Postage issues

[lumun_1059]

I always enjoy buying on ebay. However, recently I had to pay postage twice. The seller had paid the £2.70  postage, that was added at the checkout and it was tracked, but royal mail asked me for an extra £3.50 to deliver it. I paid it. I wasn't sure what to do, thinking it was royal mail's fault and so didn't give negative feedback to the seller, as they were only on their third sale. Ebay has since given them positive feedback on my behalf I think. They did send the necklace on their part and pay some postage I believe. I don't know if they were using this new simple delivery thing, as the £2.70 seemed an odd sum for a package that could be sent as a small letter.  Reading around it seems something is going wrong with the postage and it is putting me off buying on here any longer. I've lost all confidence. It seems ebay is expecting the buyer to take all responsibility for the postal/delivery services  they are choosing.

[sml192]

£2.70 is the price for Royal Mail Tracked 48 Large Letter both via their website and using Simple Delivery.

If a Simple Delivery label was used then there shouldn't have been any surcharge.  Ebay has agreed a contract with Royal Mail which is based on averages meaning that items will be accepted and delivered regardless of any size/weight discrepancies. 

[lumun_1059]

I just read an article online which says that ebay have messed up the parcel sizes and Royal Mail refused the parcels. The seller has paid ebay in good faith to post it and the and royal mail and ebay have acted in bad faith. I am taking this up with my MP. Two big companies intercepting post paid for by customers is not on. 

[sml192]

There was a issue a few weeks back with some Post Offices, not Royal Mail, refusing Simple Delivery parcels but that has largely been resolved now. 

[lumun_1059]

Unfortunately I was caught up in that and been charged twice for postage. Ebay refuses to refund the postage and I had buyer protection. I will give feedback for the last items I purchased and then I will not be using ebay again.  It is unworkable for me. I pay the seller for goods and postage. They pay ebay the postage.  Ebay has not procured the right system with the couriers it selects and uses and then the buyer- me in this case, has to pay the extra postage. Too much cost and effort for what used to be so simple.

[ruby*ryan]

What was on the parcel? Was it a printed label, or had they written the address? If printed, did it say 'Ebay Marketplace Seller' at the bottom?

You say the item would have gone as a letter, so  if printed, then the £2.70 label should have been more than  sufficient, it would cover an item up to 1kg, large letter size. I would be taking it up with Royal Mail. Take photos of the label, and the request to pay extra.

[lumun_1059]

I didn't keep the label. I had no idea what was going on. It was a small packet, a little dainty necklace. The seller put it in a small envelope and postage it with the correct postage with ebay for its size and  weight. At the  time royal mail and ebay were having a dispute and they were not honouring ebay labels as they said they were wrong.  That's why I ended up paying twice for it. It was not the sellers fault. They sent it tracked for the correct postage. Royal mail and ebay were arguing over their contract with one another. This will be happening a lot. Ebay wants to control the postage system and is getting in too deep with couriers that despise it and couldn't care less to honour the usa company that thinks it is above UK consumer laws.

[lumun_1059]

I'm sure it was printed. By this time I had had to pay the excess postage of £3,50 to receive it. I was worried if I didn't, I may lose the parcel and my rights to receive the goods. It was delayed and ebay annoyed me by giviing automatic feedback without looking at what had gone on for me. The only reason the sale was completed, is because i paid the extra, making the tracking show delivered.
The customer service know what happened and will not refund me the extra postage and I have the royal mail details and my credit card ones too. I also had buyer protection. 
Thanks for your reply. I can't wait to say goodbye to ebay once i have given the last feedback to the couple of sellers i have left to receive goods from.
All the best, Lucy Mungeam. 

[xyz307xyz · Accepted solution]

If you do decide to buy on ebay again, you can tell if an item should be sent Simple Delivery by the Postage options on the listing being:

Standard Tracked Delivery and/or Express Tracked Delivery

You can see these before you bid/buy/make an offer.

If the Postage options say any of "RM First Class/Tracked 48/Special Delivery, Yodel, Evri" etc it's not listed as Simple Delivery. I don't know if a seller could decide to use Simple Delivery after selling.

And most Business Sellers don't seem to want to use Simple Delivery at the moment.

[insidethe93]

Before the mess of Simple Delivery, a way to deal with the RM form requiring £3.50 due to underpaid postage seemed to be (as discussed in a thread on these discussion boards) to send a photo of the RM form to the seller as seller should pay it. Most likely underpayment of postage was a mistake by the seller. Mistakes happen. Seller refunds the buyer who then pays the RM fee, then RM delivers the parcel, then buyer leaves good seller feedback. It's a good idea to do it in that order because if seller promises to refund the RM fee and buyer pays it, if the seller turns out to be an awkward one, they might renege and not refund the buyer after all and leave the buyer out of pocket.

It happened to me at least twice. But I did as explained above and the sellers refunded me to cover the RM fee - they were quick, polite and friendly, and I gave them good seller feedback (but didn't mention the RM fee specifically in my feedback).

[dansvan1]

Was it the solid silver necklace and pendant? If so, I'm wondering if it exceeded large letter thickness dimensions? Especially if it ended up coiled on top of itself to one end of the envelope during transit 🤔 RM may have felt it should have gone small parcel, instead of just giving it a shake and evening it out.

[lumun_1059]

Thanks, it could be, but ebay won't look in to it, or discuss the matter. I don't think ebay are so concerned about refunding the £3.50, but they gave automatic good feedback to the seller and completely bypassed me as a buyer. They didn't cnsider my delay in getting the parcel I paid extra on. So now, I have no way of getting the money back. I am going to stop using ebay after my last two purchases. I don't think they like the idea that since they are so obsessed with their own labels and procuring postage and courier services, that they should do something if it goes wrong. I also had buyer protection, which they made invalid with their automatic feedback system.
Many thanks. 

[lumun_1059]

I agree. It is better to do it in that order. Difficult when post is delayed and the time lag means ebay give the seller automatic good feedback. Also, it doesn't allow for errors with couriers contracted by ebay. If that goes wrong, then the seller could be liable for a refund to the buyer, that they are not responsible for, but can't get evidence with ebay and the courier as they did not make the postal contract. Any discrepencies by ebay and the courier means ebay makes the seller and buyer responsible for contracts they can't forsee the outcome about.  Also, royal mail said the sender may not accept it back and then I could be liable for extra postage and i wouldn't have my goods either. I am not an expert on the legal side of who is liable in these matters, but as a buyer, I don't want to have to pay for the lack of communication that could arise from ebays postage system. Some companies even charge for storage. I sort of understand royal mail, but who knows what the small print is for the other companies ebay might contract. I may be wrong, but I think they said in the new system, ebay has the right to change the courier at anytime.  It makes buyer protection invalid, if it doesn't cover postage ebay buys, as if you don't get the parcel due to post, you have no rights with buyer protection.
I used ebay, buying mostly used items from small sellers for 4 years and nothing went wrong, up until now.  You can imagine trying to get big tech ebay and the big postal companies to help anyone out. So I am avoiding those risks and not buying on ebay any longer. Sorry if this sounds a bit over the top, but nothing surprises me with how consumers get exploited these days. I don't know what the terms and conditions are that ebay and say royal mail have made together. These could differ from a customer to customer one, yet as buyers and sellers we are being held liable for the contract ebay make with couriers and pay out if it goes wrong.

As someone who buys used goods from small sellers all I am getting more and more is USA feeds and chinese sponsored products, despite having UK only and used ticked. Add to this new penalising of small sellers over postage and it makes ebay irrelevant for me.I am not prepared to give bad feedback to sellers when I think ebay is at fault.

[ruby*ryan]

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@lumun_1059 wrote:

I didn't keep the label. I had no idea what was going on. It was a small packet, a little dainty necklace. The seller put it in a small envelope and postage it with the correct postage with ebay for its size and  weight. At the  time royal mail and ebay were having a dispute and they were not honouring ebay labels as they said they were wrong.  That's why I ended up paying twice for it. It was not the sellers fault. They sent it tracked for the correct postage. Royal mail and ebay were arguing over their contract with one another. This will be happening a lot. Ebay wants to control the postage system and is getting in too deep with couriers that despise it and couldn't care less to honour the usa company that thinks it is above UK consumer laws.

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I think you are being sidetracked by what you have read about  some POs not accepting ebay SD parcels (do you even know that this was posted at a post office, or that it was sent via SD?).

If it had the correct postage on for its size and weight, as you say, then the issue was with Royal Mail, NOT eBay, which is why ebay won't get involved.
Had you kept the label and the card/sticker showing the overcharge, you could have claimed off RM.

Lesson for next time, either refuse to pay a surcharge to get the item, and open a 'not received' case to get your money back. Or, if it's RM error, keep all packaging, especially the label and any card/sticker that has notice of the surcharge and claim from them.

[xyz307xyz]

I thought the buyer could still leave their own feedback "overwriting" an automatic feedback left by ebay.

https://community.ebay.co.uk/t5/Seller-Central/Ebay-let-automated-feedback/td-p/7652073

[insidethe93]

Sorry, forgot to say that if it happens again... given that plenty of sellers are still sending not using SD...  Otherwise my post sounds solely like "this is what you should've done" which isn't helpful (and sounds condescending - NOT intended), no point just looking to the past!

[lumun_1059]

Thanks, as it happens I do have all the royal mail details on the tracked part of their website and my credit card details. Ebay never asked me for them. But they are looking in to it now at buyer protection, realising their customer service errors. so looks like my complaint is getting dealt with now.

[sml192]

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@lumun_1059 wrote:
Thanks, as it happens I do have all the royal mail details on the tracked part of their website and my credit card details. Ebay never asked me for them. But they are looking in to it now at buyer protection, realising their customer service errors. so looks like my complaint is getting dealt with now.

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Good to see that you appear to be getting somewhere.  Do keep us updated.