've also had one or two dreadful christmas presents that are still *definitely* new! 😆

And, yes, selling one or two on ebay shouldn't be a problem....... it's when there's 50 Brand New items in  a private sellers listings that it becomes a bit obvious.

Which is why a bot, that can pick up on the word 'new',  could ring an alarm after a certain number of listings that are all 'new'.

1 or 2, fine....     37? maybe not!

[4_bathrooms]

---

@bravergrace wrote:

---

Suppose I buy something where warranty isn't an issue - say, a pair of Xmas socks.  Brand new half price, and sealed in a nice clean box, straight from my local menswear shop.

Then I toddle up the road to my local discount shop, and buy an identical pair.

Then I toddle round the corner and buy another identical pair, this time from a charity shop (donated to them by the menswear shop as surplus stock).

Would you say that all these 3 shops were not entitled to count the socks as new?  Would it depend on whether the shops bought their stock from the manufacturer at full list price?  What about if the manufacturer or retailer donated it, or sold it at auction - or (God forbid!) on eBay?  Or sold it in their factory shop?

Should I argue with my charity shop manager and insist that she re-label them as "USED SOCKS" on the basis that they ceased to be new at the time they were donated and "left the official supply chain"?

---

The way I see it something is only "brand new" when it is bought by the original retail purchaser. In all the examples you have given you would be the original retail purchaser as even the charity shop is a retail business. However, if you (or someone you gifted them to) subsequently sold the socks privately they would no longer be "brand new" as the socks would have had at least one previous (private) owner. They might not be used but they would no longer be "brand new" either.

---

@bravergrace wrote:

---

Sorry, but I don't propose to start labelling my 1950s stockings as "used", when they're still sealed in their original packet.  It's not true and it's not decent.

---

If you select "New" as the item condition eBay will likely label your 70-year-old stockings as "Brand new"; something I doubt the average person would consider to be true either.

eBay seems to have a limited number of item conditions that simply get "translated" on the front-end; something that is evident from looking through the API. However, "New" is almost always translated as "Brand new" which simply isn't true in many cases. "New other" implies the item is unused but has some sort of defect, is a second or otherwise has opened or missing original packaging.

eBay could make "Brand new" a specific item condition that would only be available to business sellers with a new "New" condition in-between "Brand new" and "New other". "Brand new" could require the business to state the warranty/guarantee period for the item; something that would also be shown in search results. That might actually persuade some businesses trading illegally via private accounts to register correctly as their competitor's listings (i.e. correctly registered businesses) would be showing a more attractive offer in the search results.  

Or eBay could just stop slapping "Brand new" on almost anything with "New" selected as the item condition as in many cases it simply isn't true.