Sir Jimmy Saville

[thecollectorssurplus]

No thread about this on here, so I thought I'd start one. 

My starter for ten is this: Okay, I'm not saying anybody is making anything up, but why did all these people wait till he was dead before accusing him of all this stuff? And quite frankly, now he's dead, what can come from it other than tarnishing a reputation that was spotless and upsetting his grieving family even further. Seems basically wrong to me. Why does someone always have to bring down our heroes and role models? They should have done what they're doing now ten years ago or not at all if you ask me.

Nick

[algasmoon]

So, if only Jehovas people are to be saved, then all Buddhists Hindus Jews Muslims Catholics and C of E, Pagans, Gnostics, Rastafarians, American Indian shamans, Taoists, Greek Orthadox, Russian Orthadox, and others I cant think of right now, are all expendable evil sinners regardless of their personal morals?  Or are they of another God? I guess as there is only one God to JWs the former must apply? Or will a good, peaceful Buddhist be allowed to survive the God squad massacre?  Im not being dense am I ? Genuinely interested to know.

To kill most of the people on earth and rejoice at being spared due to wearing the right badge seems to be the work of the unmentionable to me. Is this 'fear' put in the hearts of children something a nice and peaceful person would do ?

[stryver-1]

Hi Bargains, hope I'm not stepping on your toes, but this may give you more time to go canvassing. 😄

Algas and Creeky. The passage below may help you with your queries:

However, death is not the end of everything: each person can be remembered by God and eventually be resurrected.

Witnesses say that this is clearly stated by Jesus:

The hour is coming in which all those in the memorial tombs will hear [Jesus'] voice and come out, those who did good things to a resurrection of life, those who practiced vile things to a resurrection of judgment.

John 5:28-29

End times
Much of Witness belief concentrates on the 'End Times', and Witnesses have pointed to a number of past dates as Biblically significant, though they have not stated in terms when the end of the world, or 'conclusion of the system of things,' is expected.

Concerning that day and hour nobody knows, neither the angels of the heavens nor the Son, but only the Father.

Matthew 24:36

Witnesses believe that the end times started in 1914, but they realise that most human beings were unaware of this.

They believe that when 'the End' finally comes only 144,000 human beings will go to Heaven and rule the Earth from there with Christ - these are known as the anointed.

The anointed
Becoming an anointed person is not something that is done by voting or selection. Instead, the anointed one knows directly from God that he or she has been chosen.

Only those who feel themselves to be anointed partake of the bread and wine at the annual Memorial of Christ's death.

The majority of Jehovah's Witnesses are not anointed and will not spend eternity in heaven. They will spend eternity in paradise on Earth.

In fact not only Jehovah's Witnesses but billions of others will have everlasting life on earth and thus fulfil God's original plan for humanity when he put Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/religion/religions/witnesses/beliefs/beliefs.shtml

[algasmoon]

Hi there, that raises even more queries, but for example, here is one of the puzzles if you know the answer im genuinely interested.      "Jesus was God's first creation "

so...who made all the stuff that was here more than the 2000 odd years ago that he made his first creation ?

and so...right at the end of the above  .....fulfil God's original plan for humanity when he put Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.

ok, so Jesus was his first creation but didnt get put in the garden of eden as part of God's original plan? So Jesus was a kind of plan B ?  Once again, genuine interest im not taking the mick, how does anyone buy this?  I must have got it all wrong again

[bankhaunter]

It's hard to believe in a cult with a prediction failure rate of 100%.

It's hard to believe that mankind having existed for no more than the blink of an eye on a speck of dust suspended in a sunbeam and can be wiped out either by the instability of that speck or by vast cosmic events , is anything special.

[stryver-1]

Hi there, that raises even more queries, but for example, here is one of the puzzles if you know the answer im genuinely interested.      "Jesus was God's first creation "

so...who made all the stuff that was here more than the 2000 odd years ago that he made his first creation ?

and so...right at the end of the above  .....fulfil God's original plan for humanity when he put Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.

ok, so Jesus was his first creation but didnt get put in the garden of eden as part of God's original plan? So Jesus was a kind of plan B ?  Once again, genuine interest im not taking the mick, how does anyone buy this?  I must have got it all wrong again

Hi algas, I'm not a JW, nor do I know their philosophy/belief on your questions. Next time one knocks on your door maybe you could ask them. . .

My philosophy is to let all believers, or non-believers get on with their faith or lack of faith. I posted the link because I was curious about the 144,000 (the anointed). Which you and Creeky, I think, had referred to.

[stryver-1]

It's hard to believe in a cult with a prediction failure rate of 100%.

It's hard to believe that mankind having existed for no more than the blink of an eye on a speck of dust suspended in a sunbeam and can be wiped out either by the instability of that speck or by vast cosmic events , is anything special.

I find the analogy above rather pointless - because for example say the earh was a billion time larger, or mankind had been living for billions of years it would still ring true!

[**forum-decorum**]

Thank you stryver for posting that link in #261

The BBC seems to have explained things well.

Funny I had onlyjust read that one the other day.

Algsmoon :-x

Hi there, that raises even more queries, but for example, here is one of the puzzles if you know the answer im genuinely interested.     "Jesus was God's first creation "

so...who made all the stuff that was here more than the 2000 odd years ago that he made his first creation ?

Jesus was Jehovahs first creation yes, all other things were made by him for Jehovah. Jesus was made a spirit creature many many (no one knows how man)y could be billions of years before the 2,000 you are thinking of.

and so...right at the end of the above  .....fulfil God's original plan for humanity when he put Adam and Eve in the Garden of Eden.

ok, so Jesus was his first creation but didnt get put in the garden of eden as part of God's original plan? So Jesus was a kind of plan B ?  Once again, genuine interest im not taking the mick, how does anyone buy this?  I must have got it all wrong again

Jesus humbled himself to become a lesser being a man and agreed to Jehovahs requirement to come down to give his life as a ransom sacrifice because of Adam and Eves disobedience, so there was no requirement or need for Jesus to be put into the garden before that. He was a great spirit creature.

[jimbo1lee]

Having seen various pictures of Adam, & Eve, how come they BOTH have belly buttons,????  ?:|

[algasmoon]

Stryver 264  I have actually asked them various things, Im genuinely interested in belief systems religions and cults, but when asked something, they hand me a leaflet, look at me as if they feel sorry for me and leave with a wistful smile of secret knowledge, which of course is universal language for 'havent a clue' ' does not compute'

[**forum-decorum**]

 I have actually asked them various things, Im genuinely interested in belief systems

Algasmoon, if you are genuinely interested in having answers to your questions I will be happy to try and answer anything you wish to ask.

I will be perfectly honest with you and will tell you if I cannot personally recall an answer to mind, in which case if you should wish to allow me to research anything I am unable to answer personally I will happily find out the answer for you.

That also is offered to anyone else too.

[stryver-1]

Stryver 264  I have actually asked them various things, Im genuinely interested in belief systems religions and cults, but when asked something, they hand me a leaflet, look at me as if they feel sorry for me and leave with a wistful smile of secret knowledge, which of course is universal language for 'havent a clue' ' does not compute'

Hi algas, I have a friend who is an ex-JW he has an answer for everything theological . Mind you he has studied scripture all his adult life! By and large most JWs will give you answer and if they don't know they will ask an Elder for help and guidance.

BTW, never refer to someone's faith as a "cult" most will take offence. 🙂

[bankhaunter]

JWs are a cult.

Check the definitions both theological and to some degree sociological

[treefrog6352]

If it's coming from any public funded body - the BBC being one.

'The detectives are being paid anyway' 

Yes, by a public funded body - encluding overtime.

It will be paid by the BBC's public liability insurance. not the taxpayer!!!!

[**forum-decorum**]

It will be paid by the BBC's public liability insurance. not the taxpayer!!!!

Why should it be just the BBC's insurance, that picks up the bill?

This horrible character has commited atrocities all over the country, not just in the BBC.

[upthecreekyetagain]

In which case it will be other insurers.

[joe_bloggs*]

Operation Fairbank, the Met  Police investigation, started after allegations from  Labour  MP  Tom Watson of an alleged paedo ring involving  Westminster MPs, has taken a significant new turn.

Basically documents, including a list of Mps , Conservative, Labour and Liberal - some dead, some alive – and other prominent figures , which we have seen but are not naming, are now in the possession of the police. They also have the 16 names of the boys who  could have been sexually abused.
The raid last week on the flat of Mary Moss, a former head of the now defunct National Association of Young People in Care, allowed police to look at documents relating to the Elm Tree Guest House in Barnes, west London, in the 1980s. Police obtained a search warrant after she declined to co-operate but she is now co-operating fully with the investigation.

The police have also asked Richmond Council to hand over a full dossier of young people in their care at the time after being alerted by a source who came to Exaro.

http://davidhencke.wordpress.com/

[tommy.irene]

BBC, employer of the terminally inadequate, today showed a 12 year old episode of children's programme, Tweenies, complete with a blatant Jimmy Saville character..........

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...my-Savile.html

It would be funny, were it not so bloody sad. w...

[the-attic2009]

Well worth a listen to.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QNelt33QP_8&feature=player_embedded

[joe_bloggs*]

2/2/2013

Papers seized by police name the man who helped turn a guesthouse into a paedophile brothel allegedly used by MP's  and other VIP's.

It comes as detectives interview victims,and prepare to make initial arrests and lay charges as part of "Operation Fernbridge" - Within weeks

http://www.exaronews.com/articles/4826/files-reveal-who-turned-elm-guest-house-into-paedo-brothel

[cee-dee]

A long link to an open news report on the same subject:-

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2272253/Timebomb-Elm-Guest-House-Pop-stars-bishop-politician-appear-list-seized-police-investigating-child-abuse-London-hotel-1980s.html#axzz2Jmr4Qa74