Ebay forces upgrade to Business due to new HMRC regulations

[sportex-uk]

Hi All.

I've received an email from ebay forcing me to switch to business account due to the volume of my recent sales. Customer service explained that I exceeded £1800 in one month, so they act in line with new HMRC regulations. The email is a bit threatening: "We need you to make these changes to your account within the next 21 days. If you don’t, your selling privileges may be blocked. This includes listings ended and loss of selling history."

However, As I'm not ready to go business and I consider my increased activity as temporary, Customer Service advised that if reduce my sales volume, I can stay private. Has any of you passed through this process?

Also, what happensto your existing promo listings if you switch to business? Are they allowed to continue on promo terms and with 'no returns accepted' until they sell or end?

[shopping-ferret]

She wasn't using a tool. She was watching all those listings. Sometimes she'd adjust her price to undercut me straight away, other times the following day.  Anyway I've stopped selling that product as unable to obtain bulk stock. Tbh I'm kind of glad, although it was a good seller. I did well out of it.

[jonat_broad]

To clarify, you contacted another seller to suggest price fixing, which in the UK, is illegal.

[shopping-ferret]

Yes I get that now!! But as I explained, a seller who is masquerading as private *her, not me), is hardly concerned about doing the right thing. 

I on the other hand, was trying to resolve an issue with an idiot seller. I didn't know it was classed as illegal.  It was tge one and only time in 18 years I've done this. But obv the last.

[bojangled]

@shopping-ferret 

Wonder if your competition was the wholesaler. If they are a legitimate business and already above board on taxes, they don’t care about their registered eBay status.

I too have dropped one profitable line due to a private seller owning the category with multiple quantity listings. I’m not racing to the bottom on price.

I do agree with you that a lot of posts on the boards re being asked to upgrade are from genuine private sellers. Yet meanwhile there many visible high volume, obvious business sellers incorrectly registered laughing all the way to the bank.

I don’t report anymore because I believe it’s just a dumping ground and eBay don’t look into it. The onus is on eBay to police their platform. 

Jo

[shopping-ferret]

Hi Jo

Yes, seems a waste if time reporting buyers.

No, the person selling the items is definitely not authorised. The company now have a strict policy that they only sell from their own website and no distributors. It's now in their Terms.

The Ebay seller sells Asian clothing or shoes mostly, then some mixed brand cosmetics too. Definitely not the original company or an authorised agent.

I think they're simply cocky and feel they're invincible.

W

Sent from Outlook for Android<>

[therenewalworkshopltd]

you have a yearly hobby allowance of £1000 turn over (100 £10 sales for example) between April and April each year period. If you go over HMRC classes you as a business. 

No idea where you got that one from.  As it's totally incorrect I'm afraid.

I'm guessing, that your confusing the £1000 that you can trade before having to register as self employed with HMRC.

If what you are saying is true, then if I were to clear out my garage/loft/shed etc and had LOTs of things to sell, it would likely go over £1000 and I would have to register as a business.  This is not the case at all.

There are rules for what HMRC classes as a business.  The biggest one being, buying items to sell.  It doesn't even matter if you lose money on it.  But if you have bought something with the intent of selling it, then you are a business.  And that is still the case below the £1000.  That is there just to give you a guide as to when you actually have to register as self employed.

And just for the record, because a seller is using a private account, does not mean that they are actually doing anything wrong in regard to their taxes.  For all you know, they are properly registered.

The issue with trading on a private account in most cases, is simply that the seller is not complying with consumer law.

[sportex-uk]

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@therenewalworkshopltd wrote:

The issue with trading on a private account in most cases, is simply that the seller is not complying with consumer law.

In many cases, private sellers offer far higher standards than businesses, accepting returns, or posting in excellent timeframes. I'd say the difference is quite often reduced to the amount of fees they pay to ebay.

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[moldosgifts]

But

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@sportex-uk wrote:

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@therenewalworkshopltd wrote:

The issue with trading on a private account in most cases, is simply that the seller is not complying with consumer law.

In many cases, private sellers offer far higher standards than businesses, accepting returns, or posting in excellent timeframes. I'd say the difference is quite often reduced to the amount of fees they pay to ebay.

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But still breaking the law either way.

[sportex-uk]

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@moldosgifts wrote:

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But still breaking the law either way.

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You're not the law enforcer. Mind your own business.

If customers are happy, that's all what matters.

[therenewalworkshopltd]

Absolute tosh.

If someone knows that another person is breaking the law, they have a duty to report it.

Aside from which no matter what your coming up with, whether customers are happy or not, you are not (and cannot), give customers their full consumer rights when using a private account.

Never mind the fact that as a "private" seller, you are taking advantage of something that is simply not meant for you and giving reason to all those business sellers, to report you to Ebay and Trading standards.

Why anyone in good conscience would be happy to break the law I will never understand.

You are a Lawbreaker when doing this, no two ways about it.

Would you be happy to steal from a shop?  Because is essentially what you are doing to both Ebay and properly registered business sellers.

[sportex-uk]

Then report them, every one of them. Ebay doesn't care anyway.

But you would do much better looking after and developing your own business, than crying around and wasting your time by posting on this forum.

Interesting is that I very rarely (if ever) saw a business with 100% positive feedback rate, even on lower volume trades. While it's quite common to see private sellers at 100%.

[therenewalworkshopltd]

Don't be so childish.

[howmuchtobid]

sportex-uk,

You are morally bankrupt on this subject.

You were operating a business on a private account and probably still are....... it's not the right way to operate and never will be, dress it up all you want you are in the wrong.

[returns_andexdisplay]

You will find businesses that have a longer trading history and abide by the rules will only have one account. Where many of the private sellers who run a business will often have multiple accounts and hop between different accounts to try and "avoid" their legal. responsibilities.  

[brindsey]

Roll on the harvesting of National Insurance Nos. Them that won't give,  won't be able to sell. And, them that do give, with multiple ID's, will be identified (as far as HMRC are concerned).

Really don't want to get involved in a discussion as to the possible fraud implications - it's already  been well debated.

But, other than that, Hurrah!

[shopping-ferret]

I suspect some private sellers are registering multiple accounts under the names of friends and relatives.

That'll be interesting. A lot of accounts will be closing down in the next year or so!

[ett1954]

"you have a yearly hobby allowance of £1000 turn over (100 £10 sales for example) between April and April each year period. If you go over HMRC classes you as a business. "  -  To clarify:  The £1000 turnover is the point at which you are required to register for self assessment with HMRC if you are trading.  If you meet the HMRC badges of trade, buying to resell, restoration, etc, etc, and meeting the definition of trading then you are required to register as a business on eBay to be legally compliant with UK law irrespective of what your turnover is.  That is nothing to do with tax but consumer law.

[vintique*violet]

The £1000 is a TRADING allowance... 

for those who are trading. 

If you are selling your personal items you are NOT trading nor are you a business. 

[sagr2519]

"Interesting is that I very rarely (if ever) saw a business with 100% positive feedback rate, even on lower volume trades. While it's quite common to see private sellers at 100%."

Feedback percentage isn't only affected by being a good/bad seller. For example:

• Private sellers might be buying more than selling, so a lot of their feedback is from buying, which can only be positive.
• A private seller getting their first negative feedback might decide to stop selling, while a business seller has already invested in his/her business. This leads to survivor bias.
• It's easier to get 10/10 than 10000/10000, and private sellers are more likely to be small-scale sellers.
• Private sellers know their products, while businesses might be reselling used products without having tried using it themselves. So descriptions from private sellers might be more accurate for used items.

[shopping-ferret]

True, and private sellers are more likely to have multiple accounts, as well as closing accounts down and starting again... for the purpose of concealing their earnings and to delete a poor feedback profile.