The beginning?

OK, so "They" say "everything" began with the Big Bang.



Fair enough, it was quite something and happened faster than the blink of an eye?



"They" also say nothing can travel faster than light?



If that's so, how can "They" view light which "began" shortly after the Big Bang?



http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/science-environment-19728375



We are "here", they're viewing light from a heck of a long way away, such light will have taken billions of years to get here even at approximately 186,000 miles per second.



So how did we get out "here", so far from that light when it was Starlight so long ago?



OK, were we able to get to the source of that light in an instant, we'd find it was probably no longer there but we are billions of miles from where that light was so how come the matter from which our Solar System was formed got sooooo far away from the Stars they're no "seeing"?



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Thar she goes:-


 


http://news.sky.com/story/1097587/asteroid-1998-qe2-giant-rock-passes-earth



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Anonymous
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or CD water existed on Mars and that's why we see smoothed areas that resemble dry river beds cutting through the Martian terrain.  with Mars being half the size of earth, its geothermal activity has long since ceased. this would then make any magnetosphere Mars would have had also cease. the result of that would be the solar wind blasting away the atmosphere of Mars, and as such any water would just "boil" away into space, leaving Mars as we see it today. In the past history of Mars we do see evidence of geothermal activity, I think the volcano  is called Olympic Mons, and from its base to the top it stands higher than Mt Everest. I for one do belive that when humans establish a base on Mars we will find evidence of past life on Mars, and of course with humans being on Mars, there will be then Life on Mars.........................sorry I just had to put that in. 

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The beginning?

Yes Pete, it's probable that Mars had some water but this constant banging on about water here, streams there, floods somewhere else never stops for a moment to consider any other scenario.


 


As to there having been any life on Mars,any life there would have been bacterial, microscopic or very small at best.


 


It never "got old enough" to evolve very far before the conditons became impossible.



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Anonymous
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hi CD, yes I would agree, there is always an alternative, Mars has an atmosphere although its tenuous and consists mostly of C02. it still produces dust devils and on occasions planetary wide sand storms. the sand I would say will round off stones and create pebbles, and as always here is the but.............some, not all of the pebbles and those dry river beds I mentioned on my last post according to the data sent back from the various Mars rovers could only be formed in free flowing water. the pebbles in such areas have a chemical signature that can only be attained via being in water.


 


 


now for an off topic thought, I wonder if they will ever find water on Venus.........a 700C hell hole., maybe in the clouds of the planet?

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The beginning?

The water aspect is being overplayed. Most Martian rocks that I've heard about (!!) were formed by volcanic activity or remnants from the formation of the Planet.


 


As to water, finding water in the rocks, a content of 6,000 parts per million (at best) is hardly evidence of a lot of water.



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Anonymous
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Nasa's Curiosity rover has only been on the surface of Mars for several weeks but it has already turned up evidence of past flowing water on the planet.


The robot has returned pictures of classic conglomerates - rocks that are made up of gravels and sand.


Scientists on the mission team say the size and rounded shape of the pebbles in the rock indicate they had been transported and eroded in water.


Researchers think the rover has found a network of ancient streams.


The rocks, which were described in a media briefing at Nasa's Jet Propulsion Laboratory in California, were likely laid down "several billion years ago". But the actual streams themselves may have persisted on the surface for long periods, said Curiosity science co-investigator Bill Dietrich of the University of California, Berkeley.


"We would anticipate that it could easily be thousands to millions of years," he told reporters.


Satellites at Mars have long captured images of channels on the planet's surface that were cut by some kind of flow, assumed to be liquid water. Curiosity's discovery at its landing site in the equatorial Gale Crater provides the first real ground truth for those observations.


By luck, the rover just happened to roll past a spectacular example of the conglomerate. A large slab, 10-15cm thick, was lifted out of the ground at an angle.


"We've named it Hottah," said rover project scientist John Grotzinger. The name refers to a lake in Canada's Northwest Territories. The team is using names from this region to catalogue objects at Gale.


"To us it just looked like somebody came along the surface of Mars with a jackhammer and lifted up the sidewalk that you might see in downtown LA at a construction site," he joked.


Scientists are now studying the images of the pebbles in the rock. The sizes and shapes will give them clues to the speed and distance of the ancient water flow.


The discovery site lies between the northern rim of the crater and the huge mountain that rises up from its central plain.


Previous orbital imagery of the region had hinted there might have been a water feature there. Curiosity's conglomerates support that hypothesis.


In this view, some of the pebbles have weathered free from the rock


The current interpretation is that the rover is sitting at the head of an alluvial fan of material that washed down through the crater wall and across the plain, cutting many individual streams. Researchers even think they can identify the particular valley at the rim where the water entered the crater, and they have named it Peace Vallis.


There is an eagerness also to study the chemistry of the conglomerates because that will give an indication of the nature of the water - its pH value, for example - and that will provide some clues as to what the environment at the time might have looked like.


At the moment, the rover is heading towards a location dubbed Glenelg. Scientists think this will give them the best access to the rocks of interest.


The US space agency's $2.6bn mission touched down on the Red Planet on 6 August (GMT).


Much of the time since then has been spent commissioning the immensely complex, six-wheeled machine and its suite of 10 instruments.


Curiosity is funded for one Martian year (two Earth years) of study. It will try to determine in that time whether past environments at Gale Crater could ever have supported microbial life.


(A) Curiosity will trundle around its landing site looking for interesting rock features to study. I...


 


 

















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The beginning?

Those loooooooong C & Ps :_| :_|


 


Like I indicated before, they're obsessing about water. Had there been much water on the Planet, by now, they'd have found irrefutable evidence of sedimentary rocks to go along with other indications.


 


Flowing dust/sand and rounded pieces of rocks (Pebbles) only shows that the stuff has moved downwards = down a mountain/hill/slope.


 


Had there been a lot of water, there would be large rounded stones such as these :-http://www.kilgraney.com/Scottish%20Cobbles_WEB.jpg


 


With water worn stones, you find them ranging from rounded boulders, down through cobbles between 2 and 4 inches in size to pebbles and not only that, there would be a heck of a lot of 'em.


 


They need to present a proper argument for any large amount of water having been on Mars instead of clutching at every minor straw which might indicate what they WANT to find.



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Here's a chart showing "grain sizes":-


http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/e2/Wentworth-Grain-Size-Chart.pdf/page1-463px-Wentworth-Grain-Size-Chart.pdf.jpg


Although it would be fair to expect the fine stuff to have blown away by now, it would be reasonable to expect all the other sizes to be found in the same location if they're water worn.


 


 



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

The rivers I fish often vary in water height by several feet and in places have very unstable banks, regularly washing them away on one side and depositing stones on the other as well as pushing tons of stone downriver.


 


The size of the stones on the river bed is usually governed by the speed of the water, the faster the speed the bigger the stones, slack areas will have finer gravel or coarse silt.


 


If the water suddenly stopped, the different gradients of that river bed would be very obvious.

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The beginning?

Also, visualise the passing of time (= millions and millions of years) with no water at all, what would be left after the wind had taken its toll?



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Anonymous
Not applicable

hi CD, why should a planet like Mars not have water? even though Mars is half that of Earth, all the evidence so far shows that free flowing water did exist at least once in the planets evolution. water and water ice is evident in other places within our solar system. take Europa one of the main moons of the planet Jupiter and at about minus 230C the whole moon is one big ocean covered with a three or four mile crust of ice, and Europa is half the size of Mars. water ice has been found on our moon and most of Saturn's ring system are small bodies covered in water ice.


 


the real question should be where did all the water come from in the first place.


 

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The beginning?

There's no real reason why it didn't have ANY water, it's a question of how much it had.


 


With chemical/atmospheric/planetary/geological effects, you mix a couple of things together and produce something, mix them together in a different way with differing quantities/heat/pressure and you create something else.


 


Water's no different? Hydrogen on it's own burns? Oxygen aids combustion. Mix the two in the right proportions at the right temperature and pressure and what do you get?



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Presumably fine particles would be moved about, are the winds strong enough to create a sandblasting effect?


 


Apparently they have seen signs of imbrication, an effect which can readily be seen where the stones are flattish, they line up with the longer sides at the same angle against the flow.

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The beginning?

Time for some predictions about "the end of the World" (as we know it).


 


http://news.sky.com/story/1110337/life-on-earth-to-die-out-in-one-billion-years



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

😮


 


 


 


 


 


Sorry CD but lol.

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such anger,prejudice and hypocrisy on a simple forum supposed to be free for all. I wish you all you all wish for xx good bye
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The beginning?

Last night when I was out with the dog I was looking at the stars and remembered that our Galaxy (the Milky Way) will collide with Andromeda in about 4½ billion years.

 

I wonder if there will really be many collisions or whether the two galaxies will simply amalgamate?

 

In (enjoyable) times past on here, I once said "Matter is indestructible" and someone (I forget who) argued that you could destroy matter but never said how that would happen. Anyone want to take that up?



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Hi Cee Dee, it is an interesting question that, but

 

 

Today I had something again explained to me from the scriptures of the bible about how this system as we know it will be destroyed and a new heavens and a new earth set up in it's place.

 

You can read the book of Revelation and see how we are very near to that now.

 

The book explains about the time we are living in and it does coincide with world events right now.

 

I think this particular topic is a little bit more for here and now than the one about stars and planets colliding in 41/2 million years time, because it tells us how we can survive that catastrophic event.

 

The bible has prophesied that there will be a great tribulation to befall this world of ours beginning with World powers turning on religion (we know that to be false religions) to destroy it, the Bible even identifies the organisation that will do that, we, all of us know of the United Nations  well it is that, that will turn on false religion.

 

Surely the world events that are occurring now and the fact that the United Nations are playing a part in it, is testimony to the fact that the bible is correct. We can see with our own eyes that the world is getting to hate religion and wants it done.

 

So we won't need to worry about collisions between star and planets in million of years time.

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such anger,prejudice and hypocrisy on a simple forum supposed to be free for all. I wish you all you all wish for xx good bye
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The beginning?

Look, just WHO wrote the Bible and all the other scriptures claiming to represent the ultimate belief? MAN.

 

You can believe what you like, all the other believers in their version of what was, what is and what will be, claim they "know" that whatever they believe is "right".

 

They all can make vague "prophesies" about what might be and whatever happens they will claim "See, we told you.......".

 

In life, there is only ONE certain fact from which there's no escape and that is death. Everyone will die one day whether that's at three-score-years-and-ten, sooner or later, that will be IT.

 

You can fill many pages with ambiguous, vague claims and point to odd happenings that that seem to bear out what's been written but ask for a definite answer in response to a direct question and what will you get? A load of waffle! Not a direct answer anyway.

 

If there's one thing that will destroy the way of life we know it's going to be MAN fighting MAN over some half-baked ideological belief in the hereafter.

 

There's NO hereafter. When you're dead you're dead and that's it. Finit.

 

This thread was (note was) about The Beginning of the Universe, the beginning of our Solar System and with it the beginning of our Planet leading up to the possibility of the end of the Universe altogether. It was meant to be a discussion about that, the end of some Stars and their Planets if they have any and the birth of new Stars and possibly new Planets with them. That's a process which has been going on for billions of years and will continue for billions if not trillions of years to come.

 

Please allow this thread to continue along those lines and if you want to discuss Religion in any of it's forms, please start a new thread without continually disrupting this one?



It's life Jim, but not as WE know it.
Live long and prosper.

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The beginning?

Cee Dee

 

I do apologise if you feel that my contibutions are disruptive. They were not meant to be.

 

You state this thread is about the beginning of the universe and the end.

 

That is also exactly what I have been contributing too.

 

You have invited replies to that topic I have politely replied with my opinion on that very topic.

 

 

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such anger,prejudice and hypocrisy on a simple forum supposed to be free for all. I wish you all you all wish for xx good bye
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The beginning?

Hi Golden, maybe if we say the bible is a theory of events that may happen, as thats all we have ......theorys. no scientist can say for definate my theory is the way, its only as good untill a better one comes along.

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